Can anyone help me?

[Martyn]

Mick, you have answered your own questions which is why they were completely pointless.

It's just a knife. Can any knife justify a £700 price tag merely as a cutting tool? No of course not.

End of!

The woodlore is an excellent knife, but at the end of the day, it's just a bit of hardened O1 tool steel with a couple of bits of wood glued on and ground to shape. Is it 35 times better than a £20 mora? No! It's sharp and it cuts stuff, but it's not magic and it's not a lightsabre. It's as functional as any other scandi-ground carbon steel knife. Of course people are paying for the brand, of course they are paying for the collect-ability and of course it's a fashion thing, but so what? If someone want to spend £700 or £70,000 on a knife, what do you care, it's not your money?

That bark river you reviewed, how much did it cost you? $200 - $250 right? How do you justify that? It's just steel and wood - how can it be 10 times better than a $20 mora? It obviously isn't, a mora with do everything the bark river will do equally well at 10% of the cost - so that must mean you are paying for something else, something that is not actually needed. You are paying for a brand name, or perhaps pride of ownership - whatever, the intelligent choice would always be the frosts mora. Everything else ....everything, is just pointless extravagance. But why not, it's your money.

With regard to the design of the woodlore, it's excellent. Next to a Bob Loveless drop point hunter, it's probably the most copied design on the planet. Even your BR Liten Bror is just a downsized clone of a woodlore and I dont really need to see videos of it being hammered through logs to get that it is probably just as functional as I would expect it to be.

 

[SouthernCross]

G'day Martyn

....That bark river you reviewed, how much did it cost you? $200 - $250 right? How do you justify that? It's just steel and wood - how can it be 10 times better than a $20 mora? It obviously isn't, a mora with do everything the bark river will do equally well at 10% of the cost - so that must mean you are paying for something else, something that is not actually needed. You are paying for a brand name, or perhaps pride of ownership - whatever, the intelligent choice would always be the frosts mora. Everything else ....everything, is just pointless extravagance. But why not, it's your money. .....

Actually delivered from the US it cost AU $189.06 (including $12.00 postage).

I was prepared to pay this for several reasons:
(1) I wanted to try the 3V steel.
(2) A convex grind requires a skilled hand. When you consider the extra abrasion resistance of the 3V, it takes longer to grind, therefore labour costs are higher.
(3) I realise that smaller scale operations don't benefit from economies of scale like larger scale manufacturers can.

Is it 10 times better than a Mora?

IMO, yes.

There's a very good reason why I haven't used a mora for Bushcraft in something like 20 years. Without a reprofile of the edge by either adding a more obtuse secondary V bevel or convex at the edge, they have a tendency to chip / roll when used on our twisted grained & knotty seasoned hardwoods. Also, in my experience their edge holding (again when used on the types of wood I have available for bushcraft) isn't that great to be honest.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I value edge retention in a knife that's seeing use in Bushcraft (especially when you consider the nature of our hardwoods). I much rather be using the knife to get a job finished, than stopping to resharpen a dull blade. Multiply that advantage over the many sessions I've used the Liten Bror in since I got it & yes I reckon it is more than 10 times better than a Mora.



Kind regards
Mick

 

[Tony]

It's good when we use a knife we really like, I think we tend to use it a bit better which is always good, sounds like you found the knife for you, at least for now.
As Martyn says, knives are only worth what people pay for them, some have more value than others to different people, thats the same for everything in life.

 

[Karl82]

i stoped read posts half way down as i started to get board you want to know why the RM Alan Wood Knives are so valued on ebay/fourms its simple supply and demand people dont want to wait they have more money than sence, its only since the general population has become aware of RM and his AW knife it has become so valued on Ebay/fourms as their are collecters and such. the price on RM website i belive hasent changed much in the last few years so if you realy want one and dont want to pay 700 pounds the WAIT for it.

 

[sandbender]

"...Actually delivered from the US it cost AU $189.06 (including $12.00 postage)..."

Taking inflation into account that is probably more than I paid for my AW Woodlore all those years ago.

 

[sapper1]

If I had £700 to spend on a knife I possibly would buy the woodlore on ebay .Not to use as a knife (the handles are too small for me)but I think it would be a good investment to keep and sell at a later date when the price has risen.As it has over the last few years.

 

[Hoodoo]

G'day Martyn
There's a very good reason why I haven't used a mora for Bushcraft in something like 20 years.

Nearly 50 years ago when I was in Boy Scouts I was whittling fuzz sticks and making fireboards for friction fire and all we had were Western and Schrade knives with 1095 carbon steel. Hard to imagine eh? Didn't know then that I needed 3V steel to do bushcraft. Ya learn something new everyday. When the knife got dull, we just sharpened it. :borgsmile

For some stupid reason or other, I still kinda like cheap carbon steel knives. This one has worked well for the past decade.

 

[JonathanD]

The reason I would like to see video is that IMO a couple of pics really doesn't show how well a knife works in use.

Also seeing a knife being used over an extended period of time (obviously bearing in mind the limitations imposed by video hosting websites for the length of any single video) will provide information on the edge retention by showing how well the knife continues to cut throughout the video. This is something a couple of pictures can't do.

Call me cynical, but video will also give me an accurate idea as to whether the reviewer is able to give an informed opinion of the comfort of the handle in extended use. Why? Because IMO there is a big difference in the comfort of a handle when used for a couple of minutes as opposed to being used continuously for much longer periods of time.

My request about wanting to see if the woodlore has been used on more than green softwoods is because there is a difference in how a knife will perform when used on seasoned hardwoods (which is what I have access to). Again this is to get an idea of how versatile the woodlore is and how robust the supplied grind is.

