point of a survival kit?

B

BCpete

Guest
In the past ive had a few kits made up by me but was thinking about it and thought if you have your main kit such as, possibles pouch which contains small FAK, penknife, firesteel, etc..., your knife, if you have a folding saw which i think many of us do, (i keep mine in my pocket becasue its super light:D) so my needs are covered really with a good knife and a good saw and the possibles pouch.

Also your main pack,however much you carry in litres depens of personal preference but everything you needs there, from shelter to cooking, you've got it!

so my main question is, why do people carry a survival tin when they have personal carry and their pack, and ive heard all the reasons why you should carry a specialised survival tin but i just cant understand why you would, and the chances of loosing your pack on a fast flowing river or accidently drop it off a cliff is a million to one, or would you class a possibles pouch as a survival kit to fall back on?

im not ranting at anyone at all, i was just wondering:S

cheers,

pete
 

HillBill

Bushcrafter through and through
Oct 1, 2008
8,166
159
W. Yorkshire
I have often wondered the same myself. A survival tin is supposed to be one of those things you have in a car or on you when your main kit isn't. TBH in this country a survival tin is superfluous to requirements. A Phone generally is your best survival tool. followed closely by your legs, then vehicle. The only time the above wouldn't be the best is if for example you fell and broke your leg in a place with no phone signal or you broke your phone in the fall. But even then one little tin won't matter either. If your in a situation where this happened then you were likely climbing or hiking somewhere remote and therefore would have your pack with all the proper gear in.

:confused:
 

Barn Owl

Old Age Punk
Apr 10, 2007
8,246
7
58
Ayrshire
Survival kit in the UK...

Tell someone where you're going and due back,

Whistle and light to show MR. or whatever.

If none of the above help then you shouldn't be out on your own.

If your a bushcrafter then you've nothing to worry about unless you've broken a limb or such...see above as to why you carry a torch and whistle...
 

Pict

Settler
Jan 2, 2005
611
1
Central Brazil
clearblogs.com
I tend to be much more aware of keeping the essentials on my person when in the bush in Brazil than when I'm here in the eastern US. Here It is a rare thing not to have a cell phone signal. In Brazil if things go bad they will go very bad and you truly are on your own.

I have yet to lose my pack here or there and the possibles pouch stays in my pack most of the time. That possibles pouch is very complete and mainly serves to keep me from having to remember to pack something essential. Keeping the PSK in the pocket is a good habit to get into. After all, it is small and well thought out so you won't be tempted to leave it at home or in camp.

I have spent many, many days in the bush exploring away from camp. Often I will cache my pack in a good location and explore with what I need for the day. The PSK gives me a layer of redundancy. Every so often I walk off into the bush with a plan for my day only to find out that the bush has other plans. Mac
 

wizard

Nomad
Jan 13, 2006
472
2
77
USA
Personally, I learned to carry a small survival kit in the military, something that can be handy if you drop the rucksack and possibly the webbing. I do think that many items found in commercial survival kits are based on military ideas. I know items like a button compass can be handy but in reality it was supposed to be used for general direction by somone escaping or evading the enemy. The thought was you could swallow it if capture seemed near and retreive it later. Quite.
Other items like wire saws were better than no saw at all and meant to be a part of the smallest kit possible. I do not carry a button compass or a wire saw today.

For my normal treks, either dayhikes or longer trips I really do not take a survival kit as such. I have 3 types of fire lighting, a knife or two, a poncho, paracord, whistle, signal mirror and a water container with a stainless steel cup for boiling/drinking.
On overnight trips I have a shelter of some sort, sleeping bag, pad. etc. It would be unnecessary weight to take a big survival kit too.

