Spyderco BCUK Bushcrafter REDUCED

[JonathanD]

Yeah it is. The odd thing is, even though we recognise this in ourselves, we still do it.

Can't fight natural instinct. Suppressing it only makes it come out in other forms. Sometimes releasing it is like letting off steam... and sometimes the build up of steam blows the cork out with magnified results

 

[Hoodoo]

Can't fight natural instinct. Suppressing it only makes it come out in other forms. Sometimes releasing it is like letting off steam... and sometimes the build up of steam blows the cork out with magnified results

Sure you can. It's called selection. :BlueTeamE

 

[Dougster]

Can't fight natural instinct.

I thought it was precisely what made us civilised. My natural instinct is to insult and punch so so many people, but I try hard to limit the numbers.

 

[Mesquite]

I thought it was precisely what made us civilised. My natural instinct is to insult and punch so so many people, but I try hard to limit the numbers.

 

[phill_ue]

Ahem
Josh you are well out of order so please admit it
Your posts have upset me at times but I have thought you just look silly and immature
martyn you are trolling and thats wrong as well

I thought that was a good call and very balanced. A shame that it took a member of the forum to step in and put folk straight, have you thought of running for El Presidente?

 

[nige7whit]

Sorry to divert back onto topic....

What's the general concensus on the knives that are being received on this deal (factory seconds)? Are the scales generally an easy fix, or are some beyond repair and in need of a refit?

I almost committed to buy one the other night, but hesitated before splashing the cash. One reason is the handle issue, the other is the customs duties, I hate paying 'taxes'.

 

[helixpteron]

Double post... deleted.

 

[Stew]

Sorry to divert back onto topic....

What's the general concensus on the knives that are being received on this deal (factory seconds)? Are the scales generally an easy fix, or are some beyond repair and in need of a refit?

I almost committed to buy one the other night, but hesitated before splashing the cash. One reason is the handle issue, the other is the customs duties, I hate paying 'taxes'.

i got two of them and both were cracked but not to a level that I would be concerned with.

 

[Martyn]

Sorry to divert back onto topic....

What's the general concensus on the knives that are being received on this deal (factory seconds)? Are the scales generally an easy fix, or are some beyond repair and in need of a refit?

I almost committed to buy one the other night, but hesitated before splashing the cash. One reason is the handle issue, the other is the customs duties, I hate paying 'taxes'.

From what I've seen, most seem to be a straightforward fix, but I have seen one or two where the scales have lifted off the tang significantly. I think those would be in need of a handle refit IMO. On the other hand, some seem almost perfect. I think you have to view it as a lottery. They are being sold as damaged, so there are no assurances.

 

[helixpteron]

Read from post #372 onwards mate, it's all detailed.
http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showthread.php?99333-Bushcraft-UK-2nds-quot-heads-up-quot/page25

Martyn,

Would you mind posting the particular subsection of the Act (or the relevant post from BB) as I'm not a member, and I can't find it in Section 104 of the Postal Services Act.

Thanks,

 

[Martyn]

No worries...

The Postal services act 2000

section 104...

(2) Anything to which this subsection applies shall have the same immunity from—

(d) retention by virtue of a lien,

as it would have if it were the property of the Crown.

...this means it's illegal to delay or withold a parcel in lieu of a civil debt.

Section 105...

(3) Duties (whether of customs or excise) charged on imported goods or other charges payable in respect of postal packets to which this section applies (whether payable to a postal operator or to a foreign administration) may be recovered by the postal operator concerned and in England and Wales and Northern Ireland may be so recovered as a civil debt due to him.

...this means that handling fees are considered a "civil debt" and not monies owed to the crown.

section 106...

106.
Power to detain postal packets containing contraband.
— (1) A postal operator may—
(a) detain any postal packet if he suspects that it may contain relevant goods,

(2) In this section “relevant goods” means—
(a) any goods chargeable with any duty charged on imported goods (whether a customs or an excise duty) which has not been paid or secured

...this means they can detain goods pending payment of VAT, but NOT their fees. However, even the VAT has already been paid ...by ParcelForce themselves...

From the ParcelForce Website:

If we receive a parcel from overseas for import customers, we will pay any Customs duties and taxes on their behalf to HMRC. However, we will require payment for this, together with our Customs clearance fee, before the parcel can be delivered to them. Parcelforce Worldwide charges a Customs clearance fee which helps cover the cost of additional handling, administration, collection of monies and provision of facilities for Customs clearance of packages.

...this means that the whole of the ParcelForce invoice is in fact a civil debt, not a crown debt. Even the VAT is actually an amount of money owed to ParcelForce that is equivalent to the VAT they have already paid on my behalf.

Given that my parcel has already been in the country for a week...

