Most Sheriff's Offices offer some very good short courses here; but they require you train with your own gun (they won't furnish it or the ammo)
What are good basic skills for our domesticated life?
- Thread starter Tony
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We do not use guns for self defence in Europe, only for hunting and sport shooting.
All those guns in the hands of citizens must be why theres virtually zero violent crime in america.........oh wait
Kung-fu if you can and keep it going for life, its so much more than defence.
Prefer ju-jitsu. It's all the Japanese arts merged into one with nothing taken out. If you're not fussy and purist about it then ninjitsu is basically the same basic ju-jitsu but they aren't purists so take on anything good from any other martial arts. Kind of winning is the only thing so win at all costs.
BTW ju-jitsu is the martial arts taught to and studied by all MMA fighters and their ilk. Reason? It's effective in close quarters and at full strike distance. Some arts go from fist distance to leg kick distance, others from close quarters to arm length. Ju-jitsu doesn't limit itself and makes for one of the best styles for self defence.
Besides the pressure points aspect of it is very interesting too. Pain isn't the only way to get compliance. One pressure point I got taught doesn't hurt just kind of annoys you in a way you'll do anything to make it stop. More of an effect than out and out pain would get. Hard to explain it but it works. Plus it teaches the ultimate self defence skills of avoidance and awareness.
BTW ju-jitsu is the martial arts taught to and studied by all MMA fighters and their ilk. Reason? It's effective in close quarters and at full strike distance. Some arts go from fist distance to leg kick distance, others from close quarters to arm length. Ju-jitsu doesn't limit itself and makes for one of the best styles for self defence.
Besides the pressure points aspect of it is very interesting too. Pain isn't the only way to get compliance. One pressure point I got taught doesn't hurt just kind of annoys you in a way you'll do anything to make it stop. More of an effect than out and out pain would get. Hard to explain it but it works. Plus it teaches the ultimate self defence skills of avoidance and awareness.
Ironically (or maybe not) as gun ownership has steadily been going up to an all time high (over 380,000,000 guns in private hands at the last estimate a couple of years ago and another 20,000,000 sold this year) gun crime has been steadily going down by 49% since 1993, to a point less than it was in the early 1960s (when they first started recording it) www.pewsocialtrends.org/2013/05/07/gun-homicide-rates-down-49-since-1993-peak-public-unaware/
But don't let facts interfere with bias.
Looks like the hyperlink isn't working. Here's the relevant text copied and pasted:
May 7, 2013
Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware
Pace of Decline Slows in Past Decade
By D’Vera Cohn, Paul Taylor, Mark Hugo Lopez, Catherine A. Gallagher, Kim Parker and Kevin T. Maass
Note
Some trends shown in this report have been updated. Rates for overall gun deaths, firearm homicides and firearm suicides have been updated through 2013. The rate for non-fatal violent firearms victimizations has been updated through 2014. Updated charts and information can be found here.
Chapter 1: Overview
National rates of gun homicide and other violent gun crimes are strikingly lower now than during their peak in the mid-1990s, paralleling a general decline in violent crime, according to a Pew Research Center analysis of government data. Beneath the long-term trend, though, are big differences by decade: Violence plunged through the 1990s, but has declined less dramatically since 2000.
Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.
Nearly all the decline in the firearm homicide rate took place in the 1990s; the downward trend stopped in 2001 and resumed slowly in 2007. The victimization rate for other gun crimes plunged in the 1990s, then declined more slowly from 2000 to 2008. The rate appears to be higher in 2011 compared with 2008, but the increase is not statistically significant. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall also dropped in the 1990s before declining more slowly from 2000 to 2010, then ticked up in 2011.
Despite national attention to the issue of firearm violence, most Americans are unaware that gun crime is lower today than it was two decades ago. According to a new Pew Research Center survey, today 56% of Americans believe gun crime is higher than 20 years ago and only 12% think it is lower.
Looking back 50 years, the U.S. gun homicide rate began rising in the 1960s, surged in the 1970s, and hit peaks in 1980 and the early 1990s. (The number of homicides peaked in the early 1990s.) The plunge in homicides after that meant that firearm homicide rates in the late 2000s were equal to those not seen since the early 1960s.1 The sharp decline in the U.S. gun homicide rate, combined with a slower decrease in the gun suicide
But don't let facts interfere with bias.