My thoughts anyway. Cheers
 

drewdunnrespect

On a new journey
Aug 29, 2007
4,788
2
teesside
www.drewdunnrespect.com
personally i carry most of the gear i need in my ruck sack and dont have a survival kit reason for it is i dont really get that far away from camp that i one would need one and to most of the camps are either moots or meets so dont need one. The only other place i go is in the woods out the back of me and if the worse came to the worst i would just walk or crawl or phone home. The thing is tho that if i was on experdition or in the wilderness for real I.E middle of aussie bush i would have a kit on me at all times cos well its dangerouse not to i would say.

drew
 

Mastino

Settler
Mar 8, 2006
651
1
61
Netherlands
No PSK here, although I must say that developing and maintaining one is a good form of mental excercise and a kind of skill/experience test. And if everything goes as it should the kit must be shrinking:D There is no reason to assume a SERE scenario in Europe these days.

What I find useful is some car based kit that covers events like huge traffic jams (e.g. in case of snow/storm) and fast evacuation. So basically FAK, some tools, shelter, food & water.

In terms of EDC I carry a phone, whistle, little firesteel, small led torch & Spyderco Cricket. In my jacket a small FAK.
 

BlueTrain

Nomad
Jul 13, 2005
482
0
78
Near Washington, D.C.
I don't have any particular specialized survival kit myself, given as how I no longer seem to venture more than about 20 miles from home, which is, in fact, how far my job is. I'm really doing fewer outings because I'm trying to cut down on my driving. However, I think I would include things that would be the most difficult to do without or to substitute for. It isn't very dramatic but a pot of some sort is way up there on my list. Currently, any pot that will accomodate those pre-cooked, pre-packaged meals which are curiously similar to army rations will do and the most efficient size happens to be a British army or similiar mess tin, the larger one of the set. For that purpose it is unecessarily thick but it holds up well and dents can easily be hammered out.
 

Shewie

Mod
Dec 15, 2005
24,259
26
49
Yorkshire
Not had a baccy tin full of junk since I was about 12 years old, don't see the point. It's not as though I'm going to become separated from my pack in this country for any great length of time.
The only thing I like to have in an emergency is a means of lighting a fire, my ferro rod in my knife sheath will do fine for that.
 
Oct 6, 2008
495
0
Cheshire
In the uk a survival kit should be what you need upon your person to ensure you stay alive long enough to be rescued / walk out .

Good clothing will do that in the vast majority of cases. Add to that items to aid you being found ( a small light , a whistle) and you pretty much have it covered.

On my keys I have a mini multitool, a small photon type torch, a whistle, a peanut lighter , oh and some keys. Anything else is just fluff.

A baccy tin with fishhooks on it, snare wire etc etc is very nice and I have no problem with those interested in putting one together, but in the uk I just don't see the point. How often is someone trapped in the wild in the UK long enough to need to forage for food? Maintaining body temperature and hydration is far more important.
 

Hoodoo

Full Member
Nov 17, 2003
5,302
13
Michigan, USA
A survival kit should fit the needs of the situation where you think you will need it. In a wilderness canoe trip, the chances of getting separated from your canoe, for instance, are far greater than you might think, especially in whitewater. However, in the urban or suburban environment, your chances of needing to start a campfire would be greatly diminished. :lmao: My urban mini survival kit includes antacids, needle and thread, spare buttons, a whistle, money, chapstick, duct tape, mini flashlight, mini bic lighter, safety pins, a small epoxy packet, a small stick of hot glue, wire, razor blade, pencil, paper, and safety pins.

Survival kits are about forethought.
 
This article was no written for this forum, but it should fit in okay. I have always thought on the same lines as BCpete, my usual gear that I carry in the woods is my survival kit.

