My personal philosophy...
Carry more, know less.
I'm sure the bushcraft police will be along shortly to arrest me, but until they do, I shall continue to be a shameless gear geek.
I like the gear, I just hate carrying it
atb,
M
bushcrafters or gear geeks?
- Thread starter Peter_t
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I like the gear, I just hate carrying it
atb,
M
thank you colin you have summed up my thoughts
bushcrafter and gear geek? imo this is a bit of a contradiction. is one of the main points in bushcraft not to replace gear with knowledge? i know we can't afford to cut down half a dozen trees for the sake of not carrying a shelter but i think my point is still valid otherwise we would just be campers. for this reason i try to limit myself to just essential equipment so to come close to nature and its resources but not so much as to do lasting damage.
Bushcraft is becoming too commercialised, not in its teaching but in equipment. Things are becoming labelled as bushcraft. before this new image of bushcraft came along mora knives where known as knives not bushcraft knives. I think this commercialisation is against the spirit of bushcraft and often makes bushcraft look like an expensive hobby with its must have axes and hammocks. Bushcraft certainly does not have to be expensive but this new image makes it seem so.
i am sorry if i have caused offence, i am just expressing my opinion.
pete
Before it was all labeled "Bushcraft" it was all labeled "Survival" - salesmen jump on the latest buzz word to make their sales...the hobby stays as expensive as you want!
Eh? I am a camper. Whether it's in a field with my whole family in a 5 room tent or solo in the woods without a tent in December it's all camping. Bushcraft is just a different kind of camping to those people crammed in side by side in dayglo nylon tents. Why is it whether it's a kind of music, religion or a lifestyle as soon as it becomes popularised people start bangin on about it becoming "Too commercial"? Nobody is making anybody buy kit they don't want! Personally I'm delighted to see more variety and better techical specification in available kit, it's a hell of a lot easier than trying to make a tarp from half a canvas tent or a flint striker from zippo flints. Both things I started out doing.
It's a pastime, not a religion. There is no dogma. It's about personal freedom.
I read less than 10% of the threads on here, more often than not I make my mind up just reading the title.
If I find a thread that's not my cup of tea I don't stress about it.
I have my own opinions about commercial kit, I buy some and I avoid some. If I can't get stuff I like I make it instead.
The one thing I have learned in all this time is that one man's meat is another man's poison. No one solution is going to suit every person in every environment and every lifestyle.
Personally I dislike walking around feeling like I'm wrapped in a crisp packet but I'm prepared to put up with the reduced performance and extra weight that natural materials entail. My choice and I'm happy with it.
I scanned the post you are referring to and didn't add anything because I didn't have anything useful to add. I'm sure some people enjoyed putting their opinion forward and perhaps some people learned from it. Isn't that what a forum is all about?
I'm sure we all prefer to be out and about doing stuff. I've walked my dog in two different woods today and I've spent some time kolrosing a trencher in between reading a book and watching Ray's last program. A fairly typical day I guess.
Just because I also find some time to browse the internet doesn't mean I'm being geeky and personally I find the tired refrain about getting out there and doing "Bushcraft" rather ironic when it's transmitted to me via a computer terminal.
If I find a thread that's not my cup of tea I don't stress about it.
I have my own opinions about commercial kit, I buy some and I avoid some. If I can't get stuff I like I make it instead.
The one thing I have learned in all this time is that one man's meat is another man's poison. No one solution is going to suit every person in every environment and every lifestyle.
Personally I dislike walking around feeling like I'm wrapped in a crisp packet but I'm prepared to put up with the reduced performance and extra weight that natural materials entail. My choice and I'm happy with it.
I scanned the post you are referring to and didn't add anything because I didn't have anything useful to add. I'm sure some people enjoyed putting their opinion forward and perhaps some people learned from it. Isn't that what a forum is all about?
I'm sure we all prefer to be out and about doing stuff. I've walked my dog in two different woods today and I've spent some time kolrosing a trencher in between reading a book and watching Ray's last program. A fairly typical day I guess.
Just because I also find some time to browse the internet doesn't mean I'm being geeky and personally I find the tired refrain about getting out there and doing "Bushcraft" rather ironic when it's transmitted to me via a computer terminal.
Well said!
I spent most of my day indoors wearing the most rediculous clothing and wishing I was outside - first full run through of the the Panto I am in this season!
Well, of course people should buy whatever they want. Free country, and all that.
Still it's worth considering that on a basic wage, a Mora knife can be bought with 2 hours labour, but a Woodlore knife would take perhaps two weeks of work to buy.
Given that our most precious - and limited - possession is time, it might be wiser to spend two weeks out in wild country for the delight of it, rather than spending that fortnight grafting as a wage-slave to buy another shiney. But it's a personal choice.
