Make a shed from wood in woodland or buy cheap wooden one?

[bushcraftlearner83729]

Another shed alternative that I didn't mention before is the old fashioned bender. Before I got the pop up garage tents I used poles and tarps to make benders. The ones I made from hazel poles lasted maybe 5 or 6 years before the poles gave way to rot. I have one underneath a fallen tree that would still be OK had the tree not flattened it. That one used scaffold pipe offcuts driven in the ground and then blue poly water pipe to make the hoops, stock fence to give the roof more support and then a standard plastic tarp over the top. Basically like a poly tunnel but smaller. None of them ever had trouble with wind taking the tarps off either.

How does the bender compare in terms of shelter in winter and price to a cheap shed?

Only the cost of some bendy wood and a tarp. Maybe this would be a nice middle ground between more permanent shed structure and just a wiley tarp. The whips, not sure of their correct name in this context, giving a bit more support than just lashed to a tree, while still being moveable easily.

How much would it cost for enough willow for a 10 x 10? I plan to buy willow cuttings from one of the well known sellers soon anyway so could see if they can send some of those for making a bender at the same time.

Just looking and they sell whips x100 in various lengths from 1m to 3m. Should I get the longest I can? 100 x 3m is £140. Still much cheaper than a bought shed. Then builder's tarp for £50 or so. Will that do the job to get me setup?

Any other stuff? What about for a base? Should I still buy that hard plastic stuff or don't have to bother much about a base due to the lightweight nature of the bender?

This article makes it sound very simple: https://www.stewardwood.org/resources/DIYbender.htm

Shame the images are not visible.

What size tarp would I be looking at for 10 x 10 ft? https://www.screwfix.com/c/tools/tarpaulin/cat8940029

I have no concept really of which to choose especially since the bending nature makes the calculation less straight forward.

Here is another link I had saved when I was looking them up before. Hazel used in this one but I guess the same techniques would apply to willow: https://coppicecrafts.blogspot.com/2015/08/a-hazel-bender.html

 

[bushcraftlearner83729]

Assuming you want the walls 7' high and 10' long you are into 280 square foot of logs plus the roof. Assuming 1' thick walls 280 cubic feet of wood. That's 8 cubic metres but nearer 10 because firewood isn't tightly packed. Seasoned firewood is at least £100 per cube here so you are looking at £1,000 just for firewood to make the walls.

Thanks, that rules that one out then!

Maybe down the road, but as I said I am not settled on a site yet for the ideal spot so better something more easily moved and/or cheap.

 

[bushcraftlearner83729]

Okay, I wouldn't leave handtools out in our climate, not at all. Even coated with wax or WD40 they'll suffer.

How many hand tools are you leaving anyway, because a pack is pretty tidy to take back and forth.
That's why I suggested the tarp. You can adjust, and by the sounds of it you don't know your land well enough to make a decision yet as to where you wish to build.....that can take time. Ca' canny as they say.

Bushcrafters use tarps, chutes, etc., pretty much as standard kit, so they come to mind as being really useful. Surprisingly robust, and they're really the route to benders and the like anyway.

It wasn't intentional. The weather had been fine for a long time before that and I left as the rains started and hasn't let up since.

You underestimate how little space I have in a small van that also has all my habitation facilities in! It is already packed to bursting. Hence why I want storage space on the land asap.

 

[Stew]

It wasn't intentional. The weather had been fine for a long time before that and I left as the rains started and hasn't let up since.

You underestimate how little space I have in a small van that also has all my habitation facilities in! It is already packed to bursting. Hence why I want storage space on the land asap.

Maybe some plastic tubs in the interim?

 

[Dave Budd]

Here are a few photos from the construction of one of the benders. The pole are hazel cut from stools in the vicinity of where we were working, lashed together with nasty blue poly rope. I put a bit of stock fence and a very old and dead tarp on the roof to protect the outer tarp from damage. The tarps are just the cheap nasty woven poly things from Tarpaflex, so maybe 20 quid or something. The front was later covered with a smaller tarp that drops down as a flap.

