Wow! I was with Ranger Bob 3 years ago when we travelled out there, in a country that size he chooses the town we were based in! The programme portrayed the Mongolians exactly as I remember them, so hospitable to complete strangers, and with an engrained toughness to them. Truly a wonderful people, and the best place in the world.
Tribe
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NO no, keep it away!!!!!Desperate Dan said:Oh and somoeone asked what the snuff was like, I've still got some if anyone wants a go!
Top programme,really really enjoyed it.I want to go there more than ever now,what a beautifull place and beautifull people.
I also enjoyed the latest "Tribe" program shot in Northern Mongolia and thanks Bambodoggy for leading me to the right thread: here!
Unfortunately I missed the first half-hour of the Mongolia program.By any chance has anyone recorded the program on VHS video? Would he/she kindly tape your recordings on a blank tape I would send to you (provided you have the equipment to do so of course which not all tape recorders have)? I am so devestated I missed the beginning of that program...
Here is a post I had sent on the Bushcraftb TV thread some time ago, for those who have the endurance to embark on it :
"Sorry guys if my post read like I was a "hypocritical Westener" telling hunting-gathering peoples around the world they should just "stay as they are".
If this is how it read, which is possible , it didn't translate my thoughts properly...
I happen to be of a generation who saw its own quality of life deteriorate and its own culture fade away over the past decades, right here in the West, and inspite of our day and age claiming we never had it so good...
And this in spite of some welcome changes which have occurred.
Younger people may not have such a clear point of comparison.
Therefore I see my brothers and sisters in the forests of Papua New Guinea, Gabon and elsewhere experiencing quite a parallel change in their own lives to what happened and is still happening here in "the West" (to give the industrial world a common name).
These questions would require more space and time then I have here writing this post. But in short, what I find the most upsetting is, not only the logging industry pulling the rug from under these people's feet, literally...but very active and financially powerful protestant missionaries who continue to force our own religion, or rather a particular and questionable brand of it, down everyone's throat in many parts of the world.
I was raised a Christan and a protestant. I would describe my own set of values largely "Christian" in spirit.
But I don't approve of missionaries because, particularly in the documentary on the Kombai people in P.N. Guinea, as they were misleading the forest people into thinking that they would continue to "live in fear" if they stuck to their old ways and would on the other hand find peace if they embraced our ways and our Christianity (or the version of it taught by these particular protestant churches).
Aren't war and fear not part of our modern world? And as abhorrent as these people's cannibalism may be perceived by us, aren't some aspects of our world just as cruel? Come on!
The documentary showed some forest people already converted by the missionaries to their own brand of christianity (with emphasis on wearing clothes in a climate where being naked is the healthiest and most comfortable way to cope with humidity!). These converts kept saying how wondeful it would be if all forest peoples renounced their ways and beliefs, they would then be in peace ever after...this showed clearly that the missionaries made the forest people believe that our world was a world of constant peace while theirs a world of constant tribal wars and fear...which is a lie.
I just say it as I see it. A lot of "their ways" are good and were greatly appreciated by Parry. The fact that the disappearance of their culture is perhaps inevitable doesn't make it a good thing.
There is a lot in our modern world I am unhappy with, from many different angles, so why should I wish it to people who look happy, healthy and in harmony with their environment and not more cruel than any of us? At the cost of losing forever this legacy from their ancestors...which by the way is also World Heritage..?"
Unfortunately I missed the first half-hour of the Mongolia program.By any chance has anyone recorded the program on VHS video? Would he/she kindly tape your recordings on a blank tape I would send to you (provided you have the equipment to do so of course which not all tape recorders have)? I am so devestated I missed the beginning of that program...
Here is a post I had sent on the Bushcraftb TV thread some time ago, for those who have the endurance to embark on it
:"Sorry guys if my post read like I was a "hypocritical Westener" telling hunting-gathering peoples around the world they should just "stay as they are".
If this is how it read, which is possible , it didn't translate my thoughts properly...
I happen to be of a generation who saw its own quality of life deteriorate and its own culture fade away over the past decades, right here in the West, and inspite of our day and age claiming we never had it so good...
And this in spite of some welcome changes which have occurred.
Younger people may not have such a clear point of comparison.
Therefore I see my brothers and sisters in the forests of Papua New Guinea, Gabon and elsewhere experiencing quite a parallel change in their own lives to what happened and is still happening here in "the West" (to give the industrial world a common name).
These questions would require more space and time then I have here writing this post. But in short, what I find the most upsetting is, not only the logging industry pulling the rug from under these people's feet, literally...but very active and financially powerful protestant missionaries who continue to force our own religion, or rather a particular and questionable brand of it, down everyone's throat in many parts of the world.
