Realistically do we carry only the smallest, lightest and fewest items that you might need, or do you carry a regular load as a habit and learn to cope with the added volume and weight?
just a thought
just a thought
What to carry?
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From a pesonal point of view I tend to carry a regular load, it is safer in the long run and means that if the situation should change then I am prepared for it 
out of a nasty habbit i am always carrying more clothes than i need.. bit for the most part my kit is pretty minimal.. if i have a long way to go then i will attempt to shed more weight.. but i must admit if i dont have far to walk then i do carry things which are non-essential and make camp life a little more luxurious..
leon-1 said:From a pesonal point of view I tend to carry a regular load, it is safer in the long run and means that if the situation should change then I am prepared for it
Yeah me too I try to keep the weight down but always have a backup :biggthump
I have two packs I use. My small "survival pack" is kept light on purpose it ranges from 12 - 20 lbs depending on the time of year and where I'm going. I've been on winter hunting trips and carried as much as 70 lbs for four days. That is too much weight but living in Brazil when I get the chance to winter camp I have to use borrowed stuff and make do.
After every trip I take I make a list of the items I actually used, the things I didn't use and won't leave without, and the stuff I lugged around for no reason. I don't carry much in the way of extra clothes. I carry day clothes that get filthy and night clothes that stay warm and fluffy in a dry bag. I do wash my clothes in the bush as needed, especially my socks.
I do gamble with the weather, especially here in Brazil where it is very predictable. I wouldn't try that in other places where there could be a wide swing in temps and conditions. The computer is a great aid for lightening your pack. I check the weather for the last few years on the particular week I'm planning to be in an area and pack for the typical worst. Mac
After every trip I take I make a list of the items I actually used, the things I didn't use and won't leave without, and the stuff I lugged around for no reason. I don't carry much in the way of extra clothes. I carry day clothes that get filthy and night clothes that stay warm and fluffy in a dry bag. I do wash my clothes in the bush as needed, especially my socks.
I do gamble with the weather, especially here in Brazil where it is very predictable. I wouldn't try that in other places where there could be a wide swing in temps and conditions. The computer is a great aid for lightening your pack. I check the weather for the last few years on the particular week I'm planning to be in an area and pack for the typical worst. Mac
Because of the variety of gear that I carry to meet the variety of reasons of why I'm in the bush to begin with, weight and bulk are both of primary concern and in order to get my gear to where it works for me, I do without many of the manufactured creature comforts that many campers and hikers tend to carry with them. Instead, I try to create my comforts from available resources and what little gear I carry, when I get to where I'm going.
My load changes with task and location, that said I do like to carry a certain amount of weight on short trips just to keep the legs exercised.
At the moment I carry a regular load because I'm still learning about what to use and how to use it. I would like in the future to carry less, because although the stuff I have at the moment is 'carryable' I definately wouldn't want to go walking long distances with it on my back, and I would like to go treking at some stage in the future.
Saying that, I am happy that I don't pack in great excess, I'm just not as happy or as comfortable carrying a weight as others might be.
Saying that, I am happy that I don't pack in great excess, I'm just not as happy or as comfortable carrying a weight as others might be.
Really depends where I am going, if just a walk on the moor I'll take a day sack with water proofs in it, mainly as this is a good way to carry the knife when on the way to the countryside, and give me a place to stuff all the things I gather. Also I don't drive so I have to make absolutely sure noone can get to the knife easily and I do not think it wise to walk in an urban area with a knife strapped to your belt, (having it concealed on your person (like around your neck) is in my humble opinion asking for trouble also).
For longer trips in familiar territory, I carry only what is needed (gained through experience) but for unfamiliar territory, I tend to take the kitchen sink, just in case!
Greg
For longer trips in familiar territory, I carry only what is needed (gained through experience) but for unfamiliar territory, I tend to take the kitchen sink, just in case!
Greg
Alot depends on where I'm going and why?
An overnight trip in woods I know well I'll carry the basics, hammock, basha, sleeping bag or blanket and billy can plus bits and pieces like a knife and fire starting kit.
For a prospecting trip in Scotland, It's the big bag: as I need to carry things like geological hammer, chisels, shovel, sieve and pan plus alot more food as the trip will be for at least ten days and sometimes well away from any habitation. 70Lbs is not difficult to end up with and even though the food gets used up it tends to get replaced with rock samples so it's likely to be at least as heavy when I come back.
