sub-survival kit design

[SMARTY]

Does anyone include a rescue beacon or strobe light in their kit? I was under the impression that being found and then rescued is the ultimate result to any survival situation. PLB's are not that expensive and rescue strobe lights are small enough to be carried in your pocket.

 

[Beer Monster]

Does anyone include a rescue beacon or strobe light in their kit? I was under the impression that being found and then rescued is the ultimate result to any survival situation. PLB's are not that expensive and rescue strobe lights are small enough to be carried in your pocket.

PLB as they say takes the search out of search and rescue, however, aren’t they prohibitively expensive at the moment? I thought they were £600 plus? I'm currently looking for a good strobe light so if anyone has any good recommendations it would be much appreciated (there seem to be so many different types out there!).

 

[Mikey P]

It is important to stress though that no food or drink should be given to an unconcious casualty, the priority is to get them to hospital.

Good - it's not just me, then with the sugar thing. I thought I might have dreamt it!

I think the idea is that, rather than the casualty 'eat' the sugar, a very small amount is placed under the tongue, where it will dissolve.

As I mentioned, I would be interested if there are any doctors/nurses/med techs out there who can fill us in on this.

 

[sam_acw]

Pocket Strobe
Firefly Plus
C-Light
This is the smallest but a PDF page
Adventure Lights

That should settle the strobes!

 

[SMARTY]

Heres a site that may be of use for PLB sales. http://www.mcmurdo.co.uk One solution could be a GPS and mobile phone. provided you have a signal tou can direct any SAR assets to your location. Strobe lights are generally under a tenner. They probably wont fit into your survival tin, but will fit into a small pouch or day sack.

 

[JohnC]

I've used glucose powder (in a ward situation) prior to getting iv access for fluids for a diabetic having a hypo. It's very soluble and quickly taken up. It was placed under the toungue or along the gums IIRC. Some people with diabetes will carry glucose sweets/tablets with them.

 

[Freds Dad]

I made up one a few years back to amuse my Scouts. i've just dug it out to see what i put in it. I remember that some of them giggled a lot at some of the contents. Here is what I put in it.

For a start the 'bacci' tin is a cooking untensil

An opinal no.3 knife
Flint and steel
2 isoproponal wipes ( use for cleaning and fire lighting)
Small fishing kit containing 4lb line (about 20m), a number of AAA split shot and various hooks from size 16 to 6 (small fish are easier to catch), a few float rubbers.
Small sewing kit with strong thread and a selection of needles (can be used on clothing or flesh)
A small button compass
A wire saw with cord loops at the ends
Plasters
Steristrips
Imodeum tablets
Pain killers (co-codamol)
Water purification tablets
A few metres of string
2 tampons ( embarrasses the girls)
2 condoms ( embarrasses the boys and girls) for water collection.
A small thin mirror (glued to inside of lid)

Wrap the tin in thin strips of duct tape to keep it all in and stop you pilfering it when you don't really need to.

My name and address is painted on the lid so if the tin doesn't work they'll know who to return it and the attached skelington to for disposal.

 

[longshot]

Slightly off topic but I think that it doesn't matter what type of diabetes the patient has. If it's one sort, it'll make no difference; if it's the other siort it could save a life. So, in that case, it's always worth putting a small amount of sugar under the tongue of an unconscious patient.

I would really appreciate it if anyone with medical experience out there could verify this . If it's true, what with the increase in diabetes amongst the population, a small amount of sugar could be a really good idea for the sub-survival kit.

rule of thumb when in doubt give sugar.

Hypo glycemic is when the person really needs sugar trust me on that one i dealt with sudden drops of blood sugar in my daily life and my wife is diabetic as well.

dean

 

[crazydave]

PLB as they say takes the search out of search and rescue, however, aren’t they prohibitively expensive at the moment? I thought they were £600 plus? I'm currently looking for a good strobe light so if anyone has any good recommendations it would be much appreciated (there seem to be so many different types out there!).

I have two - one from tandy which is a neat little unit and works off of a c cell battery and one military one I never gave back - the mil one works as and infra red one too so if you get lost in the brecons us might be able to get a lift back with them they are a bit costly for a hope I never use it ppiece of kit which is why I got the tandy one - it was a tenner I think is water proof and has a velcro stap along with a magnet to fix on a car roof.

I did wonder whether I should have kept a sabre but the batteries are hard to get.

