When does Bushcraft stop being Bushcraft?

[bambodoggy]

According to Tom brown Jr, to be totally at one with nature you should be able to walk into the wilderness naked and carrying nothing and be able to not only survive but actually thrive and live happily knowing that nature will provide everything you need or want.
At the other end of the scale you get people driving into the wilderness in massive camper vans and RV's kitted out with fridges, TVs, DVD players, microwaves and central heating...
In the middle you have what I would call bushcrafters, people with minimal kit, a knife, a basha tarp, maybe a billy can and possibly an axe and whatever clothing they choose to wear....
Then you have the lightweight campers/backpackers and moving on to the more heavily equiped campers with big gas stoves etc...

I'd love to hear your opinions on when and carrying what you cease to be a bushcrafter and move up to the next step.
We all talk about what kit we prefer, do we use bow drills to start fire, do we carry matches or do we use a fire steel...is the user of the bow drill the only true bushcrafter or are even they only a bushcrafter if the bow has natural cordage on it rather than paracord?
Is the person with the flint knapped knife a bushcrafter or can we include those with a small clasp knife too...do we need a £200 woodlore knife to be a bushcrafter or is having a knife like that actually stopping us from being a true bushcrafter?
Is the person in the sleeping bag under the basha a bushcrafter or do they become one under a basha but without the sleeping bag....or maybe only if using a debris shelter or similar with no bag or tarp?
Is the true bushcrafter the one boiling water in a birchbark container with hot rocks moved with wooden tongs or is the person with the small billy can hanging on a stick also a true bushcrafter?
Does a true bushcrafter forage/hunt for all their food or can they take minimal rations with them to supliment their foraging, can a bushcrafter take all the food needed with them albeit freeze dried or fresh....at what quantity/type of food taken do they become happy campers....is it up to the point where they take a small solar powered fridge with them, before that point or are they still a bushcrafter with their fridge if they power it with a small water wheel in a fast flowing stream etc?


I don't think there is any definative answer to all of the above and I personally think my ideal (in reality) fits in with most others on this site..."minimal gear and maximun knowledge" but in my heart Tom Brown's ideal is where I'd like to get to one day.

I certainly wouldn't want to "diss" anyone for using anything that helps them while out in the woods (I'm a bit of a kit junky myself and often can't resist a shiney new item of outdoor kit but tend to use it once or twice and then try to work out if I really need to carry it and if I can find a natural alternative..sometime I can and sometimes I can't) but we all seem to look less favourately at the RV brigade whether we admit it or not.
Are we any closer to nature than they are? Certainly it could be claimed that we cause less damage to the enviroment than they do but is that why we are bushcrafters and not just campers? In scouts years ago campcraft was great fun and quite important but just because we built a wooden bridge over a stream with logs found laying around does that make us more bushcrafty than building a stone bridge or even an iron bridge or does that just make us more rustic?

As I say, I don't think there is one line that can be drawn to show when bushcraft stops being bushcraft but I'd love to hear what you guys think on the subject.

Happy camping all....

Phil.
:chill: ack:

 

[mal]

Maybe bushcraft is moor a state of mined

 

[falcon]

Only time for a few quick thoughts but I tend to see "Bushcraft" as encompassing the development of knowldege, skills and techniques to be able to live/survive in conditions which are outside the living routines of modern life. This, of cours,e encompasses shelter, warmth and finding/preparing/cooking food in a way which is beyond Mr/Mrs Average etc. While the ideal is to be able to do this in a way which it is claimed Tom Brown was able to achieve without any assistance from modern tools etc, I think those who have developed consummate skills and can do so even with some use of modern equipment still deserve much respect. The limitations of trying to earn a living and support families etc mean that many have to pursue their bushcraft interests in a very brief window of opportunity timewise and therefore can only manage brief sessions of learning which they can develop more quickly utilising non-handmade equipment. Its wonderful that they are still trying to fan into flame, the spark of desire which still glows within them. That last bit sounds awfully poetic but hopefully you'll know what I mean.

 

[NickBristol]

Whatever the level of kit people do or don't take - from running naked in the woods to 100ft long RV, I think that the people who do make the effort to see just how wonderful the wilderness is should be applauded at having moved from the sofa in front of the widescreen TV.

