Money

[MartinK9]

I carry cash at all times and i try to pay with cash every time if at all possible, use it or lose it. Once it’s gone it ain’t coming back.

Same here, I use an ATM to withdraw enough for the month and pay using that.

 

[Pattree]

So YOU can campaign if you wish to move to a cashless society.

……. but I don’t particularly want a cashless society. I just find cash and change a nuisance. As always I only speak for me.

I am certainly not any kind of evangelist. The only reason that my post is in any way significant is that it goes against the apparent majority here. I’m not sure where the norm lies across the nation.

 

[Toddy]

I use both.
I'm stuck at home just now and the ease of buying stuff compared to past times is enormous.

I am used to ordering from local shops, it was commonplace, and the butcher will still deliver, as will the greengrocer, the milkman (and bless them the Chemists).
Now the supermarkets do it from dawn to dusk and beyond.

All paid for electronically.

Having said that, I keep cash in my purse, have some in the house, just incase the net dies or something goes totally amiss. At least we can buy staples.

My husband's daily wombles around the three villages frequently ends up with some cash. It's astonishing how much money is discarded, lost. It goes into a wee tin and the first charity rattling can that appears is given the contents.

I pay for things in shops with cash, not every time, but a lot of the time. It keeps my eye on just how much I'm spending. I still add up as I go around.

I drop a few coins into the rattling cups of those sitting in the cold begging for cash. I couldn't live their lives, and a few pounds from mine, well, if it helps them get something hot to eat, I'm happier.

I think we need both kinds of 'cash' to be honest.

 

[Woody girl]

I remember, back a long time ago when my grandfather had a menswear shop in Southampton, I was quite small, 4 years old or so, and I was " helping out" in the shop.
There was a power cut. Granpa simply whiped out a couple of candles, put them on the counter and carried on serving the customer, without missing a heartbeat. In those days, manual tills were the norm and so was cash.
Business as usual. Not a problem.
Fast forward to present times.
Power cut means the supermarket automatic doors don't work, the tills don't work, the cashpoint won't work, business comes to a standstill.
Smaller shops can get out a pen and paper, record purchases, cash only, the till is over ridden, but permanently open and cash unsecured. Everyone is edgy as they can't use their cards, or phone to pay, don't have enough cash on them, and the staff are stressed as they actualy have to use maths to add stuff up and work out the correct change to give, as their till no longer tells them.
Second scenario
Woman outside shop with three disgruntled and one crying child. Can't buy drinks and snacks for her hungry and thirsty kids as her phone pay app isn't working, and the whole instant don't have to think about anything system is down.
Witnessed both these scenes this year.
For me, not a problem, I just payed with cash at the greengrocers , and newsagents. Went on my way with everything I needed.
If we get another Carrington event, and with the sun behaving as it is presently, its perfectly possible, China or Russia hacking or cutting vital under sea cables, as happened over Xmas, life could get rather tricky for the majority of modern man.
Us luddites will just smile, light a candle, and carry on normaly without missing a heartbeat, like my old grandpa.
Cashless is highly vunerable to many things, weather, state control, nefarious activity, look how the gov has given the dwp the right to snoop on disabled and pensioners Bank accounts, withput permission, that is wrong. We are told not to give details out to anyone , but we have submitted without a murmur to that, because of the government's fraud narrative that emotes those who are not on benefits to demonise others less fortunate. How long before it applies to all.? Won't happen?
Think again.its the back door to everyone being monitored on every purchase.slowly slowly catchee monkey.
That can't happen if you use cash. We are gently being herded into this.
Younger people who never experienced anything but this new norm accept it as they know nothing else.
A frog doesn't know it's being boiled alive if it starts off in cold water and is slowly brought to a boil, suddenly its too late.
Look how we are loosing high street banks at an alarming rate.
I'm buying less and less from supermarket /big business, and supporting small local shops with cash.
They are grateful, I get great personal service, a bit of a chat, sometimes advice or suggestions on meals, I can buy just one baking potato, or onion , a couple of sausages, or enough mince for one person, instead of having to buy more than I want, and waste the others, and everyone is happy, unlike the miserable queues in tesco. Plus it cuts out food waste, which as a single person I find a problem with family size bags of fruit and veg...I don't always have time or inclination to peel chop blanch and freeze so much.
Plus farmers are getting the real price for their produce, instead of pennies .
Sorry for such a long post. !