Looks like the hyperlink isn't working. Here's the relevant text copied and pasted:
May 7, 2013
Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware
Pace of Decline Slows in Past Decade
By D’Vera Cohn, Paul Taylor, Mark Hugo Lopez, Catherine A. Gallagher, Kim Parker and Kevin T. Maass
Note
Some trends shown in this report have been updated. Rates for overall gun deaths, firearm homicides and firearm suicides have been updated through 2013. The rate for non-fatal violent firearms victimizations has been updated through 2014. Updated charts and information can be found here.
Chapter 1: Overview
Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.
Nearly all the decline in the firearm homicide rate took place in the 1990s; the downward trend stopped in 2001 and resumed slowly in 2007. The victimization rate for other gun crimes plunged in the 1990s, then declined more slowly from 2000 to 2008. The rate appears to be higher in 2011 compared with 2008, but the increase is not statistically significant. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall also dropped in the 1990s before declining more slowly from 2000 to 2010, then ticked up in 2011.
Despite national attention to the issue of firearm violence, most Americans are unaware that gun crime is lower today than it was two decades ago. According to a new Pew Research Center survey, today 56% of Americans believe gun crime is higher than 20 years ago and only 12% think it is lower.
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I like them both. They're wonderful forms of exercise and competitive sports. But they're really only a last ditch idea for a defense as you have to let the attacker get within arms length. You'll be dead long before then. Kinda like taking a knife to a gunfight. I'm not letting a hostile anywhere closer than in the same room (and that's pushing it)
Kung -fu covers all the same things, there is only so many ways the body can move and be effective, the style is not the core but the practitioner and there hard work that takes it and makes it an art, would you not say?
What you find in ju-jitsu will be found in a form of kung-fu there is a shed load of styles also as far as I recall wing chun has been a base for some police force and military defence styles, kung fu covers, grappling and contact distance from as far as you can reach with your foot to a short a distance as an elbow or shoulder nudge, pressure points, force and energy even the use of various weapons.
Umm MMA would that not be mixed martial arts? like open style kung-fu
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Ironically (or maybe not) as gun ownership has steadily been going up to an all time high (over 380,000,000 guns in private hands at the last estimate a couple of years ago and another 20,000,000 sold this year) gun crime has been steadily going down by 49% since 1993, to a point less than it was in the early 1960s (when they first started recording it) www.pewsocialtrends.org/2013/05/07/gun-homicide-rates-down-49-since-1993-peak-public-unaware/
But don't let facts interfere with bias.
Looks like the hyperlink isn't working. Here's the relevant text copied and pasted:
May 7, 2013
Gun Homicide Rate Down 49% Since 1993 Peak; Public Unaware
Pace of Decline Slows in Past Decade
By D’Vera Cohn, Paul Taylor, Mark Hugo Lopez, Catherine A. Gallagher, Kim Parker and Kevin T. Maass
Note
Some trends shown in this report have been updated. Rates for overall gun deaths, firearm homicides and firearm suicides have been updated through 2013. The rate for non-fatal violent firearms victimizations has been updated through 2014. Updated charts and information can be found here.
Chapter 1: Overview
National rates of gun homicide and other violent gun crimes are strikingly lower now than during their peak in the mid-1990s, paralleling a general decline in violent crime, according to a Pew Research Center analysis of government data. Beneath the long-term trend, though, are big differences by decade: Violence plunged through the 1990s, but has declined less dramatically since 2000.
Compared with 1993, the peak of U.S. gun homicides, the firearm homicide rate was 49% lower in 2010, and there were fewer deaths, even though the nation’s population grew. The victimization rate for other violent crimes with a firearm—assaults, robberies and sex crimes—was 75% lower in 2011 than in 1993. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall (with or without a firearm) also is down markedly (72%) over two decades.
Nearly all the decline in the firearm homicide rate took place in the 1990s; the downward trend stopped in 2001 and resumed slowly in 2007. The victimization rate for other gun crimes plunged in the 1990s, then declined more slowly from 2000 to 2008. The rate appears to be higher in 2011 compared with 2008, but the increase is not statistically significant. Violent non-fatal crime victimization overall also dropped in the 1990s before declining more slowly from 2000 to 2010, then ticked up in 2011.
Despite national attention to the issue of firearm violence, most Americans are unaware that gun crime is lower today than it was two decades ago. According to a new Pew Research Center survey, today 56% of Americans believe gun crime is higher than 20 years ago and only 12% think it is lower.
Looking back 50 years, the U.S. gun homicide rate began rising in the 1960s, surged in the 1970s, and hit peaks in 1980 and the early 1990s. (The number of homicides peaked in the early 1990s.) The plunge in homicides after that meant that firearm homicide rates in the late 2000s were equal to those not seen since the early 1960s.1 The sharp decline in the U.S. gun homicide rate, combined with a slower decrease in the gun suicide
Facts are americans are crazy for killing folks (as you demonstrated in your very next post lol)
I'm as pro gun as they come but i'v heard that superior attitude from your countrymen one too many times lately and its sticking in my craw.