Improvise wise several rescues have been acheived due to the use of camera flashes.

ebay as ever has all sorts

 

[sargey]

i've found that the most useful items in an everyday pocket kit are the compass for navigating round strange towns, and sewing kit/ small safety pins. especially useful when a young lady in the office has a had a skirt split or zip failure incident

don't over look the humble oxo/boullion cube for a drink. rob coffee and sugar sachets from every hotel room you visit

in addition to the sit down have a brew philosophy, no reason why a confirmed smoker shouldn't have a clingfilm wrapped cigarette or two in a pocket kit.

my own mini mini kit is built into a K&M match safe which hangs round my neck 24/7, yes i even sleep with it on. my wife detests it!

i usually remember to remove it before plane flights from the uk, but it has been through several flights returning to the uk after a holiday. it's never been detected by metal detectors at airports, including seven detectors in one day at an airport in dubai when i had to remove both my watch and belt & buckle. that's a not a recommendation, just an observation.

ron hood has some interesting ideas if you manage to see a copy of his survival kit video.

cheers, and.

 

[Hunter Gatherer]

Slightly off topic but I think that it doesn't matter what type of diabetes the patient has. If it's one sort, it'll make no difference; if it's the other siort it could save a life. So, in that case, it's always worth putting a small amount of sugar under the tongue of an unconscious patient.

I would really appreciate it if anyone with medical experience out there could verify this . If it's true, what with the increase in diabetes amongst the population, a small amount of sugar could be a really good idea for the sub-survival kit.

I am a 50 year old diabetic(type 2) thats the 'type' that is in epidemic proportions in the industrialized west(might be a connection there,industrialized everything = increased in diabetes)...anyway suger would be of no help to a type 2 diabetic, and if a diabetic is unconcious it is likely that he/she has been without their meds for long enough to slip into diabetic coma. IMMEDIATE medical attention required within hours!
Now if you are looking to carry suger for any other purpose(ie emergency suppliment, energy,etc) why not carry a small amount of chocolate. You get similar amounts of sugar, but also as an energy bonus lots of fat(long term slow energy release) and caffiene...all good for an energy boost/head clearer.
Just my 2 pence worth.
A.

 

[Not that Taz]

Important (but again slightly off topic) Note!!

Another quick thought...

Given that for a diabetic there is Hypoglycemia and Hyperglycemia (one being too little sugar and one being too much), just randomly stuffing sugar into them could well end up exacerbating the whole thing!

If you've got a diabetic and they have a serious problem and collapse - get them to seriously qualified medical help first and foremost!

Taz

 

[rik_uk3]

http://www.diabetes.org.uk/infocentre/inform/hypostop.htm

 

[Jodie]

Note: I am NOT medically trained, always seek professional advice etc. etc.

Hypoglycaemia (low blood glucose) is a consequence of the treatment
for diabetes and not of diabetes itself.

Anyone treated with insulin or sulphonylurea tablets is at risk from
hypoglycaemia, regardless of whether they have Type 1 or Type 2 (or
any other kind) of diabetes.

People with Type 1 diabetes have no insulin of their own and rely on
injected insulin to stay healthy; people with Type 2 diabetes may be
on insulin depending on how long they have had the condition
(they may use other tablets that do not cause hypos, or may not need
to take any medication for their condition).

Most hypos are heralded by early warning symptoms which alert the
person that their blood glucose levels are dropping. This can
usually be remedied by them taking something sugary - glucose tablets
are ideal.

Some people do not have these warning symptoms, or if they are
unable to take something sugary then the glucose levels will fall
further and the person may become unconscious.

Glucogel (the new name for Hypostop) is an edible gel that can be
taken by a conscious patient:
http://www.glucogel.co.uk/information.asp?INFOID=2

Glucogel should not be given to people who are unconscious because
of the risk of choking.

If the person is unconscious, and they have GlucaGen (glucagon) in
their kit then this can be given as an injection into the muscles.
This link takes you to the patient information leaflet for GlucaGen
(the leaflet would usually be within the packaging) and it contains
advice on how to prepare the glucagon hormone for injection.
http://emc.medicines.org.uk/emc/assets/c/html/displaydoc.asp?documentid=4257
You'd really only do this if you knew what you were doing though.

Hyperglycaemia is a direct consequence of diabetes; raised blood
glucose levels can cause long term damage and complications.

It becomes a critical problem only in the absence of any insulin
when glucose levels become high and the body turns to its reserves
of fat and muscle for fuel. This can seriously muck up the body's
biochemistry leading to 'diabetic ketoacidosis' (DKA). This is a
medical emergency and needs urgent treatment in hospital or similar.

DKA is very preventable - as long as insulin is available, and
typically would take a day or so to become very serious - but it
is very serious when it happens.

Hypos are technically preventable, but can sneak up unawares and
can happen in a very short space of time - usually they are less
serious and only rarely have a problematic recovery.

The rate at which insulin is absorbed into the bloodstream from the
injection site also varies with temperature. Also the machinery used
to measure blood glucose levels appears to be vaguely altitude-
sensitive so in some situations it can be a bit tricky.