 

[GreyCat]

In terms of privacy, people in reciept of some state benefits, the government are allowed to look directly at what you're buying. It's very dehumanising. And Im sure they have mechanisms by which they can snoop on anyone if they like.

So that's a reason to use cash. Not because one has something to hide, but as a general principle that the government is not my dad & doesn't need to know my affairs.

The government also looks hard at small businesses.

Since "Making Tax Digital" came in, all VAT-registered traders (even those below the threshold who are voluntarily registered) MUST use an approved digital accounting system which interfaces with HMRC directly, and I think it's going to eventually roll out to smaller non-VAT registered businesses too.

So the govt has access to all invoice values and all sales values (all my receipts and invoices are held in the system). It communicates seamlessly with HMRC's VAT portal.

I pay 30-odd quid a month to subscribe to a package administered by my accountant for the privilege of doing this, whereas under the previous regime I just logged on to my free online govt tax account and submitted the 4 magic numbers needed for a VAT return. PAYE is going the same way, currently I can use the free "PAYE Tools" govt app but I know PAYE MTD is coming soon..... hopefully my accountant will do an add-on for that too. (I have a very good small business accountant, the software was cheaper via him than directly, plus he set it up for me and he can easily correct any mistakes I make, plus it makes year-end accounts easier for us both when I'm on his system).

Looking at the pending move to the new place. We can get fibre broadband- comes in on the telegraph pole- and will do so. But an area power outage (e.g. like storm Darragh caused in parts of west Wales recently) will affect that, and there's little mobile phone signal to speak of (on any of the main 3 networks) and that would also be impacted by an area power outage. So, I am going to get a Starlink system as a back up, that can run off an Ecoflow power station, that will mean that if we do get a storm in the area and I am due to make a PAYE or VAT return, I can go onlien that way (or at least phone my accountant and as he can access my system, at a push he could do the returns for me). Basically, as a small business owner I'm not only collecting tax for the govt, but also paying for the infrastructure to do so reliably.

It's not just receipents of state benefits that are subject to scrutiny, oh no, it's MUCH wider than that.

GC

 

[Chris]

Yes.

My understanding of events here is that action wasn't taken for them refusing deliveries, but for blockading the Ambassador Bridge which is a major economic route. Have I missed something?

 

[TeeDee]

My understanding of events here is that action wasn't taken for them refusing deliveries, but for blockading the Ambassador Bridge which is a major economic route. Have I missed something?

I guess it can be seen both ways.
I'm not sure if this sort of protest ( Think Tractors in various major european countries recently ) has been tackled before by effectively going directly after the bank accounts of the protesters.

I was in Barcelona when this occurred.

I appreciate it maybe somewhat difficult to see a potential for authoritarian over step but the new era of linking a persons political actions of protest and shutting off the access to their bank accounts on an individual basis I do think is a concerning path.

#edit - But my spirit animal is Chicken Little.

 

[Chris]

I guess it can be seen both ways.
I'm not sure if this sort of protest ( Think Tractors in various major european countries recently ) has been tackled before by effectively going directly after the bank accounts of the protesters.

I was in Barcelona when this occurred.

I appreciate it maybe somewhat difficult to see a potential for authoritarian over step but the new era of linking a persons political actions of protest and shutting off the access to their bank accounts on an individual basis I do think is a concerning path.

#edit - But my spirit animal is Chicken Little.

I can absolutely see potential for authoritarian overstep, I think we already suffer from it here to be honest. That probably is a first and I don't think an acceptable way of tackling it. In fact if someone is blocking a major road I'd just expect them to be arrested by the police, rather than have their financial assets frozen which seems a gross overreach.

