Why is Ray mears woodlore gear so expensive?

[demographic]

Any sensible businessman charges enough to make a decent profit. That much keeps them going and if they constantly sell everything they can lay their hands on they put the prices up to the point where the market can stand.

No doubt you all work for businesses that do this and that's how you get your wages. Is it that much of a surprise that other people do it?

If the rise in building continues and I get to the point when I'm turning good jobs away because I don't have enough hours in the day then I imagine I will put my rate up and with luck the market will stand it otherwise I'll have to drop it back down again.

 

[beretta63]

I will explain myself here, I get pulled up (by a few) on my fishing forum because I spend so much on quality tackle (a few think i'm bragging, but there you go!) and because of the way I was brought up (mum is an M&S Freak! lol) My motto is buy cheap buy twice! What I am getting at is the fact that putting a famous name on something seems to double the price! Can you honestly say that a simple 4 inch BC knife is actually worth £300+

As for mr Grylls, well the man is just a media sensationalist and I would never stoop as to buy ANYTHING promoted by him, especially when its made by Craghopper or Gerber (well gerber is ok but the BG stuff is just utter rubbish!)

PSn the subject of making a living from artisan crafts, my dads best friend, who owns a very famous pub in the peak district is a potter by trade and sell his wares all over Britain and the world, but he doesn't try and rip folk off by Charging extra for his name!

By the way I also own 3 Gransfors Bruks Axes, so No im not a skin flint!

 

[rg598]

There's a reason why people buy 'the brand' and it isn't solely down to his TV persona.

Not solely, but it does comprise a good chunk of the price.

There are two different things here. One is quality. Quality gear costs more, but has certain benefits like being well made. I have no problem paying more for quality.

The Ray Mears stuff goes beyond that however. A good chunk of those price tags have nothing to do with quality, but are based on branding. Is a Woodlore knife five times better quality than a Mark Hill knife? I don't think it is, but for some reason it costs five times as much.

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[JonathanD]

Can you honestly say that a simple 4 inch BC knife is actually worth £300+

Different things are worth different prices to different people. I paid more than that for my knife and it has my name on it, and that didn't even have a sheath. It was worth it for me, but wouldn't be worth £20 to others. Is RM's knife worth it? Well, it's different. There is the maker and then there is RM himself that needs to make a profit, so it pushes the price up more than if Alan Wood or SWC sold direct. Market forces also dictate, as do supply and demand. And AW can't keep up the demand for the Woodlore knife, and the SWC RM Bushcraft knife is there to cater to those who can't get the Woodlore. And there are loads of folk every year who are buying these, despite the price, and they do come with a sheath, firesteel and luxury box. It all adds up. I bet the profits aren't that big when it comes down to it. If you go look at SWC's retail prices and Alan Wood's, you'll see that RM isn't putting too much mark up from their own RRP's direct to customer.

 

[rik_uk3]

Most of us have the internet, find a particular product and source the best price...honesestly can't see what the OP is moaning about. If a product bought from RM is not up to scratch it will be sorted.

 

[JonathanD]

Is a Woodlore knife five times better quality than a Mark Hill knife? I don't think it is, but for some reason it costs five times as much.

To some people, the answer to that would be yes. Mark can't and doesn't make the Woodlore knife to the same spec as Alan Wood. The shape and handle are unique to Alan and some people like certain runs of Woodlore knives over others. I like his 2004-2006 runs. If I saw one of those come up I'd pay over the retail price to get one as I regret selling mine. Only Alan Wood can make an Alan Wood Woodlore. SWC's Ray Mears Bushcraft knife is very different. And no, that one to me isn't worth as much, and I wouldn't pay for it. It's all about perspective from the consumers side of the fence. We could all make do with a £10 Mora.

 

[Dave]

People go through a fair few knives, until they learn what their own personal preference's are. Once you know what you like, you'll not consider the cost as much.

 

[vizsla]

Some good points here
many knife makers, leather workers etc treat there making as more of a hobby simply because it isn't sufficient enough to make a healthy living, take into acount time spent dealing with customers, posting etc and it can soon turn out that a expert craftsman can be on minimum wage- until ofcourse he gets a reputation and a brand and then if he's lucky enough he can increase his prices and rightly so.

Landrovers and woodlore knives will go up in value
kia sportage and mora knives will be scrap!( dangerous)

investment is good

 

[Swallow]

Its not just his company that's selling gear at silly prices, it seem the norm for ''named gear to have a ''bit of a mark up'' I have a great respect for ray but I could not help noticing the reviews in the woodlaw shop, Folk seem to quite happily spend £50 on a folding saw sheath, belt or £95 on a pouch just because it is endorsed by Ray?

Am I missing a point here, or are people just so gullible?

Sorry if this offends anyone Its only a forum

How much cheaper have you seen a same quality laplander sheath or pouch?

IIRC when I was looking at Bergen tents it was Woodlore that had the best price.

 

[Man of Tanith]

I'd have to add post sale customer care with woodlore as a big plus.
I had issues with the GB outdoor axe I purchased several years back.
Rang Woodlore and with only a rough idea of when I bought it they happily took the axe back via recorded mail replaced the axe and sent it bwck and refunded the postage outlay.

Can't sniff at that

 

[demographic]

If its not worth it, don't buy it. If enough people think the same way they either drop the price or go out of business.