I think that's about right, but I bet I'll suddenly think of something and
pop back and edit it

Jo

 

[waylander]

I am type 2 diabetic as are my parents (there on insulin I'm diet controlled). If in dowt give sugar as that is the most likell reason of unconciousness, allthough too much sugar is worse in terms of a comma it is usually whjat is needed. Bearing that in mind when I was first diagnosed I was told that mine probably wouldnt go to low it was more likely to go high. In the end it has to be your decision.

 

[bilko]

Just some things iv'e thought of :

£1 coin, you never know
Silk hankerchief ( water filtration, alf garnet hat, torneque, gas mask for smoke in fire )
Small bag of chia seeds
collapsable small metal cup usually found with hip flasks
Night light candle stowed inside cup
Half a pencil ( the ones that write on glass ) for help messages
Big strong type paperclip ( lockpicking, clothes fastener )
Satchet of diahrolite
Can you make fire from the radio battery and some fuse wire? , if so then some fuse wire.

 

[Martyn]

Slightly off topic but I think that it doesn't matter what type of diabetes the patient has. If it's one sort, it'll make no difference; if it's the other siort it could save a life. So, in that case, it's always worth putting a small amount of sugar under the tongue of an unconscious patient.

I would really appreciate it if anyone with medical experience out there could verify this . If it's true, what with the increase in diabetes amongst the population, a small amount of sugar could be a really good idea for the sub-survival kit.

Hypo... = low
Hyper... = high

eg... hypothermic, hypotensive, hypoglycemic etc.

A normal blood sugar is tightly controlled by your own body to around 5 to 6 mmol/l

Hypoglycemia is the dangerous one, if blood sugar in a diabetic drops down to around 2 mmol/l you quickly loose conciousness. If the pt isnt given sugar somehow, they will pass into a coma and could easily/will die. It's a fairly rapid onset condition, usually with some warning signs, shakes etc.

Hyperglycemia isnt so dangerous in the short term. Many diabetics have high blood sugars, especially if they cant keep off the chocolate and beer. Some are walking around with blood sugars of 30 mmol/l - the short term effects are not immediately life threatening, but the long term effects are. Loss of the extremities, particularly the feet is common, as is vision problems or even blindness. DKA is a bad state, but it's not common and not sudden onset.

So, if you find someone in a sudden onset diabetic coma, it'll be a hypo and the correct treatment will be to give them sugar under the tongue, or check them to see if they have a hypostop jab or something.

 

[Martyn]

Glucogel should not be given to people who are unconscious because
of the risk of choking.

That's reasonable if you are in a hospital or if help is soon at hand, but you have to remember that if the patient doesnt get some sugar in their blood soon, they will lapse into a coma and end up brain-damaged or dead.

You have to assess the situation.

 

[drstrange]

The harrogate toffee tin is a decent size and pretty flat. (No 1, that is)
.

The Harrogate toffee tin is ok, but I'm not sure I like the shade of blue that is on the tin, or is it a reflection from the material on which the various toffee tins are arranged (please clarify).
Also, before I buy a tin to convert, are the toffees filling-extractors, or are they like the soft version of 'Werthers originals' (my preference but they don't do them in tins, nice adverts tho).
Also, do you not think that portioned toffee is a bit gimmicky? I think that the unbroken toffee slab of old is better, they came with a little hammer that could be re-purposed as a possible bushcraft tool.
Anyway, there are obviously lots of issues regarding the toffee tin which need to be addresed before it is a no-braner candidate as survival tin.

 

[rik_uk3]

Hypo... = low
Hyper... = high

eg... hypothermic, hypotensive, hypoglycemic etc.

A normal blood sugar is tightly controlled by your own body to around 5 to 6 mmol/l

Hypoglycemia is the dangerous one, if blood sugar in a diabetic drops down to around 2 mmol/l you quickly loose consciousness. If the pt isn't given sugar somehow, they will pass into a coma and could easily/will die. It's a fairly rapid onset condition, usually with some warning signs, shakes etc.

Hyperglycemia isnt so dangerous in the short term. Many diabetics have high blood sugars, especially if they cant keep off the chocolate and beer. Some are walking around with blood sugars of 30 mmol/l - the short term effects are not immediately life threatening, but the long term effects are. Loss of the extremities, particularly the feet is common, as is vision problems or even blindness. DKA is a bad state, but it's not common and not sudden onset.

So, if you find someone in a sudden onset diabetic coma, it'll be a hypo and the correct treatment will be to give them sugar under the tongue, or check them to see if they have a hypostop jab or something.

I once removed the socks of a diabetic day patient, and some toes were in one of them (the poor person did not bath or change clothes often)

I would give sugar under the tongue or between the cheeks and the teeth (side of mouth) and get help ASAP, but that's just me, not firm advice