What before RayMears?

[ChrisKavanaugh]

Everybody wants bragging rights to being first. We need to insure nobody can claim the sad title of last. I was travelling with a Cheyanne indian ( excuse me, first nations or whatever it is this week) across a stretch of california desert uninhabited for a LONG LONG time. We stopped to reconnoiter. He produced some tobacco and corn pollen and made an offering to the unknown elders and spirits who had dwelt there in the past. So heres a thankyou to everybody back to Oetzi's father's, father's father's father ad nauseum. Anyone remember reading The Epic of Gilgamesh? Who did our early city dweller have a fight with?

 

[Tony]

Good one Chris!

For me, before Ray would have been Lofty, that was the book I took with me to the Woods etc when I was young, I never did scouts etc…

 

[leon-1]

A lot of what I originally learnt was from my stepfather and my brother, which I suppose is the way it should be and my love for the outdoors seems to be in the family

 

[Gary]

And i can tell you it is not his first book

This is first edition of his second book.

His first book is the hard back green Survival handbook.

 

[Gary]

Just a thought but surely before Ray or anybody else for that matter it was Joe public - after all if was once common knowledge.

 

[peterkm]

I may be going against the grain here but it seems that Ray Mears is getting a bit of a bashing by some. Maybe this is justified and maybe not. Don't forget that there are many peolpe who are not fortunate enough to have someone to introduce them to /or teach them bushcraft and therefore hand down knowledge from one generation to another. When all is said and done it's hard to deny that he has introduced a significant number of people to bushcraft, helped to demistify it to some degree and show that not all those who are into bushcraft are Rambo-wannabies. He may well have been at the right place at the right time but I think he used that opportunity well for the good of helping to preserve and develop bushcraft.

 

[Jonesie]

Well said Peterkm! i couldn't have said it better myself.

 

[Hoodoo]

I may be going against the grain here but it seems that Ray Mears is getting a bit of a bashing by some. Maybe this is justified and maybe not. Don't forget that there are many peolpe who are not fortunate enough to have someone to introduce them to /or teach them bushcraft and therefore hand down knowledge from one generation to another. When all is said and done it's hard to deny that he has introduced a significant number of people to bushcraft, helped to demistify it to some degree and show that not all those who are into bushcraft are Rambo-wannabies. He may well have been at the right place at the right time but I think he used that opportunity well for the good of helping to preserve and develop bushcraft.

All true! It still doesn't mean he's above criticism.

 

[PurpleHeath]

i don't think that it really is a matter of who was first, because that was the chimps, your forefathers, or the person that first managed to create fire at will. long before Ray Mears.

i personally have a lot of respect for all of you because you have opened my eyes and just shown me how little i actually know about bushcraft. :notworthy :notworthy :notworthy :notworthy
but i personally think that Ray Mears, Lofty Wiseman and everyone else are doing a great job in making poeple remember/ relearn just where we came from. if you can understand?

 

[Tantalus]

i just have this sneaking feeling that this question is wrong

the real question is how did society become so distanced from "the land" ?

i was brought up in an atmosphere that included a lot of contact with nature, for me Ray Mears is no great revelation, but i seem to be one of the lucky ones and credit where credit is due RM has brought a lot of focus back onto the outdoors.

Ray is lucky to be at the right time in the right place, maybe 20 years ago he wouldve been "that nutter that sleeps in the woods" :rolmao: and your parents wouldve warned ya to keep away from him :shock:

Just some random thoughts, i appreciate all that Ray and others have done to repopularise this field

Tant

 

[Bob Hurley]

I'm glad to see Baden-Powell and friends getting due credit, they had a lot to do with creating a generation (or several) of bushcrafters and woodsmen.

While they didn't coin the phrase or write books dedicated to the subject, there were many of the early American frontiersmen who lived and died by their woods skill - Simon Kenton, Lewis Wetzel, Spencer (who lived in a hollow tree in Indian country for several years), Boone, Crockett, the list is nearly endless. Col. Henry Bouquet's letters on the requirements of frontier troops is full of bushcrafty tips, and even George Washington made some salient points about travel and stays in the back country. If you want to read about a woods traveler that just never figured things out, try Rev. Charles Woodmason's "Carolina Backcountry etc".