Nice thread tho Bambodoggy - bet this turns out to be long-running once more people stop pretending to work while reading the posts here and get involved

 

[Tantalus]

my personal take on this is that a bushcrafter can afford to lose most of their tools in the knowledge that nothing is irreplaceable

a camper on the other hand will most likely pack up and go home if the sleeping bag gets wet or the tent rips

i guess i am trying to say it is a mindset rather than anything about kit or the lack of it

where does survivalist fit in here?

maybe the survivalist keeps on going in the hope of eventual rescue :?:

nice subject

Tant

 

[C_Claycomb]

You might just as well ask when bushcraft starts!! Bushcraft is a word that describes an idea whose exact meaning varies from one individual to another. I know a guy who used to be an assistant instructor with one of the schools who almost loaths the term "bushcraft" because people use it so narrowly. I haven't quite gone off the use of the word though so I will carry on using it :roll:

Bushcraft is NOT about kit and what you carry!!! That should NEVER be used as a yard stick. It is not even about just knowledge and skill. Maybe a combination of the two? Even that is probably too simplistic.

Many of the traditional skills that people like to tout as buschraft are nothing but affectations under most circumstances. Most people would say that using a bow drill to start your fire is more "bushcrafty" than using a bic lighter. However if you are choosing to carry a full bow drill set around, that is hugely less efficient than carrying a lighter. Efficiency of action is one of the key outdoor skills.

If you are planning on primitive camping, cooking over open fires, building shelters from local materials and foraging you will undoubtedly be causeing more damage to the local environment than if you cooked on a camping stove, slept in a modern shelter, and carried dried food. Maybe the modern gear is more damaging to the earth as a whole, but not to the particular mountain you are on.

This could go on a long time. I don't think that your question has an answer as you have phrased it :rolmao:

 

[george]

Nice thread tho Bambodoggy - bet this turns out to be long-running once more people stop pretending to work while reading the posts here and get involved

Don't tempt me Nick, I'm trying hard to get some work done today!

George

 

[MartiniDave]

Very good thread! Excellent stuff so far.

Heres my tuppence worth (refunds NOT available )

I think bushcraft is at least as much about what you carry in your head, your heart and your soul, as well as what you carry in your kit.

For example, the way you view the world you live in. The way you manage your resources. I've started to coppice some hazel bushes with a view to the long term. I no longer go out shooting purely for pest control, but now only take what I know will be used. I'm sure you get the idea.

Dave

 

[RovingArcher]

A great thread and many good words shared here.

For me, Bushcraft starts in the soul, a true spiritual connection with the Earth and the others that we share her with. It lives in the bush, living with Nature, not fighting her. Coming to an understanding of the physical and spiritual capabilities of everything around you and how they are completely intertwined and forever inseparable. So, I guess you can say that I believe that Bushcraft is a state of mind and heart. A philosophy of life that leads us to a better and more natural place mentally, emotionally, physically, ecologically and spiritually.

Bushcraft encompasses and intertwines with, many other philosophies and lifestyles like hunting, tracking, forestry, fishing, ecology, geology and survival, to name but a few.

What we use as *kit* will continue to change as we learn and grow, so what we carry with us, has little to do with it. The Indian people on this continent quickly threw away their stone knives when someone handed them a steel knife from hudson bay trading. They fabricated metal and made hunting points for their arrows and knife blades. Used pieces of mirror to signal long distances and the canvas from wagons found it's way to improvised shelters. Yet as they found themselves using more modern tools, they didn't lose their understanding and oneness with the Earth (bush).

Bushcraft ends, when the last of us has walked away from it in favor of the numbness that is modern society.

 

[bambodoggy]

Thanks all....keep the opinions coming...

As I said I don't think there is "an" answer and I'm not looking for one, just a range of what people here think about it...

Very interesting point from "C_Claycomb" about the enviromental impact of different wilderness users... it's true by cutting down veggatation for shelters and collecting dead wood for fires we are altering that specific site but I personally wouldn't say this was damaging unless done in the same place by many....but then how much fosil fuel has been burned to forge that knife or axe we all (including me) think of as acceptable or the chemicals used to tan our nice leather boots. All animals have an impact on nature, it's just some spieces more than others and the enviromental topic is I think for another tread.... I really want this tread to stay as a disscusion question of what people think is bushcraft and what isn't...whether via equipment or via mental attitude....can you sit at home and never ever go to the "bush" but still be a bushcrafter? ? ? :shock:

Thanks for all replies so far :super:

 

[maddave]

can you sit at home and never ever go to the "bush" but still be a buscrafter? ? ? :shock:

Thanks for all replies so far :super:

An interesting idea and I think the answer must be YES. My reasoning is this... I'm a biker and have many friends who are bikers too. I go on many a bike rally and meet new people all the time and there are some people who don't have a bike, yet I consider them bikers, also I know people who DO have a bike but will always be an 'owner operator' because they may go through the motions of getting on a motorcycle occasionally but will never have (for want of a better phrase) Biker spirit !! To me it's a lifestyle thing more than just riding motorcycles. With this in mind, Is a chap who owns the latest woodlore knife, Gransfors Bruks axe, Zebra billy and snugpak sleeping bag. Has free access to a private 100acre wood and get out every weekend, any more a bushcrafter than a chap who has a £7 frosts mora knife, £4 axe from the local hardware store, his billy made from a coffee tin and a bedroll made from old army blankets, who can only get out 4 times a year and has to get the bus to his nearest bit of wood....but who really enjoys it I think not.