This is the one that has the tree on top of it, but I think one of the poles near the front had snapped not long before, which meant I had to crawl in to get anything out. I had meant to fix it, but didn't get around to it before the thing was flattened! It was a tool shed for storing hand tools, chainsaw PPE, tilly lamps, spare camping kit, etc. Anything that needed to be rodent proof was in ammo boxes and anything that might suffer from the damp wasn't directly on the floor. I could've put floor of plastic membrane and/or pallets, but as I say it was just a storage shed. Took a very short day to build with a helper.

One of the others used scaf pipe in place of the stakes that are driven in to the ground here and 30mm polyprop water pipe for the hoops.

 

[British Red]

Thanks, that rules that one out then!

Maybe down the road, but as I said I am not settled on a site yet for the ideal spot so better something more easily moved and/or cheap.

Cordwood building makes sense if you are bucking up lots of trees. It makes no sense if you are buying seasoned firewood to do it with.

 

[British Red]

One of the others used scaf pipe in place of the stakes that are driven in to the ground here and 30mm polyprop water pipe for the hoops.

That would last ...decades. I use HDPE poly pipe to make cloche and net hoops in the veg plot. After 15 years they look brand new!

 

[bushcraftlearner83729]

Here are a few photos from the construction of one of the benders. The pole are hazel cut from stools in the vicinity of where we were working, lashed together with nasty blue poly rope. I put a bit of stock fence and a very old and dead tarp on the roof to protect the outer tarp from damage. The tarps are just the cheap nasty woven poly things from Tarpaflex, so maybe 20 quid or something. The front was later covered with a smaller tarp that drops down as a flap.

This is the one that has the tree on top of it, but I think one of the poles near the front had snapped not long before, which meant I had to crawl in to get anything out. I had meant to fix it, but didn't get around to it before the thing was flattened! It was a tool shed for storing hand tools, chainsaw PPE, tilly lamps, spare camping kit, etc. Anything that needed to be rodent proof was in ammo boxes and anything that might suffer from the damp wasn't directly on the floor. I could've put floor of plastic membrane and/or pallets, but as I say it was just a storage shed. Took a very short day to build with a helper.

One of the others used scaf pipe in place of the stakes that are driven in to the ground here and 30mm polyprop water pipe for the hoops.

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Great, thanks.

I have been thinking that the name 'bender' is a bit of a red herring isn't it? What I mean is that I don't have to use bendy wood at all do I? As such I would have enough would to make a square/rectangle shaped frame from the wood I have already.

I have been thinking of clearing a space in the small bit of woodland I have so that I can take advantage of the woods as a bit of a barrier. Then I can make the frame from the cleared wood.

Most of the trees are pretty thin (this is separate from the 30-50ft ones discussed earlier), similar to pictured, and only about 15-20ft high so easy to work with.

I can use the copious brambles for lashings and would only have to get a good sized tarp.

Any blueprints for a 'none' bender?

Seems general woodland shelter is what I am looking for.

Oh and as for the 'main' woodland my mum gave me some other information yesterday. We were on a walk and I pointed out what looked like the ones in my wood and she said they are oak! Only reason I ruled them out as such is because I thought oak didn't grow straight up but she said they will if they are in competition with one another and also that there are different types. I am just used to the lone great oak in the middle of a field or one or two in the hedgerow that are able to grow outwards as they please.

So potentially more material to work with? Not right away as those are much bigger but something to think about especially as quite a lot have fallen on their own already, probably even more after all these gales.

Oh and before someone mentions it there is no tree preservation order on the woods.

I'm not so sure actually as the leaves aren't wavy like oak. The bark looks just like it but the leaves are round from what I recall.

 

[Stew]

The strength of a bender comes from the arch shape. Also no harsh corners so easier to wrap.

 

[Stew]

Please don’t cut down 30’ oak trees on a whim!

 

[bushcraftlearner83729]

Please don’t cut down 30’ oak trees on a whim!

Ok but many fell on their own already. I can use those if not rotten.

 

[Stew]

Ok but many fell on their own already. I can use those if not rotten.

That is true but also please don't forget the life that fallen trees give to a woodland.

I recall some years ago asking the question here as to what supports more life - a live tree or a dead tree. I'll see if I can find the trhead.

 

[Stew]

Here:

Which supports more life - a living tree or a dead one?

and this was interesting too!