Kephart wrote a book that is too often overlooked by those interested in woods living - it's called "Our Southern Highlanders", and within it he describes how little is required to live indefinitely in rough country. Don't miss the descriptions of how the locals camp during a long bear hunt.

 

[DOC-CANADA]

Mors Kochanski coined and popularized the term in Canada publishing the book "Bushcraft" in I think 1987, Ray brought Mors style of wilderness living to the UK and popularized it here under the same name.

What about 'Bushcraft - A Serious Guide to Survival and Camping' by Richard Graves, 1972, LCC# 74-185329? An excellent book I might add.

Doc

 

[tomtom]

maybe we should all search our bushcraft library and find the earliest mention of the word.. doesn't Nessmuk mention it a some point...?

 

[Gary]

Tomtom I have a copy of Daniel Boone by Hartley and the inscription in side the front cover reads @walter Listman,From his S.S teache, Emma t Barry, Christmas 1897' this is when the book was given and the only date on it. Anyway Hartley mentions how Boone and his brother used 'bushcraft and their uncommon knowledge of the woodland lore during his first long excersion to the west'

Gotta be one of the first written references!

 

[tomtom]

ooh.. good one gary.. when was Thompson-Seaton around before i go and search through it?

 

[Gary]

Not sure Tomtom.

Does anybody know if Roy Croft ever wrote a book?

Another interesting thought, if Ray had managed to pass his army/marine selection and had joined the forces I wonder if bushcraft would be as popular as it is? Maybe he'd have joined the forces camp and this site would now be called SurvivalUK!!

Just a thought ..... now back to Roy Croft..........

 

[Hoodoo]

My copy of The Book of Woodcraft by Seton is a reprint of the 1921 edition.

I went to Project Gutenberg (www.gutenberg.org) and did a text search on "woodcraft" and came up with 281 hits. Don't have time to sort through them right now but there's some wonderful historical stuff there.

 

[bombadil]

No longer. John Seymour died on September 14, 2004.

Burnt Ash

Very sad news indeed. He definately had a big role to play in the growth of my interest and knowledge of self-sufficiency and bushcrafty skills.
RIP, John

 

[bombadil]

Incidentally, as I have just realised that I'm currently at the end of this thread, I may as well mention my hero, the great John Muir. True, he rarely divulges any wilderness living skills in his writings and he never wrote a book on bushcraft, but if he can go out into the deepest bush with nothing but hard bread and tea, and very often without a coat, he's the daddy! :biggthump :biggthump :biggthump

 

[Adi]

I don’t think Roy Croft wrote a book.

If Ray had made it in the forces I don’t think there would be so many people using hammocks and axes/tomahawks in our woods. Both a waste of time in my kit bag, as for the axe, I agree has its uses in our woods but to be honest it’s a bit of kit that I would only consider taking to the artic snow line or on an extended trip to the woods of Europe, Russia, USA or Canada, I have no need to carry one in this country.

As for the hammock, I think only a fool would use a hammock in this country in anything less than the best of summer weather. The hammock is for tropics. Its used to lift you of the ground from all the creepy crawlies and wet forest floor whilst helping to keep you cool in the hot and humid conditions by letting the air to circulate around your body. I our climate you are far better off spending the night on the floor with some form of insulation beneath you and a barrier from the elements. I have seen mild hyperthermia in someone that spent a night in a hammock during the summer just gone, crazy.

Don’t get me wrong some people may think I don’t like Ray but that’s not the case I really admire him. But, I have spent at least 40 nights a year for the last 20 years in the woods, travelled in 47 country’s around the world for one reason or another and have spent nights under my poncho in most, I have gained experience and made many mistakes, some life threatening. Ray has brought Bushcraft to the front room and has made it look easy. Which is great but how many times dose he do some thing and people try to emulate it in the wrong environment? How many people spend a weekend in the woods and go home wet, cold and hungry, How many give up during the first night and retreat to there cars?, how many have lost, misplaced or broken kit? And how many think its ok I will be going home tomorrow. How many by the kit never test it or practice with it, have never been camping or is overweight never exercises apart from walking up the stairs to get to his office in the morning but decide to through the there new kit in a ruck and head for the hills.

I fear that Ray has encouraged many to take on to much too soon. There were many before Ray but they were not pumped into our front rooms and made into household names. In most cases you used to have an interest in spending time in the outdoors and then you discovered the books now you watch it on TV and think I can do that I will do it this weekend!