Survival whistles

[bambodoggy]

But I feel that a plastic whistle gives advantages over a metal one, but everyday is a school day which is why I am here and will listen to any considered argument about why a metal whistle gives advantages over a tough plastic one(volume and effort to produce that volume being equal).

So that's it then - what is the advantage of a metal one over a plastic one, plain and simple question?

If you're hungry you could crack a Quail's egg carefully into a metal whistle and cook it, thus getting you half way to a good bacon and egg breakfast I suppose you could use a normal egg and cook it a bit at a time.... I think a plastic whistle would make the egg taste yucky and melt fairly soon

Metal 1 : Plastic 0

 

[cbr6fs]

I agree with most of what you have said there but I have to disagree with this bit.


Slightly fuzzy logic, as you say the metal whistle is a better conductor, that does mean it warms up, but unfortunately also dissipates the heat away from your lips very quickly into the air around it.
Plastic insulates and so keeps the heat on the lips better than metal. This is why metal will stick to the lips because depending on the temperature variance it reduces the temperature of what it touches very quickly by conducting the heat away and if it is below freezing it can reduce the contact point of the skin quickly to that level.
When you touch something metal and it feels cold it is actually your skin that is reducing in temperature that you can feel.

The heat loss from a little metal whistle would be inconsequential though, you'd lose more heat from your breath or mouth.

It's not actually the metal that causes your lips or skin to stick, it's the ice.

If you to lick say a frozen plastic flag pole then your tongue would still stick to the ice on the pole, but because the plastic isn't a good conductor of heat your tongue will warm up the area around the plastic quickly enabling you to remove your tongue.

With a metal flag pole it conducts heat a lot more efficiently, so the warmth from your tongue spreads out leaving the contact area hardly any warmer.

With a whistle there really isn't enough surface area to get the same effect, you'd just warm up the entire whistle.

 

[santaman2000]

relating to this:

I would like to ask, which whistle would you have advised them(the trainees) to take in a survival kit?

What trainees? Police? Very few that I know carry a "survival" kit TBH. At least not in the survival context we're discussing. A hidden handcuff key for escaping if overpowered, yes. A back-up gun, yes. Wearing your body armor under your shirt at all times, yes. The outdoors type cops (Forest rangers and Game Wardens) will carry extra outdoor gear, yes, but not dedicated survival gear as such. Much the same way I described what I always carry when in the woods.

As for what O would advise in general? The Acme Thunderer. Just like I did in my original post. Why? Read on a bit.

.....The other thing is if the whistle is cold you can always stick it in your pocket, under your arm pit or somewhere else warm......

Actually when I'm out in the woods I usually carry my whistle by wearing it around my neck on a lanyard (just like coaches and bird hunters) Unless I'm actually bird hunting and thus need access to it reasonably often (not normally the case for the last decade or two due to the decline in wild quail) it's usually tucked inside my shirt.

....Each to their own. But I feel that a plastic whistle gives advantages over a metal one, but everyday is a school day which is why I am here and will listen to any considered argument about why a metal whistle gives advantages over a tough plastic one(volume and effort to produce that volume being equal).
So that's it then - what is the advantage of a metal one over a plastic one, plain and simple question?

For me the advantage of the metal one is simple; familiarity. I've used the Acme Thunderer for over 50 years and it's never let me down and never been a problem even in cold weather, no matter what I've used it for (TBH, there's only one use for a whistle; blowing it) Are plastic ones more fragile? Possibly; if it's a cheap plastic. But modern plastics are pretty tough TBH.

Assuming your plastic one is a good quality it's probably more than tough enough. Any advantages it would have over a metal one due to weight or cold issues would be negligible though. Maybe real, but negligible none-the-less. Just as the metal one's advantage over the plastic regarding toughness (assuming the plastic is a good quality) would be negligible.

 

[wheelnut]

If you're hungry you could crack a Quail's egg carefully into a metal whistle and cook it, thus getting you half way to a good bacon and egg breakfast I suppose you could use a normal egg and cook it a bit at a time.... I think a plastic whistle would make the egg taste yucky and melt fairly soon

Metal 1 : Plastic 0

And there we have it the 1 advantage I've been looking for that nobody else has been able to come up with.

 

[mrcharly]

Orienteering organisations ban the pea-whistles - too much risk of losing the pea and not knowing until you need to use it.

The purpose of the whistles are to attract help in the even of getting incapacitated or lost. It's not really about 'surviving' because nobody is going to hold a competition in life-threatening conditions. It's a lot about making it easy to find someone.

The standard orienteering whistle is a sturdy plastic thing that will survive being wet, dropped on, etc. Light as well.