What supports more life - a dead tree lying down or a dead tree standing up?

 

[bushcraftlearner83729]

Here:

Which supports more life - a living tree or a dead one?

and this was interesting too!

What supports more life - a dead tree lying down or a dead tree standing up?

I have just been watching some of kris harbour's first videos on his roundhouse project. It was interesting to see he uses many of the techniques discussed in my threads - tyres for the base, roundwood framing, cordwood for the walls.

A couple of things I noticed. That looks way more complex than I want to make for my first structure. Also although he makes out like he was starting from zero he seems to have a firm grasp of use of powertools and general woodworking/carpentry. Maybe that was just because he had friends to guide him along I don't know. He seems to not go into how he learned his skills and just puts the videos out there.

I see a wealth of tools in the videos as well as, just for example, knowing how to shore up his frames with various different means while he works on them. Just shows a certain level of proficiency rather than the impression of bungling through.

 

[Dave Budd]

Like Stew says, the strength of the bender type structure is in the arch of the roof. If you build it out of straight poles you have several problems. Firstly is that they will not be as sturdy from side loads such as wind unless the uprights are pretty chunky and driven in deep. Secondly the roof can't be very wide without supporting braces, all of which takes more material and requires stronger uprights. Thirdly the poles on the roof won't be flat, so your roof will collect water even if you pitch it at an angle.

You can make benders like this with bamboo from the garden centre too by lashing several canes together for extra strength. But blue pipe would work out cheaper and easier and coppiced poles from the woods is free as well as convenient.

If you are using straight (non bending) poles then go for a tepee or A shaped structure like the little shelters seen in bushcraft books to sleep in only larger. They would require many long poles and you lose a lot of space inside due to the pitch.

The benders only require a couple of tools that bushcrafters have anyway (knife/axe and a saw). No joints or technical woodworking skills, just the ability to tie a few knots!

 

[Tengu]

The bender idea seems a grand plan.

I have never made one but by the way things are going, Ill end up in one...

 

[Toddy]

The thing about a bender is that it can be incredibly temporary.

At this time of year my willows are four metres tall, and I can just bend them down, tie a bit of string onto the tip and fasten that down with a big peg.
They arch beautifully, let me throw a chute over the top and give me shelter enough out of the wind and the smirr.

You don't need to kill trees to make a bender if you have willow and hazel is kind of what I'm getting at.
Especially when they are out of leaf.

Just uncover them and they'll grow again. Indeed, if you just leave them they'll happily spread their roots and come up with fresh shoots in the light beside the walls.

 

[Dave Budd]

When I first took on my woods I did exactly as Toddy describes to give me some shelter to get out of the wind and rain whilst cutting. It also gave me a dry space to store tools overnight rather than carrying everything home. I did get a bit posh towards the end and bent several saplings in together and made a kind of half cone with a tarp over it about 3x4m

 

[Broch]

I have a friend who lives permanently in a bender; mind she is a specialist primitive shelter builder and builds them, and other primitive shelters, on commission

 

[bushcraftlearner83729]

Like Stew says, the strength of the bender type structure is in the arch of the roof. If you build it out of straight poles you have several problems. Firstly is that they will not be as sturdy from side loads such as wind unless the uprights are pretty chunky and driven in deep. Secondly the roof can't be very wide without supporting braces, all of which takes more material and requires stronger uprights. Thirdly the poles on the roof won't be flat, so your roof will collect water even if you pitch it at an angle.

Valid points.

and coppiced poles from the woods is free as well as convenient.

Well that is only if you happen to have bendy type trees in your woodland, which I don't as far as I know hence why I suggested the none bendy type as those are the trees I have.

Depends though, just how bendy do they have to be? Will most tree types work to a degree just that hazel or willow work better? Ones that are less bendy couldn't you just make more joints from smaller pieces to form the bends?

If you are using straight (non bending) poles then go for a tepee or A shaped structure like the little shelters seen in bushcraft books to sleep in only larger. They would require many long poles and you lose a lot of space inside due to the pitch.

The benders only require a couple of tools that bushcrafters have anyway (knife/axe and a saw). No joints or technical woodworking skills, just the ability to tie a few knots!

Yes the angular none bendy ones just seem simpler in my mind somehow.