For me bushcraft is a lot about how you see and interact with nature.....It's a state of mind

Zen and the art of bushcraft :super:

There is no fire like passion,
No crime like hatred,
No sorrow like separation,
No sickness like hunger,
And no joy like the joy of freedom.
:Buddha:

 

[hobbitboy]

Bushcraft ends, when the last of us has walked away from it in favor of the numbness that is modern society.

That is such a horrible and depressing thought, and I hope it never happens.
Mmmm...gonna go find some new bushcrafty knowledge now to help preserve "bushcraft" in all its many guises.

 

[tomtom]

Bushcraft ends, when the last of us has walked away from it in favor of the numbness that is modern society.

a bushcrafter is he who recognizes the the numbness the us modern society

disclaimer: "..or she.."

 

[Great Pebble]

I could be tempted to take an almost reciprocal view and ask at what point you start to "devolve"...

 

[george]

OK - for me what I think of when I think of bushcraft isn't neccessarily anything to do with heading off to the woods foraging to see how long I'll last, or anything even about camping out . It's more than that, much more.

For me its also about my kids coming to me with a loved but broken toy, knowing that I'll mend it rather than throw it away for a new one. It's about struggling to learn how to build a strained wire fence rather than paying a contracter to build it for me, it's about learning and growing and moving forward and its actually about the way I try to live all of my life not just the time I'm in the woods.

It's about finding new ways to do things and old ways that work well, it's about the satisfaction of filling a woodshed before winter or the look on my sons face when his tinder catches from a spark, it's about seeing the sun rise and feeling happy where I am and about seeing the sunset and feeling content with my day.

I've only just started with the list of what it is for me - it's all these and much much more.

Just wait till I get started on what I think it isn't

George

 

[Paganwolf]

stick a bomb in bushcraft and you end up with bushbombcraft seriously if you blew bushcraft to pieces you would end up with a plethora of different subjects, many different crafts, mycology,botany, tracking, zoology,cookery,metal work,campcraft, hiking, backpacking, fishing, hunting, trapping ect ect ect. Bushcraft can be a label which is atatched to the way of life that all indigenous peoples on this planet live or have lived in many ways, and it can be atatched to something you can do evenings and weekends as a hobby, so where it starts and where it finishes is like saying what is the meaning of life :?: (no quoting hitch hikers guide to the galaxy either :rolmao: ) im not going to tell a person with special needs that walking in the woods identifying plants and trees, tracks and wild life with their parent isn't bushcraft and that because they cant camp out in a wood in a loin cloth in a leaf litter shelter boiling water in a birch bark bowl on a fire hes made with a bowdrill and the cord on it was woven from Yak pubes hes not a " proper bushcrafter " Its something that brings comfort to peoples lives whether in an african savanna or a back garden in brixton as it has already been said its "a state of mind" why quantify it if anyone and everyone can enjoy it :?:

 

[maddave]

bowdrill and the cord on it was woven from Yak pubes :

:rolmao: ):

 

[bambodoggy]

): "Yak Pubes"....you do have a great why of explaining things Paganwolf... Great Stuff!

 

[TheViking]

Good thread. Tough question.

For me bushcraft is different from "outdoor life". Because:

bushcrafters carry less kit. They can do with what they find in a surplus store and they can do good with cheaper clothes that doesn't necessarily have to be high tech. They also carry more knives than outdoor life enthusiasts. Often I think they have natural coloured clothes, compared to the other group, which usually have bright.

I think it stops being bushcraft, when people carry too much kit to make life comfortable out there. It's just as much what's in ones head and the morale.
It's a tough one! :biggthump Gotta think a little more....

 

[falcon]

Some of the recent posts along with the contribution by Roving Archer got me thinking about A Foreward written by John Fowles (author of the French Lieutenant's Woman et al) to "The Sunday Times Book of the Countryside" in 1980. In commending the book, he talked about the need to find patience to enjoy much of what the countryside offers and was also not keen on attaching labels to everything. He concluded his piece with the following words, which I think could also apply to bushcraft:

"...What you have here is a key to a door, behind which lies a secret land: it will let you in, but it is not the land itself.......Once beyond the door, only you can find it - its place in you , your place in it. Discovering this, one's own nature in the mirror of nature, remains one of the most rewarding experiences that life has to give, as strange and fertile as a journey to another, and greener, planet........"

Whether your kit costs £500 or 50p or you do it in Montana or Middlesborough (nothing personal) , does it matter?