An overnight trip in woods I know well I'll carry the basics, hammock, basha, sleeping bag or blanket and billy can plus bits and pieces like a knife and fire starting kit.
For a prospecting trip in Scotland, It's the big bag: as I need to carry things like geological hammer, chisels, shovel, sieve and pan plus alot more food as the trip will be for at least ten days and sometimes well away from any habitation. 70Lbs is not difficult to end up with and even though the food gets used up it tends to get replaced with rock samples so it's likely to be at least as heavy when I come back.
I'm a gear junkie - I tent to like carrying things that will make me more comfortable... I know I can fabricate things to make me comfortable but I like to have them with me.
It depends also if I'm alone or with company... if I'm alone, I tend to take only what's needed but with others I tend to take a little more.
It depends also if I'm alone or with company... if I'm alone, I tend to take only what's needed but with others I tend to take a little more.
Kwe CJ,
I'm always changing... Sometimes I'll just go with a knife, fire steel and water bottle. Some other times I'll pick my full blown kit with billy can, tea and everything else. I have still to find the good compromise between "kit" and "no kit", which, ideally, should be "just enough kit"...
I this neverending quest, I try to answer those simple questions :
- what will I do ?
- how long will I stay ?
- what are the predictable risks ?
In doing so, I manage to be able to assess most of my needs in the situations... leaving the "wants" at home.
I always fail. I'm always carrying too much or too little...
Cheers,
David
I'm always changing... Sometimes I'll just go with a knife, fire steel and water bottle. Some other times I'll pick my full blown kit with billy can, tea and everything else. I have still to find the good compromise between "kit" and "no kit", which, ideally, should be "just enough kit"...
I this neverending quest, I try to answer those simple questions :
- what will I do ?
- how long will I stay ?
- what are the predictable risks ?
In doing so, I manage to be able to assess most of my needs in the situations... leaving the "wants" at home.
I always fail. I'm always carrying too much or too little...
Cheers,
David
Similar to Gary, my load out changes depending on what I'm doing, but I try to carry minimal kit plus a safety margin as I've done the 120L-pack-for-weekend-camp routine and I'd rather use the energy wasted in carrying stuff that I don't need to actually enjoy the place I'm going.
But as said, I still carry emergency stuff - US poncho and liner, etc., just to be safe.
But as said, I still carry emergency stuff - US poncho and liner, etc., just to be safe.
Here’s a few things I do to keep the excess flab out of my pack.
EVALUATE AND WEIGH EACH ITEM – Keep track of what was used and want was not and weigh the items. Place the unused items in a pile and evaluate them ruthlessly.
FOOD – You need far less of it than you think. I only pack dry food if I have it available. Boil in the bag rice and instant oatmeal are favorites. If you do pack a heavy food item make sure it is also a high calorie item. Carbohydrates are light and yield high energy.
WATER – Don’t lug it around if God has already made it available. If He loves me enough to dribble the stuff everywhere I need to trust Him. Always carry enough containers to load up a full day’s supply if necessary. I carry two 2-liter Platypus bags.
PERSONAL HYGIENE ITEMS – I once had a first timer show up for a 4-day summer trip with a forty-five pound pack. You would have thought he had a hot date out there! He had raided his bathroom for a full bottle of shampoo, aftershave, deodorant, toothpaste, etc. Think “airline” size if you take it at all. I carry a small bar of soap and a tiny toothpaste tube. Nobody has complained so far. (BTW this same guy had an entire billy-club sized pepperoni that he insisted on carrying and he actually ate all of it!)
EXTRA CLOTHES – I just plan on my clothes getting dirty. After three days or so I’ll wash them and dry them quickly by a fire. Typically I’ll wear a set of OD fatigues, and pack a long sleeve T-shirt, light shorts, and a fleece top. If it’s cold I’ll also pack a pair of sweat pants. Never carry wet clothes, dry them first if possible to cut out the weight.
COOKING – I cook everything in a single US Army canteen cup now and eat it with a plastic MRE spoon. I know, I could carve a spoon but the US Government has spent umpteen millions of dollars of my tax money designing the perfect spoon. How could I eat off of anything less?
BLADES – This one is a real problem. I love steel. A 12-inch Ontario machete and Air Force Survival knife weigh about twice as much as a 10-inch Tramontina and Mora SWAK. If I don’t need the magnum steel the lighter stuff makes the trip. If you are going out in a group then carry the necessary cutlery distributed among the members and share as needed.