The very fact that these threads come up frequently suggests that there's a lot of people who are always looking on those sites which to me suggests that they might be doing it about right.

There are makers on here (Mark Hill for instance) who make excellent quality knives. I'd get one while he's still affordable.

 

[MikeLA]

As said, it's branding.

What that means depends largely upon your philosophy. On the positive side, I know that ordering today at a reasonable time, the gear will be with me in the morning. I know that it will be of good quality and fit for the job described. I know if it isn't or it fails - then regardless of this or that EU Consumer Directive ( new one effective Friday 13th June ) then Woodlore will take it back, sort it or refund.

I have a Woodlore belt - had it years. I like it a lot. It cost a substantial amount of money - but in my view wasn't expensive ie in terms of what I got.

Several on here make belts - some will be as good as that belt, a few maybe better, a couple will very likely be worse. Of those makers substantially cheaper than the Woodlore product, I ponder how many actually make a living wage from it? I know one very well and rate his work highly, but truth be told he undercharges close to 50% what should sensibly be charged. They carry on supported by a day job. That's their choice and I do not criticise it.

This can't be applied universally - there's some very highly priced tat out there. The adage ' you get what you pay for' needs so many caveats as to be meaningless these days. That's unfortunate.

Ultimately its about choice. You get to choose what you want to do.

But there again I have a much cheaper belt and still using it 16 years later

 

[mountainm]

Badgers tears...

 

[The Quiet Farm]

Much of the 'other branded' gear on the Ray Mears shop is fairly competitive. As for his own branded kit, well I bought the laplander leather sheath because I haven't seen a better one. I can't comment on any of his other items. It's a beautiful piece of craftsmanship and, in my opinion, worth the money, and I have no regrets. Ultimately a laplander doesn't need a case (though it's nice to have) so even a 5 quid case could fit under the 'excessive' label.

 

[JonathanD]

The compass case is well worth getting too. Had mine years now and looks better with every year of use.

 

[rg598]

To some people, the answer to that would be yes. Mark can't and doesn't make the Woodlore knife to the same spec as Alan Wood. The shape and handle are unique to Alan and some people like certain runs of Woodlore knives over others. I like his 2004-2006 runs. If I saw one of those come up I'd pay over the retail price to get one as I regret selling mine. Only Alan Wood can make an Alan Wood Woodlore. SWC's Ray Mears Bushcraft knife is very different. And no, that one to me isn't worth as much, and I wouldn't pay for it. It's all about perspective from the consumers side of the fence. We could all make do with a £10 Mora.

That's my point; you are paying for things other than quality and performance when you buy a Ray Mears product. Personal value/love for a particular maker or TV personality is a different issue. In terms of whether a Woodlore knife performs the functions of a knife five times better than a Mark Hill knife, it certainly does not. The value that a woodlore engraving on the knife has to any person above and beyond the practical value of the tool is a different issue.

Like I said, we are talking about two different things here. One is the quality in terms of the performance, customer service, durability, and function of the tool. The other is the cost of having the tool being associated with a particular name.

The cost of Ray Mears branded gear is a combination of the two. Part of the cost is quality, the rest is the name. Every person is free to chose how much that second part (the name) is worth to them. In terms of performance however, a Woodlore knife is not five times better than a Mark Hill knife.

 

[JonathanD]

In that case you are putting Mark Hill in that category too as they don't perform better than a £10 Mora either. Are Marks knives 10 times better in performance as a Mora. A 9p biro writes words just as well as a £350 Mont Blanc. A £10 digital watch tells the time just like a Rolex. It's a non point.

With RM's stuff, it's clear you are paying a small percentage for the name. But it is only a small %. I'd say 10% max. But if you take 10% off the knives. It's ain't alot of difference is it.

 

[Bluebs4]

Don't forget the resale value you could buy use and make a profit in some cases .

 

[JonathanD]

Don't forget the resale value you could buy use and make a profit in some cases .

Exactly. Ten years ago when the Woodlore was £275. It was fetching £500 plus on Ebay second hand. So RM could easily have asked for more. So who were the stupid and gullible ones? RM for not asking for more? Or the customers who made a profit, and then bought another? Even today I can sell my used RM branded stuff for the amount I paid new... or more in some cases. You can't say that about kit that's crap or of the cheaper non branded variety.

 

[rg598]

In that case you are putting Mark Hill in that category too as they don't perform better than a £10 Mora either. Are Marks knives 10 times better in performance as a Mora. A 9p biro writes words just as well as a £350 Mont Blanc. A £10 digital watch tells the time just like a Rolex. It's a non point.

With RM's stuff, it's clear you are paying a small percentage for the name. But it is only a small %. I'd say 10% max. But if you take 10% off the knives. It's ain't alot of difference is it.

Well, actually they are much better performers. Being a Mora user myself for many years, and then getting a Mark Hill Mora clone with different specs (full tang, thicker blade while maintaining the same grind angle, etc), I can tell you, it is a much better performer. I had no idea who mark was before talking to him about the project.

Besides, here we were comparing custom knife makers for fairness. Both knives I used in the example are custom made and perform the same. One costs five times more. Is that because of the name, or because it was quenched in the tears of newly born badgers? I'm thinking it's the name. Nothing wrong with that, but to answer the OP, that's a huge part of the price.

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