I was raised a Christan and a protestant. I would describe my own set of values largely "Christian" in spirit.
But I don't approve of missionaries because, particularly in the documentary on the Kombai people in P.N. Guinea, as they were misleading the forest people into thinking that they would continue to "live in fear" if they stuck to their old ways and would on the other hand find peace if they embraced our ways and our Christianity (or the version of it taught by these particular protestant churches).
Aren't war and fear not part of our modern world? And as abhorrent as these people's cannibalism may be perceived by us, aren't some aspects of our world just as cruel? Come on!
The documentary showed some forest people already converted by the missionaries to their own brand of christianity (with emphasis on wearing clothes in a climate where being naked is the healthiest and most comfortable way to cope with humidity!). These converts kept saying how wondeful it would be if all forest peoples renounced their ways and beliefs, they would then be in peace ever after...this showed clearly that the missionaries made the forest people believe that our world was a world of constant peace while theirs a world of constant tribal wars and fear...which is a lie.
I just say it as I see it. A lot of "their ways" are good and were greatly appreciated by Parry. The fact that the disappearance of their culture is perhaps inevitable doesn't make it a good thing.
There is a lot in our modern world I am unhappy with, from many different angles, so why should I wish it to people who look happy, healthy and in harmony with their environment and not more cruel than any of us? At the cost of losing forever this legacy from their ancestors...which by the way is also World Heritage..?"
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
I take it from the quiet day here today that nobody saw last nights show? I watched it...I liked it....not my fav episode but still up to Bruce's usual standard.
I did like it when he was cutting wood and they were all sitting around laughing at him coz he was making the cuts to big and basically being a typical westerner (as I said from last weeks, I'd have done the same)...he was, I believe, trying to show them that he'd work hard for them but they just thought it funny...
Best quote from last night:
First Woman: He's cutting off to big bits, he'll tire himself out in no time like tha.
Second Woman: I suppose we should help him really.
Both Women: Giggling and laughing.
First Woman: Yer...should do.
None of them got up! :rolmao: :rolmao:
After that he showed us his hands....they were blistered and cut to heck!
So..... that was the last one! I think my Fav one was the headhunters one, closely followed by the Mongolian one.
What do you guys think?
I did like it when he was cutting wood and they were all sitting around laughing at him coz he was making the cuts to big and basically being a typical westerner (as I said from last weeks, I'd have done the same)...he was, I believe, trying to show them that he'd work hard for them but they just thought it funny...
Best quote from last night:
First Woman: He's cutting off to big bits, he'll tire himself out in no time like tha.
Second Woman: I suppose we should help him really.
Both Women: Giggling and laughing.
First Woman: Yer...should do.
None of them got up! :rolmao: :rolmao:
After that he showed us his hands....they were blistered and cut to heck!
So..... that was the last one! I think my Fav one was the headhunters one, closely followed by the Mongolian one.
What do you guys think?
I thought it was a good one but it is becoming 'Bruce goes on a massive drugs bender' I think they have been great shows but the cocktail of stuff he has swallowed and snorted would make most people need a spell in the hospital to recover and it doesn't sound like it was his first time 'experimenting'.
Really good series in all though.
Was it just me or was the big village with the airstrip the same one Ray visited in his last series when he went to Venezuela. If not the scenery and football pitch looked very familiar.
Really good series in all though.
Was it just me or was the big village with the airstrip the same one Ray visited in his last series when he went to Venezuela. If not the scenery and football pitch looked very familiar.
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
tenbears10 said:
The last few shows were definately heading that way! lol
): Still....made for some very very funny shows! :rolmao: Think it might have been the same place RM went to...someone on here's bound to know
):Yeah, while I like the show it is beginning to come across as a guide to places in the world to go on a drugs bender. I wonder if the next one will be him going to the inner cities to study "tribes" there. Maybe I can see that it's a show that could be so much better. Watching a guy high on drugs starts to become repetetive.tenbears10 said:
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
I have to admit to dozing off for the last 10 minutes when he was doing the drugs thing...as Adi says, it gets a bit boring after a while just watching somebody else being high!
Yup, I watched it as well.
My impression was that this was a tribe on the verge of extinction. Either physically or socially.They have lost their traditional way of existence (Forest nomads) and were being seduced by the neighbouring tribe into a sedantry existance which they didn't seem to be able to cope with well, with the result that they spent more and more time "shamanising" otherwise known as getting trolleyed as a distraction. I also got the impression that the neighbouring tribe were using this tribe as a form of slave labour so it was in their interest to keep the nomads subdued with promises of medical support and metal weapons. Quite upsetting really
There again, that could just be my perception.