Mick, you say you want to watch someone who knows how to use knives putting the Woodlore through it's paces. In that case, RM himself ticks all the boxes for you. Why don't you watch the DVD extras of him carving and using it for extended periods on hardwoods and softwoods. The net needle and chopping board are two such examples that fit the bill.

I really don't see how you can make a judgement on the comfort of the handle like that though. It may be comfortable enough for RM and loads of other people, but it won't show whether you will find it comfortable. We are all different and it is a handmade knife, so every knife will be slightly different too. The only way you will be able to make an informed decision yourself is to get your hands on one and use it. There is no other substitute for that.

 

[Waldganger]

and I know where you can get one for 700 quid

 

[MartinK9]

and I know where you can get one for 700 quid

Just one? I have a few I'd get rid off for that price

 

[John Fenna]

Nearly 50 years ago when I was in Boy Scouts I was whittling fuzz sticks and making fireboards for friction fire and all we had were Western and Schrade knives with 1095 carbon steel. Hard to imagine eh? Didn't know then that I needed 3V steel to do bushcraft. Ya learn something new everyday. When the knife got dull, we just sharpened it. :borgsmile

For some stupid reason or other, I still kinda like cheap carbon steel knives. This one has worked well for the past decade.

I too like that knife - though I tend to rehandle that kind to get them to fit my grip better - Nice sheath!

 

[John Fenna]

It did sound like you wanted to slag off the woodlore mate! Ray's top dog in bushcraft hes not going to design and use a load of crap , is he?
.

Erm - he did design that Wilkinson Sword "Survival knife" - the one that people thought bril until they tried using it ...and the aluminium nut on the threaded steel tang stripped and the handle fell off....

 

[Mesquite]

Just one? I have a few I'd get rid off for that price

But I bet you wouldn't....

 

[MartinK9]

But I bet you wouldn't....

I'll take that bet

 

[Hoodoo]

Erm - he did design that Wilkinson Sword "Survival knife" - the one that people thought bril until they tried using it ...and the aluminium nut on the threaded steel tang stripped and the handle fell off....

Shoulda made the nut out of 3V.

 

[SouthernCross]

G'day Sandbender

Taking inflation into account that is probably more than I paid for my AW Woodlore all those years ago.

Just to clarify a point.

As a pretty accurate rule of thumb when it comes to the exchange rate between the British pound & the Aussie dollar, one Brirtish pound is worth about 2 Aussie dollars.

So if the add you have included shows the price you paid all those years ago (ie 150 pounds), then all those years ago you would have been paying around $300.00 Aussie $ (making it about 1 & 1/2 times what I paid for the Liten Bror at the start of this year).

Now if you take inflation into account, you would have almost certainly have paid more than twice what I did.



Kind regards
Mick

 

[SouthernCross]

G'day Hoodoo

Nearly 50 years ago when I was in Boy Scouts I was whittling fuzz sticks and making fireboards for friction fire and all we had were Western and Schrade knives with 1095 carbon steel. Hard to imagine eh? Didn't know then that I needed 3V steel to do bushcraft. Ya learn something new everyday. When the knife got dull, we just sharpened it. :borgsmile

For some stupid reason or other, I still kinda like cheap carbon steel knives. This one has worked well for the past decade.

Would you be so kind to point out where I said you need 3V to do bushcraft?

As a matter of fact, I'm sure you remember I have also pointed out that 3G makes a good bushcraft steel as found in the Fallkniven TK2. Just to refresh your memory, have a look at post #18 http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53342.

Now bear in mind, the linked post was also made despite the dominant thought being expressed on the internet that stainless isn't suitable for Bushcraft.

I thought I had qualified the following statement well enough to have avoided any misunderstanding:

"I can't speak for anyone else, but I value edge retention in a knife that's seeing use in Bushcraft (especially when you consider the nature of our hardwoods). I much rather be using the knife to get a job finished, than stopping to resharpen a dull blade".

Obviously I was in error

Since your located in the Nth 1/2 of the US, care to share with me the type of wood you played with as a boy scout?

Are we talking about what you guys in the US call Oak or are we talking about a softwood?

Because if you are talking about Oak, I really don't think you have an appreciation of the difference between what you may class as a hardwood and what I class as a hardwood. Have a look here & you might just learn something else: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janka_hardness_test .

BTW most of the Hardwoods I have available for bushcraft range between Sydney Blue Gum & Spotted Gum for hardness

Now remember, when I'm talking about a bushcraft knife, I'm talking about a knife that's suitable for the type of wood available to me (which is seasoned Aussie hardwood ).

If you were using the sort of wood that I am and are willing to spend as much time sharpening your knife as you spend using it, then that is your right.

If it wasn't clear from my previous posts, I'll repeat it. This is not something I'm prepared to do with the type of hardwood that I have available .




Kind regards
Mick

 

[SouthernCross]

To all those who have appeared to have taken offense at my use of bolding, I have a question to ask you all.

Since the typed word on the internet inherently lacks the "suble communication that comes from a change in tone of the voice", the "suble facial expressions that can be used to emphasise a point", the "communication that can be conveyed by hand expressions" and a number of other "subtle aids to communication" that can come from "face to face communication" how do you suggest that I convey the points that I wish to emphasise?

Because clearly, either I'm either in need of help, or others shouldn't be so sensitive to be reading more into my posts than are there



Kind regards
Mick

 

[Waldganger]

maybe you should also use italics

I am a little sad that I cannot just go out and harvest some decent wood for making a kuksa or spoon, our woods are too darn hard!!

If you have any suggestions what I could use Mick for some nicely figured but not to damn hard wood for carving that I could harvest locally that would be much appreciated

cheers

 

[jojo]

Sometimes, I wonder how the people at the United Nations manage to agree on anything!