 

[slowworm]

Power cut means the supermarket automatic doors don't work, the tills don't work, the cashpoint won't work, business comes to a standstill.
Smaller shops can get out a pen and paper, record purchases, cash only, the till is over ridden, but permanently open and cash unsecured. Everyone is edgy as they can't use their cards, or phone to pay, don't have enough cash on them, and the staff are stressed as they actualy have to use maths to add stuff up and work out the correct change to give, as their till no longer tells them.

I think the small shops closed round here when we had our last large powercut.

And whilst I don't really disagree with what you say paying by card is very helpful to other people. My Mum for example is largely housebound due to disability. She pays for her weekly shopping via credit card online, along with other essentials. To get cash she has to get a taxi to the nearest town which costs a fortune if I don't take her.

 

[Pattree]

Businesses can take credit and debit card details and a signature by candlelight and enter them later.

 

[British Red]

I think this is one of those situations where it isn't a competition. Contactless payment, online payment, credit & debit cards, bank transfers & PayPal all have their place.

So does cash.

There is no rational reason to phase out cash other than a desire to monitor & audit all consumer spending, no matter how trivial.

 

[Pattree]

…….. and simple convenience for those who choose.

 

[Glow_worm]

Nicely summed up @British Red. But lots of businesses/organisations/events are taking matters into their own hands with 'card only' policies. If there is any choice in the matter they don't get my business and are informed why!

 

[Chris]

I think this is one of those situations where it isn't a competition. Contactless payment, online payment, credit & debit cards, bank transfers & PayPal all have their place.

So does cash.

There is no rational reason to phase out cash other than a desire to monitor & audit all consumer spending, no matter how trivial.

The problem with the last bit is the public. It’s only a matter of time until the government and the media start claiming that cash enables terrorists/drug dealers/child abusers and things like that, so it must be banned. And people will lap it up.

 

[Pattree]

Hang on! You are the public/people too!
Do you know something that the “public” don’t know?

 

[Chris]

Hang on! You are the public/people too!
Do you know something that the “public” don’t know?

I am also ‘the human race’ (allegedly) but I have no more info than you I’m afraid.

 

[British Red]

The problem with the last bit is the public. It’s only a matter of time until the government and the media start claiming that cash enables terrorists/drug dealers/child abusers and things like that, so it must be banned. And people will lap it up.

In that situation it's about government rather than the public. Many parties these days seem to wish to govern the population rather than to serve them. Ultimately we need governments that serve our needs & don't see people as a mechanism for economic 'growth'.

It's up to us at a local & national level to make that change

 

[William_Montgomery]

Of course having money provides more reassurance than not having money, but what gives me real reassurance is being able to do perfectly well without (much) money. Owning a modest home outright and having the means to produce food, water and fuel is unbelievably liberating.

I find this interesting, the balance in my life has shifted quite a lot over the last few years towards running a more self-reliant set up.
In terms of reassurance, how does that play out when it comes to things like sickness or injury (I recall your wife had a broken leg recently) and also thinking about security for the future, getting older and that type of thing?

 

[British Red]

I find this interesting, the balance in my life has shifted quite a lot over the last few years towards running a more self-reliant set up.
In terms of reassurance, how does that play out when it comes to things like sickness or injury (I recall your wife had a broken leg recently) and also thinking about security for the future, getting older and that type of thing?

Certainly that can be an issue but we managed. With serious injuries & long term illness most employers will pay you off too! We had plenty of food & firewood so it set us back a bit but was quite manageable. Fiona took over indoor jobs like administration of our shop & editing YouTube videos.

 

[John Fenna]

When I bought my latest new-to-me van the dealership wanted a cheque - not card - due to the charges they would incur. When the days of power cuts happened after Storm Darragh many places around here were without internet or card facilities but my cash was good everywhere. In West Wales the old ways still rule - the ancient components of the infrastructure are a factor in this....
In our village barter and skill sharing are still acceptable ways of trading!