My favourites were the tree-dwellers and the Ethiopean Suri "stick fighters."
I'm not sure if Bruce could carry on this series in the way it has been, so it will be interesting to see where he takes it from here?
Cheers,
Martin
My impression was that this was a tribe on the verge of extinction. Either physically or socially.They have lost their traditional way of existence (Forest nomads) and were being seduced by the neighbouring tribe into a sedantry existance which they didn't seem to be able to cope with well, with the result that they spent more and more time "shamanising" otherwise known as getting trolleyed as a distraction. I also got the impression that the neighbouring tribe were using this tribe as a form of slave labour so it was in their interest to keep the nomads subdued with promises of medical support and metal weapons. Quite upsetting really
There again, that could just be my perception.
My favourites were the tree-dwellers and the Ethiopean Suri "stick fighters."
I'm not sure if Bruce could carry on this series in the way it has been, so it will be interesting to see where he takes it from here?
Cheers,
Martin
bambodoggy
Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
That was the last one.......for now!
I agree totally about this last tribe slowly dying out....it seems we Westerners helped too by bring in dieses that they couldn't cope with and therefore making them even more dependant on western medicine...the other tribe seems to have capitalized on this and as Martin says are now using it as cheap labour.....very sad indeed.
I agree totally about this last tribe slowly dying out....it seems we Westerners helped too by bring in dieses that they couldn't cope with and therefore making them even more dependant on western medicine...the other tribe seems to have capitalized on this and as Martin says are now using it as cheap labour.....very sad indeed.
did anyone see him on sky travel the other day? he was doing a 40 day trek across new guinea, to climb a previously unclimbed peak. The best bit was the look on his face crossing a bamboo bridge (very thin bamboo). Half of the supports started snapping with every foot step.....
it was a good one... the drugs and the being sick, do seem to be a common theme
I think it was the same place RM went, i know when i heard the first tribe name, i thought that it sounded very familiar.... (and i wouldn't have heard it anywhere else)
shame it's the last one though, really enjoyed it... even the missus did!
I think it was the same place RM went, i know when i heard the first tribe name, i thought that it sounded very familiar.... (and i wouldn't have heard it anywhere else)
shame it's the last one though, really enjoyed it... even the missus did!
Yes Giancarlo, I also thought it was the same tribe Ray had visited. I didn't really recognize its name, although it did sound familiar too, but the village and its setting looked the same and their way of cooking manioc semolina on a cast iron tray (a split second sequence).
Yes very sad, in this program particularly it felt like a culture, a people on its last legs.
They had lost the vast region of forest where they used to lead their previous nomadic life. It seemed that they had been cornered by events beyond their control and then thought of a damage limitation solution:
living nearby the other tribe (forgot its exact name, the village that looked like where Ray Mears had first landed) which was a tribe already with one foot in our modern world which could provide them with medications and some medical care. It looked like this was a reasoned, deliberate decision.
Like one of you has said, the other tribe exploits them. It is all quite sad.
I have seen films and pictures and heard direct accounts from anthropologists etc on forest tribes in the Amazon some, say, 30 years ago. The picture was so different. These people looked quite different in appearence too: sharp traditional hair cuts, wearing nothing but something round their waist or hips and maybe around their legs right below the knee, etc Their general appearance was clean-cut, sharp, everyone in the village wore the same things: it looked distinctive, it had unity in appearance: never overall shabby and sad and full of bits and bobs the way these people sort of look now.
Well, long story...logging seem to be one of the main threat and cause of the decline of these tribes and their distinctive cultures.
Yes very sad, in this program particularly it felt like a culture, a people on its last legs.
They had lost the vast region of forest where they used to lead their previous nomadic life. It seemed that they had been cornered by events beyond their control and then thought of a damage limitation solution:
living nearby the other tribe (forgot its exact name, the village that looked like where Ray Mears had first landed) which was a tribe already with one foot in our modern world which could provide them with medications and some medical care. It looked like this was a reasoned, deliberate decision.
Like one of you has said, the other tribe exploits them. It is all quite sad.
I have seen films and pictures and heard direct accounts from anthropologists etc on forest tribes in the Amazon some, say, 30 years ago. The picture was so different. These people looked quite different in appearence too: sharp traditional hair cuts, wearing nothing but something round their waist or hips and maybe around their legs right below the knee, etc Their general appearance was clean-cut, sharp, everyone in the village wore the same things: it looked distinctive, it had unity in appearance: never overall shabby and sad and full of bits and bobs the way these people sort of look now.
Well, long story...logging seem to be one of the main threat and cause of the decline of these tribes and their distinctive cultures.
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