Fact is all the guns in the united states of freedom and the trigger happy loony toons holding them cause at least as many problems as they solve
But law abiding gun owners cant admit that as it gives the anti gun lobby some purchase, so is born the great american lie....guns stop crime. Some of you arent in on it though. Some are genuinely brainwashed by the lie
I wont spoil the thread by entering into a big debate on it though
The ability to make something with your hands that takes longer than 5 minutes. Leatherwork, woodwork, metalwork any kind of craft that teaches patience and determination.
Echo the above about martial arts. What ever flavour. Shito-ryu is my tipple and it's something me and my little boy love.
Echo the above about martial arts. What ever flavour. Shito-ryu is my tipple and it's something me and my little boy love.
Possibly one of the best skills to install at an early age if a person is to be successful.
I'd say there's a difference between practical skills and the skills needed in our modern times. As much as we probably don't like it both are equally important.
I'll to the list of modern skills as I probably haven't had as much time to gain wisdom compared to others:
- The ability to be good at lying. - Because when you can lie you can do anything and coupled with item 2, loads of people will believe you (I suppose you could lump this in with being good at verbal communication and being a good raconteur).
- The ability to critically evaluate opinions presented in an non emotional way. - I see lots of young people believe what they are simply told without questioning the motives of these having them do their bidding.
- The ability to get on with ones own family for better or worse. - (Plenty of people find there feet during family breakups but statistically children stand a better chance of success when they have family backing).
- The wonders of compounding and financial planning that extends past their own lifetime and the lifetime of their children - When most people get inheritance they have reached a point where they now have enough money (though I could own the world and it wouldn't be enough).
Fact is :
- Those statistics are absolutely true; gun crime is at it's lowest point in over 50 years and gun ownership is at its highest ever
- Among those statistics, more than half of all gun deaths are suicides.
- Of the remaining half more than 80% are Justifiable homicide (those incidents where the shooter was indeed safer because they had a gun)
- Most of the small remainder were gang on gang
- There are dozens of incidents every day where private gun ownership stop crimes
- People are "genuinely brainwashed by the lie" that gun ownership increases crime
-No form of gun laws will have ant effect at all on actual gun ownership.
- over 399,998,900 guns killed absolutely nobody this month.
You did touch on one point that has some relevance though. We do indeed have a more violent society here; but it has nothing to do with the presence of guns. The reality is we'll never be "domesticated." We'll always be a little feral. Civilization is over rated.
Debate? There is no debate. Only immutable truth.
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My mistake. My military side was thinking of the fighting style developed by the Marine Corps for true combat. This video intersperses the actual combat training with the conditioning regimen
The following is an excerpt from the program synopsis:
Marine Corps Martial Arts Program
The Marine Corps Martial Arts Program consists of a belt ranking
system that begins at Tan Belt and progresses up to 6th Degree Black
Belt. Each belt level consists of specific techniques of the four com-
ponents of the physical discipline; Rifle & Bayonet, Edged Weapons,
Weapons of Opportunity, and Unarmed Combat. Techniques begin
with fundamentals and become more difficult as each level is
reached. In addition each belt level has a corresponding number of
Mental and Character discipline requirements that help develop the
Warrior Ethos in conjunction with the increased levels of lethality.
The ultimate goal for each of us should be to become a Master-at-
Arms, the epitome of the professional warrior.
Introduction
The Marine Corps Martial Arts Program (MCMAP) is
designed to improve the warfighting capabilities of individual
Marines and units, enhance Marines' self-confidence and esprit de
corps, and foster the warrior ethos in the Corps. The focus will be the
personal development of each Marine in a team framework, using a
standardized, trainable, and sustainable close combat system.
MCMAP is distinctively a weapons based system, integrating combat
equipment, physical challenges, and tactics typically found in the
combat arena. The program:
- Is a true Martial Art (battlefield/military oriented, not sport)
- Enhances the view of the Marine Corps as an Elite Fighting
Force
- Provides skills for all Marines
- Is applicable throughout the Spectrum of Violence
- Strengthens ethos and morale
- Enhances recruiting and retention
MCMAP is a progressive system, with each successive level
improving on and enhancing skill sets learned in the previous level.
Furthermore, the individual Marine will continue to advance through
the program throughout his career.