12-03-2010 08:30 Stoke Depot Awaiting payment of charges
12-03-2010 00:52 Stoke Depot Arrived at delivery depot
11-03-2010 17:42 National Hub Sorted in hub
11-03-2010 09:44 International Hub RELEASED WITH CHARGES
05-03-2010 10:20 International Hub AWAITING CUSTOMS CHARGING
05-03-2010 10:20 International Hub AWAITING CUSTOMS CHARGES
05-03-2010 09:44 International Hub Arrived in destination country
01-03-2010 08:01 Delivery Agent - SAN FRANCISCO Arrived at Outward OE
27-02-2010 13:11 Delivery Agent - UNITED STATES AMERICA Collected from customer

...before they sent me a ransom demand, they have broken the law by holding the parcel as lien - in lieu of a civil debt owed to them (the law requires them to deliver the parcel and then ask for money). I will tell them they have broken the law and ask for my package to be released to me immediately. I will offer to pay the sum equivalent to that which they paid on my behalf, but I will not pay the clearance fee, for which they must send me a separate invoice. Any refusal or delay is further compounding their breach of statute.

 

[JonathanD]

I used Martyns post in an email to PF last week as I originally bought the knife as a present for someone. PF delayed delivery so much that I missed the window and had to buy something else. I fought the fees and the illegal holding of my goods and got ALL fees waived. I did threaten to take it further though to recoup lost money as it was no longer viable as a gift due to them withholding it for an unreasonable amount of time. Just an example of how it can work. Other people have not had the same results, but it is clearly achievable.

 

[PREPER]

new utube video battoning with the spyderco bushcrafter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp3bcCd46kA

PREPER............

 

[Black Sheep]

Well here's mine...........

Only had two very small cracks on the right hand scale, now gone

I'm really pleased with it I've been on a Bushcraft course run by the local Forestry Commission this weekend an its been used for everything from feather sticks to skinning a small deer the Rangers brought along. Great knife but I prefer my sheath (not made for this knife as I only got it Friday, but works well).

Cheers

Richard

 

[Hoodoo]

I found this on the Spyderco site:

We'll be getting the knife back. We'll analyze the problem and make the necessary adjustments for the next run of the Bushcraft UK model. More than likely with a G-10 scale. It's the "real world" testing that molds the designs of the future.

sal

Might not be as pretty but I'm glad they are planning to continue the line.

 

[helixpteron]

Martyn,

Many thanks, its much appreciated!

 

[Martyn]

No worries mate, I hope it delivers for you.

The key is not to refuse to pay the fees point blank, but to demand that they be invoiced separately. Then take your goods, then argue over the fees once they no longer have anything to hold to ransom.

My conversation went like this....

Me: Hi mate, I want to collect my parcel, small issue though, I want to pay the VAT now and take my parcel, and I want you to invoice me separately for your clearance fee.
Bloke on desk: Erm, OK, I'll just get me manager.
Manager: Hello sir...
Me: Hello, I want to collect my parcel, small issue though, I want to pay the VAT now and take my parcel, and I want you to invoice me separately for your clearance fee.
Manager: We cant do that sir, we've had an email from head office which says we cant relese parcels unless the bill is paid in total.
Me: That's illegal. Section 104 of the Postal Services Act 2000, says that you cannot hold a parcel as a lien against a civil debt. ParcelForce is a PLC and your clearance fee has nothing to do with HMRC or customs in any way. You cannot hold my parcel to ransom against a civil debt with your company. That is a criminal act.
Manager: I can show you the email sir.
Me: I can show you the statute and I think you'll find it trumps your email. I want to pay the VAT and take my parcel as is my legal right. Are you refusing to release the parcel to me?
Manager: Oh, you want to pay the VAT now?
Me: Yes, but not the clearance fee at this time.
Manager: Oh, I see sir, I misunderstood, that will be fine.

Result!!!

 

[Siberianfury]

Ahem
Josh you are well out of order so please admit it
Your posts have upset me at times but I have thought you just look silly and immature
martyn you are trolling and thats wrong as well

this is odviously somthing you feel strongly about, PM sent as id rather not be part of yet another stir on the open forum.

 

[Siberianfury]

I dunno if it's the tribal nature of people generally, but it's a strange thing, this need that we have to pick sides over something.

like everything in life, anyway i just dont reckon its worth arguing about anymore, whats done is done, im finished with the tribal stuff, not worth it..

 

[helixpteron]

As I've already paid the Parcel Force Handling Fee on my Packraft and Desalinator, based on the false premise that my parcels would not be released without payment, I intend to request a refund and apology.

If Parcel Force refuse, I'll use the Small Claims Court as I like being lied to as much as I like being cheated!