And I will not deny that good kit is worth having - someone once said that when you buy really good binos, the pain of shelling out the cash is soon forgotten, but the delight is freshly there every time you use them. I've found that to be true.
Still it's worth considering that on a basic wage, a Mora knife can be bought with 2 hours labour, but a Woodlore knife would take perhaps two weeks of work to buy.
Given that our most precious - and limited - possession is time, it might be wiser to spend two weeks out in wild country for the delight of it, rather than spending that fortnight grafting as a wage-slave to buy another shiney. But it's a personal choice.
And I will not deny that good kit is worth having - someone once said that when you buy really good binos, the pain of shelling out the cash is soon forgotten, but the delight is freshly there every time you use them. I've found that to be true.
Another way of looking at this is that some people. probably most, want SOME good gear as they have learnt that it is more comfotable & a better experience out in the wilds to have have that kit. For me it's a good pair of high waterproof boots & a nice green Musto 3/4 length jacket. I use both most days of the week for 5 years now and have been out in the rain for hours (with waterproof trousers) and have been OK. They were not cheap but have lasted where a cheap set would not have & I know that I will stay dry. Is that being a gear geek or just buying wisely with the spare funds you have for things that you use and make you happy? Probably a bit of both for most people.
In other words a few good bits of kit gives you the confidance you will be all right. Most of my other gear is stuff I have bought 2nd hand or already hand. The exception is a knife, where I have been using a Mora clipper since I started and have chosen not to buy something fancy until I have the knife basics well covered, can sharpen it without ruining it & have tried other peoples ones. Then, and only then, I will spend not a small amount on something good, that I expect will last me at least 10 years & be a pleasure to use every time I pick it up.
I have not been to many meets but I cant imagine there are many that are over run with people in £3000's worth of gear weilding £500 knives. There does seem to be a a few who believe that you are are only a proper buscrafter if all you carry is a £5 pen knife & a wool blanket. For the rest of us it will a mixture of mostly OK stuff, with a few nice things, some home made & the odd bit of rubbish kit; which is much more interesting and how it should be in my book. Just my 2p's worth.
In other words a few good bits of kit gives you the confidance you will be all right. Most of my other gear is stuff I have bought 2nd hand or already hand. The exception is a knife, where I have been using a Mora clipper since I started and have chosen not to buy something fancy until I have the knife basics well covered, can sharpen it without ruining it & have tried other peoples ones. Then, and only then, I will spend not a small amount on something good, that I expect will last me at least 10 years & be a pleasure to use every time I pick it up.
I have not been to many meets but I cant imagine there are many that are over run with people in £3000's worth of gear weilding £500 knives. There does seem to be a a few who believe that you are are only a proper buscrafter if all you carry is a £5 pen knife & a wool blanket. For the rest of us it will a mixture of mostly OK stuff, with a few nice things, some home made & the odd bit of rubbish kit; which is much more interesting and how it should be in my book. Just my 2p's worth.
Cheek! - I am the Baron!
With gear I find the most important thing is that you can trust the gear you have to perform as you want it to....price, who made it, what it looks like and what other people think of you for using it are all very much secondary considerations.....
Thats primarily the reason i get Army Surplus. mostly its made to last and so it'll stand up to what you need it to do. price wise surplus varies and don't get me started on the mish mosh of camo patterns i have lol.
still it does the job and thats what counts
Actually case in point. i own one of these:
http://www.soviet-propaganda.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1_24&products_id=1
i have a contact in St Petersburg that gets em direct from the Sposn Factory. they're treated duck cotton, totally wind proof and rain resistant!
its also bomb proof, seriously if i was caught in a nuclear blast i reckon the jacket would be the only thing left!
as you can see they're $120 before shipping from russia shipping is usually $60 or so. so around £102 for the full set. although if you contact the guy on the site he should be able to do just the jacket if you wish.
expensive in my eyes as that kind of money is not easily available to me but well worth it for what i'd consider "Gucci" gear
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Not so much a gear geek but most certainly and aesthetic fiend. Just as with how a rifle scope SHOULD be mounted to an action (so it looks an integral flowing part of the whole) I like my outdoor gear to be equally pleasing and to MY idea of what is RIGHT and no others.
Sometimes that costs hundreds of pounds and sports RM-linked labels but often as many hours as I care to spend converting some cheep bit of kit with the 'potential' to conform with my ideal.
I was about to add that none of this makes me a better hunter but given the confidence boost of feeling all is right perhaps it does.
Of course to you I may simply look an expensively attired plonker!
Cheers
Sometimes that costs hundreds of pounds and sports RM-linked labels but often as many hours as I care to spend converting some cheep bit of kit with the 'potential' to conform with my ideal.