Overview
This logbook provides an overview of the Marine Corps
Martial Arts Program (MCMAP), discussion of the disciplines of
MCMAP, reminders that help reinforce our Core Values, as well as a
mechanism to record your training throughout your career.
The Marine Corps Martial Arts Program molds the Mental,
Character, and Physical Disciplines for the Marine Corps in order to
imbed Marines with the ability to honorably deal with the moral
dimensions of conflict and to make ethical decisions in life, whether
on or off the battlefield. MCMAP is a skill progression program
offering Martial Arts Training through a system of belt rankings from
Tan through Sixth Degree Black Belt. The program is a reflection of
our warrior ethos and provides a superb tool to increase a Marine's
self-worth and to enhance unit cohesion. Some of the benefits of the
program are:
Combat fit Marines
Marines with a combat mindset who can overcome their fears
Our combative martial arts training builds individual skills
and teamwork, but more importantly gives Marines confidence in
both themselves and in the Marines around them. When you see
Marines with a Martial Arts Belt, you know they've not only earned
the belt but they are good ethical leaders, spiritually connected to
their fellow Marines.
CORE VALUES
Generation after generation of American men and women have given
special meaning to the title United States Marine. They have done so
by their performance on and off the battlefield. Feared by enemies,
respected by allies, and admired by the American people, Marines are
a "special breed." This reputation (was gained and) is maintained by
a set of enduring Core Values. These values form the cornerstone, the
bedrock, and the heart of our character. They are the guiding beliefs
and principles that give us strength, influence our attitudes, and
regulate our behavior. They bond our Marine Family into a total
force that can meet any challenge.
HONOR: The bedrock of our character. The quality that guides
Marines to exemplify the ultimate in ethical and moral behavior;
never to lie, cheat, or steal; to abide by an uncompromising code of
integrity; to respect human dignity; to have respect and concern for
each other. The quality of maturity, dedication, trust, and
dependability that commits Marines to act responsibly; to be
accountable for actions; to fulfill obligations; and to hold others
accountable for their actions.
COURAGE: The heart of our Core Values, courage is the mental,
moral, and physical strength ingrained in Marines to carry them through
the challenges of combat and the mastery of fear; to do what is right; to
adhere to a higher standard of personal conduct; to lead by example,
and to make tough decisions under stress and pressure. It is the inner
strength that enables a Marine to take that extra step.
COMMITMENT: The spirit of determination and dedication within
members of a force of arms that leads to professionalism and mastery of
the art of war. It leads to the highest order of discipline for unit and self;
it is the ingredient that enables 24-hour a day dedication to Corps and
Country; pride; concern for others; and an unrelenting determination to
achieve a standard of excellence in every endeavor. Commitment is the
value that establishes the Marine as the warrior and citizen others strive
to emulate.
Reaffirm these Core Values and ensure they guide your performance,
behavior, and conduct every minute of every day.
CONTINUUM OF FORCE:
1. Compliant (Cooperative): Verbal Commands
2. Resistant (Passive): Contact Controls
3. Resistant (Active): Compliance Techniques*
4. Assaultive (Bodily Harm): Defensive Tactics*
5. Assaultive (Serious Bodily Harm/Death): Deadly Force*
* Martial Arts techniques
Continuum of Force. Is the concept that there is a wide range of
possible actions, ranging from verbal commands to application of
deadly force, that may be used to gain and maintain control of a
potentially dangerous situation.
.
Deadly Force, Deadly force is that force which a person uses with
the purpose of causing death or serious bodily harm, or which a
reasonable and prudent person would consider likely to create a
substantial risk of causing death or serious bodily harm. Deadly force
is only employed as a last resort, and only after all lesser means of
force have failed to produce the intended result, or when circum-
stances prevent the use of lesser means.
"Nothing gives one person so much advantage over another as to remain unruffled under all circumstances."
-- Thomas Jefferson
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The article continues with administrative protocols for recording a Marine's progress and such.
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Toe'ing the party line like a trooper there santaman 
charltan heston would be proud lol
I just hope you are self aware enough to realise what you're doing
charltan heston would be proud lol
I just hope you are self aware enough to realise what you're doing
It's not completely restricted by party; Even the democrats (in the South, Midwest, and inland Northwest states) and their Representatives & Senators agree on 2A issues. Overwhelmingly. Charlton Heston, the NRA, and the Republican Party are left leaning liberals compared to us.Toe'ing the party line like a trooper there santaman
charltan heston would be proud lol
I just hope you are self aware enough to realise what you're doing
Self aware enough to know we'll never be brainwashed into disarming ourselves.
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