FLASHLIGHT – Never carry a D cell light when a AA light will do. The AA light is now outclassed by the little LED. For spotting animals at night I sometimes carry a Surefire Z2. The Nitrolon carries the same 65 lumen lamp in a plastic housing further cutting weight. Ninety percent of my need for light is covered by a tiny Inova night vision red LED that I hang on a string around my neck.
FIREARMS (sorry to all the UK readers but I just had to throw this one in) A 230-grain .45 or .44 slug weighs twice as much as a 115-grain 9mm or 125 grain .357 slug. A polymer frame Glock 17 weighs as much fully loaded as an aluminum frame Berretta 92 empty. I love my 1911A1 .45 but the Glock 19 makes more sense when considering weight. The lowly .22 is by far the most weight efficient firearm for survival hunting.
A polymer frame .22 target pistol is close to perfect.
BODY FAT – Don’t neglect the system that has to lug all this kit around! This is really the first place you should try to lighten your load. If you loose ten pounds of body fat through exercise you will be able to carry more than ten pounds of extra kit with less effort. You will have gained muscle in the process. I used to weigh 225 lbs, got a wake-up call from a physical therapist and joined a gym. I got down to a solid 185. To reward myself I went on a backpacking trip. The day I weighed my pack I stepped onto the scale wearing 25 lbs of kit and the scale read 210 lbs. That was fifteen pounds under my previous weight in my shorts. Lard is heavy! Mac
EVALUATE AND WEIGH EACH ITEM – Keep track of what was used and want was not and weigh the items. Place the unused items in a pile and evaluate them ruthlessly.
FOOD – You need far less of it than you think. I only pack dry food if I have it available. Boil in the bag rice and instant oatmeal are favorites. If you do pack a heavy food item make sure it is also a high calorie item. Carbohydrates are light and yield high energy.
WATER – Don’t lug it around if God has already made it available. If He loves me enough to dribble the stuff everywhere I need to trust Him. Always carry enough containers to load up a full day’s supply if necessary. I carry two 2-liter Platypus bags.
PERSONAL HYGIENE ITEMS – I once had a first timer show up for a 4-day summer trip with a forty-five pound pack. You would have thought he had a hot date out there! He had raided his bathroom for a full bottle of shampoo, aftershave, deodorant, toothpaste, etc. Think “airline” size if you take it at all. I carry a small bar of soap and a tiny toothpaste tube. Nobody has complained so far. (BTW this same guy had an entire billy-club sized pepperoni that he insisted on carrying and he actually ate all of it!)
EXTRA CLOTHES – I just plan on my clothes getting dirty. After three days or so I’ll wash them and dry them quickly by a fire. Typically I’ll wear a set of OD fatigues, and pack a long sleeve T-shirt, light shorts, and a fleece top. If it’s cold I’ll also pack a pair of sweat pants. Never carry wet clothes, dry them first if possible to cut out the weight.
COOKING – I cook everything in a single US Army canteen cup now and eat it with a plastic MRE spoon. I know, I could carve a spoon but the US Government has spent umpteen millions of dollars of my tax money designing the perfect spoon. How could I eat off of anything less?
BLADES – This one is a real problem. I love steel. A 12-inch Ontario machete and Air Force Survival knife weigh about twice as much as a 10-inch Tramontina and Mora SWAK. If I don’t need the magnum steel the lighter stuff makes the trip. If you are going out in a group then carry the necessary cutlery distributed among the members and share as needed.
FLASHLIGHT – Never carry a D cell light when a AA light will do. The AA light is now outclassed by the little LED. For spotting animals at night I sometimes carry a Surefire Z2. The Nitrolon carries the same 65 lumen lamp in a plastic housing further cutting weight. Ninety percent of my need for light is covered by a tiny Inova night vision red LED that I hang on a string around my neck.
FIREARMS (sorry to all the UK readers but I just had to throw this one in) A 230-grain .45 or .44 slug weighs twice as much as a 115-grain 9mm or 125 grain .357 slug. A polymer frame Glock 17 weighs as much fully loaded as an aluminum frame Berretta 92 empty. I love my 1911A1 .45 but the Glock 19 makes more sense when considering weight. The lowly .22 is by far the most weight efficient firearm for survival hunting.
A polymer frame .22 target pistol is close to perfect.