 

[Laurentius]

Orienteering organisations ban the pea-whistles - too much risk of losing the pea and not knowing until you need to use it.

That does not make a lot of sense as the pea only affects the way a whistle sounds giving it a kind of vibrato, it is the fipple that causes it to make a sound in the first place.

I am not convinced that blowing into a cold whistle is going to cool you down substantially more than breathing does, surely it is inhaling cold air that will cool you, not breathing it out as the air is warm when it leaves the body, and it leaves the body anyway. When it has left the body it is no longer warming anything, (except perhaps the whistle)

 

[Joe tahkahikew]

hi.

Very interesting read. Clearly whistles would be of no use at all in our northern forests as most of the time no one is any where near you when you are out on your own and the forest stops high noises like whistles from travelling far. To work, then you need still days and open country and people.

i'd be very interested in how far the sound carries in the UK and whether anyone knows how many people have been rescued by using a whistle?

Than k you for listening.

 

[cbr6fs]

hi.

Very interesting read. Clearly whistles would be of no use at all in our northern forests as most of the time no one is any where near you when you are out on your own and the forest stops high noises like whistles from travelling far. To work, then you need still days and open country and people.

i'd be very interested in how far the sound carries in the UK and whether anyone knows how many people have been rescued by using a whistle?

Than k you for listening.

One thing that might be worth thinking about Joe, IF you are lost and IF you have left a itinerary with someone you trust even though there might not be anyone near to you, a blast of the whistle would help SAR find you quicker.


*edit, sorry i was rushing my response.

What i meant was, if you have taken a few basic precautions then even if there is no one in the area you are stuck in, eventually someone should be out looking for you.
If you are still alive then a whistle and a torch will help those people locate you a LOT quicker.

 

[santaman2000]

hi.

Very interesting read. Clearly whistles would be of no use at all in our northern forests as most of the time no one is any where near you when you are out on your own.....

One thing that might be worth thinking about Joe, IF you are lost and IF you have left a itinerary with someone you trust even though there might not be anyone near to you, a blast of the whistle would help SAR find you quicker.

Plus 1 to what cbr6fs said. You only blow it when you see or hear somebody near enough to hear it. Contrary to most belief, it's not just about the sound carrying farther than your voice, it's just as much about not having to use your voice at all. Injury or illness or (horeseness) could easily rob you of said voice.

 

[Laurentius]

hi.

Very interesting read. Clearly whistles would be of no use at all in our northern forests as most of the time no one is any where near you when you are out on your own and the forest stops high noises like whistles from travelling far. To work, then you need still days and open country and people.

i'd be very interested in how far the sound carries in the UK and whether anyone knows how many people have been rescued by using a whistle?

Than k you for listening.

They are useful in the British uplands, where you might be lost and out of sight of others, but not out of earshot of somebody, and as others have said, if a search and rescue team is looking for you, it can give them some idea of direction, and they can whistle back to indicate that they have heard you. I would have thought they would also be useful anywhere where you are travelling in a group and get seperated, it is an easy and relatively effortless way of attracting attention and signalling direction.

I don't know the Northern Forests of course, but it is a peculiarity of human perception that a clear high pitch sounds louder than a low one even if the volume in terms of db is the same, besides it is less easily confused with other noises. I would expect a whistle would carry further than the human voice in a forest environment and you are not going to shout yourself hoarse.

 

[Joe tahkahikew]

Thank you.

But I'm interested in how many people in the Uk have been saved by using whistle??

We don't have them up here but they are obviously useful in the UK. I just like to know more please.

 

[cbr6fs]

Thank you.

But I'm interested in how many people in the Uk have been saved by using whistle??

We don't have them up here but they are obviously useful in the UK. I just like to know more please.

Just carried out a quick search and was unable to come up with any statistics Joe, i do agree that it would be interesting to see how many missing persons were found that used a whistle as opposed to those that didn't.


For me personally the way i see it is
My Storm whistle puts out around 100 decibels when blown (a quick search found a shout is around 85 decibels)
The whistle only weighs just over 20 grams
Fits easily in my rucksack hip pocket
Cost me about £12

So it's worth the gamble to me as the only negatives are the price and the space it takes up in my rucksack, both i personally consider inconsequential.

 

[Laurentius]

Thank you.

But I'm interested in how many people in the Uk have been saved by using whistle??

We don't have them up here but they are obviously useful in the UK. I just like to know more please.

I don't know the answer but I am sure that experienced mountain rescue teams would not be recommending that you should carry one, if it had no use whatever.