© Le Loup, Wychwood Forest, MSF 2007, Armidale 2350.
18th Century Historical Trekking-How Little Should We Carry?
What sort of scenario do you construct for 18th century Historical Trekking? A Peter Kalm scenario where you are simply travelling the countryside, or perhaps as a scout or part of a militia, a trained band. How much do we know about what these people carried ? Diaries rarely tell us anything about clothing, equipment or foods taken on the journey. Although I think some people in the 18th century thought much the same as some of us in this century, I think the early woodsmen in the colonial New World thought differently when it comes to survival.
When I think of wilderness survival I think of the barest equipment I can get away with, making a compromise between minimum weight and maximum self-reliance, but does this still means that I end up carrying more items than a woodsman in the 18th century would have? Let us examine an average militia list in the 18th century and see how we compare.
1. "Each soldier to provide himself with a good fire arm, a steel or iron ram rod and a spring for same, a worm, a priming wire and brush, a bayonet fitted to his gun, a scabbard and belt thereof, a cutting sword or tomahawk or hatchet, a . . .cartridge box holding fifteen rounds . . . at least, a hundred buckshot, six flints, one pound of powder, forty leaden balls fitted to the gun, a knapsack and blanket, [and] a canteen or wooden bottle to hold one quart [of water]" (Journal of Arthur Harris of the Bridgewater Coy of Militia.)
1) Fusil or musket.
2) Worm, priming wire and pan brush.
3) Tomahawk or hatchet.
4) Belly-box holding 15 rounds in paper cartridges.
5) 100 buckshot.
6) 6 gun flints.
7) One pound of gunpowder in a powder horn.
8) 40 round ball in a shot pouch.
9) A knapsack.
10) Blanket roll.
11) Water bottle or leather Costrel.
If I am a woodsman not doing duty in the militia, I would substitute the 15 cartridges and belly-box for a pouch of bird-shot. Now obviously by looking at this list we must assume that other personal items were probably carried beside what is on this list, let’s look at some of those items.

1) A belt knife or butcher knife (Mentioned as a requirement in some militia lists).
2) A clasp knife (Some militia requirements include a “jackknife”).
3) A tinderbox, flint and steel.
4) A turn screw and pin punch (Required to remove gun lock and barrel).
5) A greased leather lock cover.
6) A cup and perhaps a spirit flask.
7) Spare tinder in a gunpowder wallet.
8) Needle and linen thread and sinew for moccasin repairs.
9) An awl
10) Soap and comb (Record of purchases in Baynton & Wharton trade papers).
11) A haversack or food bag (Mentioned in some lists of militia requirements).
12) Provisions (food).

The above must surely be basic needs, but what of the other items that I would naturally think of taking into a wilderness situation? Can I justify these other items, or did the 18th century woodsman or militia man go without, just assume that if something went wrong he would be able to survive anyway. What do you think?
1) A small brass trade kettle. Some one in the militia, possibly one in every four men, would probably carry a kettle for cooking food and perhaps brewing tea. But would a woodsman carry a kettle?
2) Spare gun lock parts, springs and a main spring vice.
3) Ball and shot moulds and lead.
4) Spare pair of moccasins.
I carry these items also, but can I justify carrying them?
Militia food supplies.
George Washington to Robert Dinwiddie, Winchester, November 9, 1756.
"Allowance for each man, as other soldiers do, they look upon as the highest indignity, and would sooner starve, than carry a few days' provision on their backs for conveniency".

The men were issued salt pork, biscuit, and West India Rum, or were given the cash equivalent if they chose to procure their own food. Various journals kept by the men make constant references to hunting and fishing, so the option of keeping the cash and eating fresh food instead of salt pork was apparently exercised often.
http://www.geocities.com/Yosemite/Rapids/5776/goffe.htm
“I gave orders to them to go home and fetch their arms whether guns, swords, pitchforks, axes or whatsoever might be of use against the enemy and for three days provision in their knapsacks”. (Early 18th century).
 

Tank

Full Member
Aug 10, 2009
2,015
287
Witney, Oxfordshire
I think a survival kit is there for when you need it and only works if its suited for what your doing.

