Winter War

[pierre girard]

There was a show, "Fire and Ice" on the public channel, night before last, about the Winter War. This is history is little known in America, but of great import in the small town where I grew up, where 90% of the inhabitants were of Finnish extraction. Their were two families in our town who'd been through the winter war - one of the men having fought at "Killer Hill," where a small force of Finns killed off a large force of Russians.

The statistics are staggering. The Russians attacked Finland in November of 1939 with over 400,000 troops. Finland's army, reserves included, numbered about 300,000, and yet the Finns managed to fight them to a standstill in the early part of the war, and held on to the end when they literally ran out of ammunition. Nikita Kruschev, after the death of Stalin, estimated Russian losses at one million men.

At the beginning of the war, Finland had exactly one tank that was battle ready, while the Russians used thousands of tanks during the war. The Russians inability to coordinate their different arms of service allowed the Finns to retaliate against the tanks with their new "secret weapon," the molotov cocktail.

All in all, an almost unbelievable chapter of history, where a few men with rifles, puukos and a great "bushcraft" ability took on a technologically and numerically superior force and kept their country free because of their "sisu (intestinal fortitude)."

 

[torjusg]

Indeed, the winter war was a great feat from a Finnish point of view. Their mobility on skis were from what I have understood a major cause of the success. But to be fair they also got aid from Nazi Germany. Though the Nazis (afraid of stirring up the Russians) couldn't admit it at that time.

 

[Greg]

Sounds very much similar to the Russian invasion of Afghanistan!

 

[Doc]

I thought I had at least average knowledge of WW2 and the events leading up to it, but for some reason, in the UK, the Winter War, and the following Continuation war and Lapland War, fought by the Finns, is virtually unknown. Lots of info on the web if you look for it.

One reason is that it complicates the ethical issues - its comforting to think of WW2 as being the good guys versus the bad guys, and the evil of the Nazis made it seem a pretty clearcut divide. But the UK ended up declaring war on Finland because they were driven (by impossible circumstances) to ally themselves with the Nazis at one point.

Certainly the bravery and ability of the Finnish soldier in defence of his country was outstanding. They were able to use their pre war skills (and equipment) of hunting, shooting, concealement, navigation, ski-ing and just 'outdoorsmanship' to great effect. Interestingly the same could be said for gamekeepers and professional stalkers recruited into the Highland regiments of the British army.

 

[David B]

I thought I had at least average knowledge of WW2 and the events leading up to it, but for some reason, in the UK, the Winter War, and the following Continuation war and Lapland War, fought by the Finns, is virtually unknown. Lots of info on the web if you look for it.

I had never heard of the winter war until a week ago.
I have just returned from a Dog sledding tour in the Karelia region of Finland. The tour followed the Russian border for most of the trip.

The guide was a very knowlegable and showed us several houses that were destroyed by their owners during the war to prevent the Russions getting their hands on them.

We visited a town called KuivaJarvi that was completley destroyed, and then rebuilt after the war.
The people in the area still have a great mistrust of russia and its people.

 

[Risclean]

There's a film called The Cuckoo set in Lapland during this war. I haven't seen it, but I think it would be a good watch.

 

[xylaria]

One reason is that it complicates the ethical issues - its comforting to think of WW2 as being the good guys versus the bad guys, and the evil of the Nazis made it seem a pretty clearcut divide. But the UK ended up declaring war on Finland because they were driven (by impossible circumstances) to ally themselves with the Nazis at one point. .

Good point. It wrong for us to judge the actions of our forefathers, without any understanding what they were facing. I am Irish. The country stayed nuetral but I know Eamon deValera did deals with both sides, played one side off the other, but he had no choice. To the Irish at that the time the british did not look like good guys, they had just finshed fighting a 20year gurreilla war against them. I presume the Finnish were in simerlar position with the russians. 60 years later we can all be grateful to that generation because most europe is made of self determinded countries.

 

[Carcajou Garou]

I worked with a few of those "Finn Boys", what they did was truly courageous and does show to what extent they were "in tune" with their environment and real bush abilities and their ability to adapt, overcome, improvise. The Nazis didn't supply them to that extent just wanted a protracted engagement didn't realize the extent of Finn's resolution. Kudos Finland!!