Update- Carrying of knives

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I've been thinking that...
...but half of me says to leave it well alone for now - the last thing we need in the current climate is someone informing the bed-wetting anti-knife lunatics that it's perfectly legal to carry a knife (albeit non locking folders of less than 3") at the moment.

I'm tempted to think we need to say "to hell with it" and get a knife lobby sorted out and take a fair few leaves out of the NRA's book. Maybe find a way to get away from the "gun-nut" image - but I expect the bed-wetters would suggest any campaign for any child-killing-weapon (or whatever heartsting term they'd use) was run by just that kind of person.

Is there any way to win this thing?

I'm not gonna suggest revolution - though it'd fix a lot. Haha.
 

MartinK9

Life Member
Dec 4, 2008
6,536
513
Leicestershire
Bold, his emphasis. Underlined , mine

A lot of what this guys says on that thread (the one on the uk police board) makes a lot of sense........Can we vote him in as the new 'Top Cop'

He is a Moderator for that forum and is from the Greater Manchester Police


No affiliation - just surfing t'internet for some clarification and found the site - some good reading if you click the search button
 

gunslinger

Nomad
Sep 5, 2008
321
0
69
Devon
Well TBH I thought the scariest one on there was the idiot who considered it OK to carry a lock knife for self defence, and was prepared to use it as such.

Also it is not the Home secretary who gives them lawful authority, it is us the people of this country as they only police by consent. Thats our consent, but they often forget that,if they knew in the first place.
Personally I found a lot of the posts on there worrying.

GS
 
He is a Moderator for that forum and is from the Greater Manchester Police


No affiliation - just surfing t'internet for some clarification and found the site - some good reading if you click the search button

Thanks for pointing that out. I actually quite like to know there's someone like that on my local force.




Gunslinger - I know what you mean - but I really don't think there's much "consent" in government right now.
I wouldn't (and don't) call them servants, I call them rulers. That's how they think and that's how act. There may be a few exceptions, but they are thin on the ground if so.
ID Cards.
National Identity Register.
Iraq.
Email and Web records.
Phone records.
Logging of all car journeys.
Legislative and Regulatory Reform Bill (aka "Abolition of Parliament Bill" or "Totalitarianism Bill")
etc.
etc.

Something is very wrong.



Oh - and I found that "knife for self defence" guy pretty scary too.
A classic "one rule for us, one for the rest" type I think.
What's the betting that if you applied his logic to carrying for self defence to a non-copper he'd arrest them in a heartbeat.
It's pretty frightening to think that there are officers on patrol in the UK who are illegally carrying knives with the intent of using them against members of the public. A new slant to "knife crime" eh?
 

Simon

Nomad
Jul 22, 2004
360
0
59
Addington, Surrey
I've been thinking that...
...but half of me says to leave it well alone for now - the last thing we need in the current climate is someone informing the bed-wetting anti-knife lunatics that it's perfectly legal to carry a knife (albeit non locking folders of less than 3") at the moment.

I'm tempted to think we need to say "to hell with it" and get a knife lobby sorted out and take a fair few leaves out of the NRA's book. Maybe find a way to get away from the "gun-nut" image - but I expect the bed-wetters would suggest any campaign for any child-killing-weapon (or whatever heartsting term they'd use) was run by just that kind of person.

Is there any way to win this thing?

I'm not gonna suggest revolution - though it'd fix a lot. Haha.

essentially, the place to do this thing is that unmentionable blade site. Unfortunately it is administered by those who are terrified by this concept and their responsibilities.
 
I dunno.
It's understandable some people not wanting to make waves.

Sorta like the people who lost guns years back. Many seemed (and now seem) to think that if they raise their voices they'll look crazy and bring about the changes some anti gun (and knife) people wanted (and now want) faster and with more certainty than if they were just quiet normal law abiding people.
The problem is, the antis have no such fear of looking crazy and have nothing to lose by doing so. An unfair battle, yea, but that's life.

Not saying that's why that site (not sure why it's unmentionable) chooses not to get stuck into the thick of the fight - but people have their reasons and that's fine.
 

nigeltm

Full Member
Aug 8, 2008
484
16
54
south Wales
Well TBH I thought the scariest one on there was the idiot who considered it OK to carry a lock knife for self defence, and was prepared to use it as such.