I have grown up on a sawmill and worked there for several years while in school/college/uni and i have worked down the wood and some of the guys who often have a tin on them,
most of the things they have isnt going to save there lives by keeping them alive for days, but they may stop the day being a waste of time by being able to do a temporary repair on some equipment and stop them having to go back to the yard to get something to do the job.

and down the woods were we work its hard to get a phone signal, so a tube of super glue and a needle and thread is a back up in case they get a bad cut from the chainsaw, many things can go wrong in a days work.

So a survival tin may not always be a tin to save your life but it could be there to save your day when you need it.

hope that made seen..

PS, i work in IT in an office and the only survival tin i have is a tin of coke :)
 

Lupin Rider

Full Member
Mar 15, 2009
290
0
uk
Interestingly I was on a "business travel" training course last weekrun by ex SF chaps from a security consultancy contractor who specialises in a variety of things from training to close protection in hostile countries.

One recommendation was that you should always have a psk containing at absolute minimum of a torch, whistle on your key ring, tough cut scissors so you can cut anything inc seatbelts / make bandages, and a litre of water. they reckoned if it hit the fan then 1litre would last a week if you were static. metal cased biro was handy at times as well.

if you had space for more then a more detailed first aid kit (superglue, immodium, paracetamol, ibruoprofen, plasters, some puri tabs). little food / snickers etc.

only use a thinned down wallet that you are happy to give away and memorise ten key numbers.

many of us couldnt even inventory the contents of our wallets and since the invent of the mobile some didnt even know their home numbers, let alone medical insurance policy or passport numbers.

big fan of the leather belt (clearly we are all for stropping) but one of the storys was that of a lady on the tube bombing who saved her own life by using her belt to tornique her leg.

some paracord made most lists and always physically walk your fire exit routes on arrival any where.

i could go on but it is a bit of a tangent...
 
Best survival kit is in your head, but i'm going to echo other comments here and say it doesn't matter what's in your survival kit if you don't tailor it for where you're going. On long car trips, I take at least a litre of water in my pack, and will often leave my Trangia, brew kit, and an FAK with the vehicle. If i'm in an unfamiliar or non 1st world country, I will carry a more competent FAK/Medical Emergency kit in case of emergencies. I almost always carry fire making equipment, but it's difficult to legally carry a knife in the UK for any reason these days.
 
B

BCpete

Guest
I like the sound of an everyday type kit for the woods and urban environments, where you could have some basic first aid such as superglue, paracetamol and a few different sized plasters etc...also a SAK something like a farmer which could be used for both urban and for rural environments, as well something that'd be very useful would be a small repairs kit for your tarp or bike if traveling a long way, i sure would'nt want to be dripped on in the middle of the night:lmao:

pete
 

Brown Bear

Forager
May 12, 2009
129
0
Cambridge
I used to be into small survival tins as a boy but don't really see the need. If you are near civilisation (as you are in most of the developed world) and get lost, you won't have the need or the time to use snare wires, fishing lines etc before you are found or walk to help. You will survive with suitable clothing, a credit card and a mobile phone.

If you are properly out in the wilderness, you should have a lot more than a baccy tin with you. So with your full sulf sufficiency kit, the tin is redundant. If you are worried about loosing your rucksack, keep the essential items about your person.
 

HillBill

Bushcrafter through and through
Oct 1, 2008
8,166
159
W. Yorkshire
No PSK here, although I must say that developing and maintaining one is a good form of mental excercise and a kind of skill/experience test. And if everything goes as it should the kit must be shrinking:D There is no reason to assume a SERE scenario in Europe these days.

What I find useful is some car based kit that covers events like huge traffic jams (e.g. in case of snow/storm) and fast evacuation. So basically FAK, some tools, shelter, food & water.

In terms of EDC I carry a phone, whistle, little firesteel, small led torch & Spyderco Cricket. In my jacket a small FAK.

I also have a car kit. Rat pack, water, messtins. Fleece blanket, axe, torch etc. I have never had to use any of it yet though.
 

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