BODY FAT – Don’t neglect the system that has to lug all this kit around! This is really the first place you should try to lighten your load. If you loose ten pounds of body fat through exercise you will be able to carry more than ten pounds of extra kit with less effort. You will have gained muscle in the process. I used to weigh 225 lbs, got a wake-up call from a physical therapist and joined a gym. I got down to a solid 185. To reward myself I went on a backpacking trip. The day I weighed my pack I stepped onto the scale wearing 25 lbs of kit and the scale read 210 lbs. That was fifteen pounds under my previous weight in my shorts. Lard is heavy! Mac
ChrisKavanaugh
Need to contact Admin...
I don't know who drives me nuttier, minimalist hikers or people trying to replicate the gear hauled up the Chilcoot pass under the watchfull eye of the N.W.M.P. As an archaeologist and bushcrafter, I am forever fascinated by Oetzi. I recently updated his kit, remembering his local, the fact he probably never travelled very far from his valley and probably was driven into the higher mountains by his antagonists. The results were intriguing. Clothing: Mukluks and socks, wool longjohns, pants and shirt, beaver fur trooper's hat, canvas anorak, Dachstein mittens. Backpack: my german army day rucksack. Kit: Mora knife, Wetterling axe, diamond hone plate, metal match,hacksaw striker and prepared tinder and a few ziplok baggies. First Aid: Aspirin, moleskin, a few large bandages (plasters.) Food: jerky ,pilot bread ( biscuits) and dehydrated cherries. Primary weapon: SMLE with 30 rounds ammunition. Like Oetzi, I should have no trouble encountering hostile antagonists :shock:
ChrisKavanaugh
Need to contact Admin...
A recent program looked at Oetzi through the eyes of a forensic police officer - perhaps the oldest 'cold case' file to date. It would appear Oetzi killed two of his protagonists and carried a companion some distance according to the blood splatters on his arrows, knife and backpack. This saddened me somehow. His home village probably held at best 40-60 people. For people to allready be in conflict over resources, game, his copper axe or other issues lost in time saddens me. In one of my archaeology classes we had to write a paper choosing which era, culture we would like to have been part of. I chose the upper paleolithic reindeer hunters of western europe. It would have been something watching those animals being painted at Lascaux etc.
even when only out for a day I carry a3day type kit ,heres the reason , if I want to stay out overnite I have the kit to do so. the flexability this allows more than makes up for the extra weight,[ at least it does for me.] I probobly carry more kit than most but flexability is my primary concern, [ better to have it and not need it , than the other way around]. I have never been sorry for this approach to date.
Yeah, and he was killed by an arrow in the back, severing a brachial artery... if I remember correctly.ChrisKavanaugh said:
Life seemed somewhat rough over there.
I think our whole "survival" stuff is paint on a cracked wall. Those guys' survival concerns were still, unfortunately, killing or be killed (other guys or game...). They were fighting all the time, like mankind always did and probably always will. Ootzi was maybe considered like a terrorist by the guys who shot him in the back. Maybe they did so as a pre-emptive action...
Maybe he stole a hat to someone. Maybe he had too much fun with the chief's daughter... We homo sapiens sapiens easily find reasons to beat the s... out of each other. Neural structures or hormonal stuff, probably. That allowed us to destroy many things... one of which is doubt and uncertainty. A brain able to do abstract things such as to define anything as a truth is, by itself, a pandora box smashed open.
Cheers,
David
For a day trip I carry either a survival vest kit or a small kit in my daypack, I'll then throw in an sweater, extra pr of socks, extra water (usually a 1 quart bottle), and food...rain gear if it looks like it's going to be needed. So basically 6-10 pounds.
If I am going overnight I take full shelter (tent or tarp), sleeping bag, etc.
For several nights out it's just a matter of adding more food and maybe 2 extra pairs of socks.
They way I see it, it is nice to have bushcraft skills but our world is getting smaller by the second. Why chop down several trees to make a fresh bough bed and lean-to when a 1 pound matress and 1/2 pond tarp will do the same and preserve the area you hike in?
Certainly, use downed trees for shelters and fire, cut green trees if it's your property and needs thinning out, but otherwise preserve your hiking areas.
If I am going overnight I take full shelter (tent or tarp), sleeping bag, etc.
For several nights out it's just a matter of adding more food and maybe 2 extra pairs of socks.
They way I see it, it is nice to have bushcraft skills but our world is getting smaller by the second. Why chop down several trees to make a fresh bough bed and lean-to when a 1 pound matress and 1/2 pond tarp will do the same and preserve the area you hike in?
Certainly, use downed trees for shelters and fire, cut green trees if it's your property and needs thinning out, but otherwise preserve your hiking areas.