On one of the American forums there is a lot of discussion on the use of knives as backup weapons for coppers (BushcraftUSA I think?). It was an interesting read, even down to debate on where to have the knife on the belt! Maybe he's been on their site?

It was a few years ago, but I used to be seriously into martial arts. Studied for 10 years and tried a few different styles (Japanese and Chinese). My favourite was a traditional form of Kung-Fu which focussed on practical streetfighting (real rip their bo**ocks off type of thing :)).

The lesson from that? Only the VERY experienced or utter fools fight knife against knife! I'd much rather run away from a guy with a knife than pull one of my own. If in a corner I'd have both hands free to try and control the knife hand, rather than try and pull a knife of my own.

Hmm, I wonder if that would work in court?

Yes m'lord, I did have a 3 inch slipjoint in my pocket. But I can do more damage with a rolled up newspaper so why would I carry a "weapon"?
 

Hobbit on a String

Tenderfoot
Jan 5, 2009
77
0
Aberdeenshire (Turriff)
The worlds gone mad,mad,mad, what next, are we going to be withdrawing ATM's from the high street so as not to encourage peolpe to spend money, or withdraw coffee an tea from the supermarket shelves as they are addictive???????
 

Hobbit on a String

Tenderfoot
Jan 5, 2009
77
0
Aberdeenshire (Turriff)
RE: Knife and Axe Lobby,
We are always going to be seen by the general public, as army wannabes, or gun-nut wacko's, when that could be futher than the truth, i have yet to meet a Bushcrafter who uses a firearm of any description to catch and kill his food, yes i somtimes use snares, but i always get the permission of the land owner before i do so,
And some of us are ex-forces and are reliving the times we spent out in the field, others are folks who are wanting to feel the call of the wild as our ancestors did, building our shelters out of what is lying around us, foraging for our supper,

We should start a Lobby about this, because if it becomes law that that we can not carry any bladed tool, then we are stuffed,

I say we vote on the matter, and get guys informed, and make a petition and hand it in at number 10, although fat lot of good it will do,
But we have to get the gen public on our side, to show we are not using knifes for criminal purposes, but for living in the field.
The Hobbit
 

Minotaur

Native
Apr 27, 2005
1,600
232
Birmingham
On one of the American forums there is a lot of discussion on the use of knives as backup weapons for coppers (BushcraftUSA I think?). It was an interesting read, even down to debate on where to have the knife on the belt! Maybe he's been on their site?

It was a few years ago, but I used to be seriously into martial arts. Studied for 10 years and tried a few different styles (Japanese and Chinese). My favourite was a traditional form of Kung-Fu which focussed on practical streetfighting (real rip their bo**ocks off type of thing :)).

The lesson from that? Only the VERY experienced or utter fools fight knife against knife! I'd much rather run away from a guy with a knife than pull one of my own. If in a corner I'd have both hands free to try and control the knife hand, rather than try and pull a knife of my own.

Hmm, I wonder if that would work in court?

Yes m'lord, I did have a 3 inch slipjoint in my pocket. But I can do more damage with a rolled up newspaper so why would I carry a "weapon"?

Will not get involved in Self-defense debate, do not want to be banned!
Will not get involved in Self-defense debate, do not want to be banned!
Will not get involved in Self-defense debate, do not want to be banned!

:rolleyes:

Ref the Police letter, was that the head copper basically saying 'I do not want to put the law in writing'. Got to be worth a meeting, especially if you can get your lawyer to go with you.
 

forestwalker

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Will not get involved in Self-defense debate, do not want to be banned!
Will not get involved in Self-defense debate, do not want to be banned!
Will not get involved in Self-defense debate, do not want to be banned!

But I always carry a SAK in order to defend myself. If, just to take a common every day example, a muskox tries to charge me while I am filling up my car with petrol, I need that Swiss Army Knife in order to be able to quickly make a spear so that I can stop it. Without the good saw on the genuine article, how could I cut down the tree I make the spear from before the irate bovine reaches me (muskoxen are rather fast over short distances)? Happened two times last last week, or so the voices in my head insists.
 