 

[presterjohn]

I have quite a few whistles purchased from Aliexpress.com. Looking at the branded ones shown on this thread they were clearly bootleg versions of them without the high price tag. I feel a bit guilty now as you don't really think of a whistle as a patented design. My bank manager on the other hand would be pleased to know that they were all under a pound delivered to my door.

 

[santaman2000]

.....I don't know the Northern Forests of course, but it is a peculiarity of human perception that a clear high pitch sounds louder than a low one even if the volume in terms of db is the same.....

I'm not sure if that's true or not. Most people I know with hearing loss (myself included) lose the ability to hear the higher frequencies first. in my case it's because of overexposure to high pitched noises (jet noise)

 

[Toddy]

I suspect hearing loss is a personal thing, and it affects everyone differently.
I hear every wee bird, every whistle, even the ones my neighbours use to train their dogs, every electronic beep and cheep in the house though they might be two or three rooms away from me, but I can't hear someone talking while sitting in the same room as me if they don't speak up

Whistles....good things when needed Basically they're just to say I'm here, or I'm here, help please. The repetitive six blasts is surprisingly noticeable out on the hills, or moors come to think on it. In the woods it's harder to get a bearing on them, but after a bit, especially if you're moving, then you can get a general direction to follow, and it becomes clearer the nearer you get to the person using the whistle. Same among rocky gills and seashores.
I used to be a cub scout leader, when out with the pack the whistle commands were clearly heard and paid heed to. The voice doesn't always carry.

Metal or plastic ? Used to be metal because plastic was pretty carp. I have an old bakelite one, with a pea but these days I carry plastic ones...though I'm pretty sure it's an aluminium one that's on my keyring.

Like Bambodoggy I like playing with the acorn cups, and blades of grass can be quite piercingly loud too.

Scottish mountain rescue advise carrying a whistle, "Take a whistle and learn the signal for rescue. Six good long blasts. Stop for one minute. Repeat. Carry on the whistle blasts until someone reaches you and don't stop because you've heard a reply – rescuers may be using your blasts as a direction finder."

Mountain rescue here can be for many reasons; folks lost, folks hurt, folks trapped.....need not be a fatality unless exposure sets in. Therefore statistics for 'lives saved by a whistle' wouldn't really be a relevant statistic.

M

 

[cbr6fs]

Any blasts are better than none, but usually the sign for distress is 3 blasts of the whistle within 1 min

 

[santaman2000]

....Whistles....good things when needed Basically they're just to say I'm here, or I'm here, help please. The repetitive six blasts is surprisingly noticeable out on the hills

....Scottish mountain rescue advise carrying a whistle, "Take a whistle and learn the signal for rescue. Six good long blasts. Stop for one minute. Repeat.....

Six? The distress signal is a series of threes. Three blasts of a whistle; three shots fired in the air; three signal fires; three columns of smoke; (the physical/visible signals such as the fires/columns of smoke/piles of rock usually arranged in a triangle) etc.

Hmmm. Just looked it up again and it would appear you're right; in the UK and the Alps. Still three for the rest of the world though.

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From Wiki:

Mountain distress signals[edit]

The recognised mountain distress signals are based on groups of three, or six in the UK and the European Alps. A distress signal can be 3 fires or piles of rocks in a triangle, three blasts on a whistle, three shots from a firearm, or three flashes of a light, in succession followed by a one-minute pause and repeated until a response is received. Three blasts or flashes is the appropriate response.

In the Alps, the recommended way to signal distress is the Alpine distress signal: give six signals within a minute, then pause for a minute, repeating this until rescue arrives. A signal may be anything visual (waving clothes or lights, use of a signal mirror) or audible (shouts, whistles, etc.). The rescuers acknowledge with three signals per minute.

In practice either signal pattern is likely to be recognised in most popular mountainous areas as nearby climbing teams are likely to include Europeans or North Americans.

To communicate with a helicopter in sight, raise both arms (forming the letter Y) to indicate "Yes" or "I need help," or stretch one arm up and one down (imitating the letter N) for "No" or "I do not need help". If semaphore flags are available, they can possibly be used to communicate with rescuers.

 

[DocG]

Useful discussion and some interesting points.

Ref. whistle blasts, UK and Europe HELP = 6 and Assistance Is Coming = 3. As noted below, it's a good idea to keep sending even when you hear that help is on its way so that you can be located more easily (at all, in some circumstances). I have no idea why there's a difference between areas. It always seemed a bit daft to me, but, then again, we do insist on right hand drive

 

[lou1661]

Don't forget, when not used for survival purposes, it's still a whistle and useful for signaling, I use mine when doing river crossings and such like as the it is easier than shouting over the water and the whistle travels well.