I was about to add that none of this makes me a better hunter but given the confidence boost of feeling all is right perhaps it does.
Of course to you I may simply look an expensively attired plonker!
Cheers
A very pragmatic approach. I think we all accept that basic skills can be learnt using basic equipment. At this point, we branch off: those with the money and the inclination (or those without the money but a willingness to work and save) may wish to improve their gear to improve their experience. Furthermore, clearly, many of us get a bit of a kick out of having a new bit of kit and then showing others and talking about it.
However, some of us are more austere (not sure if that's the correct word) and wish to improve our skills using the same bits of kit we started with.
Like Neumo, I started off with a Frost Mora. I still have it. It is used for gardening and work (DIY, etc) for which it does admirably well. I keep it clean and look after it because that's the way I am - just because it cost less than a tenner doesn't mean it's not worth lavishing the occasional bit of attention on. I can still carve with it, I learned how to keep a scandi grind sharp using it, I can still strike a spark with it. But, it's not my bushcraft knife - I waited for 15 months and paid a serious amount of money (serious for me, anyway) to get one of Rod's SBTs. It is a great knife. The bottom line is that it still does the same things as my Mora, but I agree with Kenchblaize in that you also have to consider aesthetics - it looks better than a Mora, I feel it does the vast majority of jobs better and I get more pleasure from using it. My money, my choice.
We have the same arguments again and again over Kelly Kettles, AW Woodlores, GB axes, Ventile, Kiffy packs, Duluth packs, Swazi clothing, Swanndri clothing, etc, etc. Does it really matter? Some of us like our gear and I, for one, don't feel ashamed. Yeah, I used to worry that perhaps it was taking the focus away from what bushcraft is really all about but, surely, as long as we get out and do it, it doesn't matter what we wear or take with us?
Bushcraft is a big church and there's room for us all.
Except John Fenna in his Baron's outfit - he'll have to stand at the back because his hat's too big.
I will drink to that, there is no way i could afford the several bows or tools i have without making them my self.
The beauty of the forum s is that there's a little double arrow on the right hand side in the title bar of each main forum, if you click on this that section of the forum folds away and one need never concern oneself with those subjects again, one will never know who is posting in them, what is said etc etc.
As individuals we have likes and dislikes, preferences, priorities, moods, wants, needs and all that rest, we're all at different levels of skill and even desire to have skill and experience. We come back to this time and again, don't worry about other people, if some are more interested in only camping on sand than you, don't worry about them getting sand in their pants, you just carry on stringing up your hammock in the wild woods with the midges and they can think your mad for not being in the breeze and midge free.
There's often the accusation that if people are talking about kit they're not getting out, I know that over the years some individuals have used this to start fights and cause grief making accusations of their superiority, weirdly though it's usually after they've got irritated and forget that they have high post counts and they've been on the forums more than most. As long as no one is actively having a go at you it's a good policy not to go looking for offence because we can always create it if we want and then we often manage to justify it, what's the point? On the forums just click the double arrow and forget the offending threads.
When it comes to kit i think it's great to use minimal or old kit that's been reliable and feels like an old friend, but you talk to the likes of Mors he will pick up new kit if it's better than what he's got and he's got a need to improve on it, he works though his life trying to improve on the old skills and develop new ones that will benifit us, bushcraft isn't just about being stuck in the past (well for me anyway) it's also being about embracing the future, it's a big subject that's got aspects that constantly change and others that are solid and never change, it's all down to perspective.
Right, enough waffling.....remember the arrows though
As individuals we have likes and dislikes, preferences, priorities, moods, wants, needs and all that rest, we're all at different levels of skill and even desire to have skill and experience. We come back to this time and again, don't worry about other people, if some are more interested in only camping on sand than you, don't worry about them getting sand in their pants, you just carry on stringing up your hammock in the wild woods with the midges and they can think your mad for not being in the breeze and midge free.
There's often the accusation that if people are talking about kit they're not getting out, I know that over the years some individuals have used this to start fights and cause grief making accusations of their superiority, weirdly though it's usually after they've got irritated and forget that they have high post counts and they've been on the forums more than most. As long as no one is actively having a go at you it's a good policy not to go looking for offence because we can always create it if we want and then we often manage to justify it, what's the point? On the forums just click the double arrow and forget the offending threads.
When it comes to kit i think it's great to use minimal or old kit that's been reliable and feels like an old friend, but you talk to the likes of Mors he will pick up new kit if it's better than what he's got and he's got a need to improve on it, he works though his life trying to improve on the old skills and develop new ones that will benifit us, bushcraft isn't just about being stuck in the past (well for me anyway) it's also being about embracing the future, it's a big subject that's got aspects that constantly change and others that are solid and never change, it's all down to perspective.
Right, enough waffling.....remember the arrows though
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