Maybe we need a campaign?

where's Mike? ;)
:D :cool:
Who me? Don't like to get involved mate.:p

essentially, the place to do this thing is that unmentionable blade site. Unfortunately it is administered by those who are terrified by this concept and their responsibilities.
Pack it in - you'll be quoting Niemöller next ;)


I dunno.
It's understandable some people not wanting to make waves.
No it's not.
So some people might view you as a 'nutter'?
So they view you as a nutter and take your gun / knife / tin of spam / offensive custard from you.
Or you stay quiet, say nothing and they take your gun / knife / tin of spam / offensive custard from you.

Same outcome - but if you stay quite you have no right to complain.

There are many ways to have your voice heard without becoming an extremist, a campaigner or MP botherer.

The only alternative is to join the Ostrich society and hope you get left alone.
 

Minotaur

Native
Apr 27, 2005
1,600
232
Birmingham
But I always carry a SAK in order to defend myself. If, just to take a common every day example, a muskox tries to charge me while I am filling up my car with petrol, I need that Swiss Army Knife in order to be able to quickly make a spear so that I can stop it. Without the good saw on the genuine article, how could I cut down the tree I make the spear from before the irate bovine reaches me (muskoxen are rather fast over short distances)? Happened two times last last week, or so the voices in my head insists.

Sorry we live in England, so carrying anything for self-defense is illegal, makes it an offensive weapon.

I do wonder what you could carry to deal with dogs, one more untrained dog goes for me, and I will be news foder.
 

Martyn

Bushcrafter through and through
Aug 7, 2003
5,252
33
58
staffordshire
www.britishblades.com
essentially, the place to do this thing is that unmentionable blade site. Unfortunately it is administered by those who are terrified by this concept and their responsibilities.

If the site you are unwilling to mention is BritishBlades Simon, then no it isn't the place for it. BritishBlades was created as a resource for knifemakers, not as a political lobby group. A cuckoo style hijacking of an established group in order to force a political agenda on the membership, might be convenient for you, but it is not the right thing to do. The right place for this would be a serious and credible site that was created - from scratch - as a political lobby group.

Either way, accusing someone of cowardice because they wont stick their heads above the parapet on your behalf, is unlikely to produce any positive results. On the subject of political responsibility, It's a little like not being bothered to vote and then complaining because your party didnt win. If you feel so passionate about the issue, I would suggest you register a domain, rent a web host and do it yourself. I know you have the skill to do it, you just need to find the motivation.
 

Buckshot

Mod
Mod
Jan 19, 2004
6,466
349
Oxford
Hmmm

Can we calm this down please
lets not get into a mud slanging match

keep things calm and reasonable and lets get along nicely eh?;)
As always differences of opinion are fine, insults and degrading comments aren't.

Thanks for your understanding

Mark
 

Broch

Life Member
Jan 18, 2009
7,981
7,757
Mid Wales
www.mont-hmg.co.uk
Hmmm

Can we calm this down please
lets not get into a mud slanging match

Mark

Yes Dad :)

I'm jumping in here because I've followed this thread all he way through and clearly people feel very passionate about it. The reality is that the laws are not a problem as they stand for the majority of us so we're not going to jump up and down about it. As I said very early on, I've always got a knife on me and I carry a fixed blade in the woods but I make sure I'm not seen - but then that's my kind of bushcrafting.

I also carry a fixed blade in the Land Rover because it's the best tool (short of a serated blade) to get someone out of a seatbelt - I believe the qulity of first aid kit I carry and my FA certificate provide evidence that I take that aspect seriously. What I am saying is, if you are confident that you have good reason then be confident the law will support you. Of course, history may suggest to the law that you, individually, have not got good reason.
 
Dec 18, 2008
372
0
Durham.
Bloody hell, I've followed this thread from the beginning and I must say that I ain't half glad that I discard the draconian laws that would have me stay at home.
I don't carry a knife with me on everyday errands, but on the way to the woods I will carry one.
Cops/doo-gooders/dailymail readers can ...
I am not intent on stabbing someone on my way to the woods, but the laws in this country would have you believe different.
This thread has me cursing, so I know that it is time for me to log-out.
What is this country coming to, eh?
Yours, despondently, a countryside lover ...
 

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