"Leave no Trace". Yeah right.

[wanderinstar]

What is it with some Bushcrafters today. All they seem to want to do is get blathered around a campfire.
This goes back to the days when we used to use Delamere Forest scout site.
they are quite happy to bring there tins and bottles around the campfire. But did they even think of taking them home with them. No, it was left to the likes of Wayland who used to bring portable dustbins, to remove the rubbish.

Middlewood has become the same. This time it was down to Simon to remove the rubbish. Why? He has organised the meet, he is not the dustman. What ever happened to "Leave no Trace". The latest thing is people not paying for the weekend, just sloping of when no one was looking. It is not on. If you go to a meet you pay your dues.

Bowley Scout site was the latest example of this behaviour. Simon organised activities plus a marquee. Then only half the people turn up. Very nearly leaving him to pick up the tab. Before anyone says anything, yes I was one who didn't camp overnight. But I went on Sunday morning and paid the fee that was owing.

Is it any wonder that these excellent sites are being lost to bushcraft. The organisers are just sick of picking up other peoples rubbish and chasing people for money.
Simon is thinking of throwing the towel in, and who would blame him.

 

[Shewie]

Well said that man

I like a drink as much as the next man but I never leave anything behind and expect somebody else to clean up after me.

I think meets are different though to folk getting out doing bushy stuff in smaller groups. They do seem to be an excuse for a p1ss up these days rather than a skills sharing experience.

I'm not one for the bigger meets, I prefer to go off and find places in groups of three or four. The idea of a big get together kind of defeats the object of being outside and enjoying the enviroment for me.

It'll be a shame for the actions of a few to ruin it for the rest of us though, have a word with yourselves.

 

[DavidJT]

Well said.
As a teenager my old Dad used to often say to me "If you drink a Man's drink, you behave like a man". So yes, a drink around the campfire, but clean up your own mess.
P.S. What do you call sleeping in a Hammock suspended over a big pile of empty tinnies? .... a Hangover!
(removes coat from peg on way to door)

 

[Klenchblaize]

The price that will sadly be paid by"Bushcraft" for its meteoric rise in popularity and no matter how loud one shouts that a six-pack of beer around a campfire does not entitle you to a BCC (Bushcraft Competency Certificate) Level 1.

Cheers

 

[durulz]

That sounds a real shame.
Sort of underlines why I'm not too interested in meets - not that keen on just getting drunk and acting a prat in the woods.
Maybe the way ahead would be by personal invite only rather than an open invite - it'd be a pity if the organiser and those who act responsibly had to lose out. Dare say costs would rise with fewer people, but better that than have it cheap and ruined. Ho hum. We live and learn.
Hope the guilty people read this thread and feel a tad ashamed of themselves.

 

[DanDan The man called Dan]

I've personally never been on one of these meets but how dissapointing that this needs pointing out to people.

"If you drink a Man's drink, you behave like a man".

I really like this, I wish my father had passed on such knowledge to me. I'm looking forward to passing this on to my boy. Bit of a wait though he's only 4.

Dan

 

[timboggle]

A shame mate, I think Toddy has the right idea by calling it "a skills sharing weekend" - the word 'meet' is too open for the wrong interpretation and abuse.

 

[SimonM]

That sounds a real shame.
Sort of underlines why I'm not too interested in meets - not that keen on just getting drunk and acting a prat in the woods.
Maybe the way ahead would be by personal invite only rather than an open invite - it'd be a pity if the organiser and those who act responsibly had to lose out. Dare say costs would rise with fewer people, but better that than have it cheap and ruined. Ho hum. We live and learn.
Hope the guilty people read this thread and feel a tad ashamed of themselves.

In response, costs are usually per person per night so a small select group would not incur a larger fee. Bowley was different as I had booked activites etc and had a fixed cost to cover.

I have avoided "by invite only" Meets as I want to avoid an elitist group that is closed to new members, but am seriously looking at this as an option...

On a purely personal note, I can camp at any Scout site at any time & have access to a 50 hectare permission so do not NEED to organise Meets to get out. I do it as I realise that a lot of our members are not as fortunate in land access as I am.

Thanks to Wanderinstar et al for raising this as I didn't feel I could without sounding off.

Simon

 

[Nat]

And this is why i don't attend large meets.
I'm an ex drinker which doesn't make me an anti-alcohol person, but i understand drinking to excess alot more than most people. Excess would include an entire crate of beer around the camp fire or under people's hammocks.
Booze and knives and axes just don't mix. I don't see the need to get blasted or 8 times over the limit when out "bushcrafting". It's not bushcrafting, it's a party in the damn woods.

If you cannot be bothered to pick up after yourself and leave others to clear your carp then you've no right being there in the first place.
Even the occasional small meet i've been to i've ended up clearing up the rubbish the following morning, and believe me i hate having to clear up other people's mess because they're too drunk to do it themselves and think "Sod it, i'm off to bed"

By all means have a drink, enjoy yourself, but don't leave your garbage for someone else to clean up.
These sort of threads pop up far too often and i'm disgusted to think that some people on here find it funny to slink off without paying or tidying up.
That's just wrong on so many levels.
If it happened on a site i own, you'd end up with the empty cans in your car :BlueTeamE

Hat off to those who clean up after others

 

[oetzi]

Its the same over here. Organized or not, all the rubbish is left to remain in nature. Be it the leftovers of a party at a parking site in the wood or what i call "children`s litter" (wrappings for sweets) at spots wre families gather.
And woe to you if you ask someone why he has to throw away his litter instead of carrying it back.
The assholes* are taking over, everywhere.

(*the only correct description for someone who leaves his litter laying around, so bugger political correctness)

 

[stooboy]

thats a real shame, all of the people who take time to organise meets, group buys or things for others on here deserver our respect and thanks.

Ive been to Simon's meets before and had a great time its a shame that this experience has tainted it for all as its a huge responsiblity to take a group of essentially strangers onto a site you have sought hard earned permission on.

 

[Jaysurfer]

I to am sorry you recieved that kind of gratitude from some people who are members of this site.

I enjoy socialising round the fire of an evening with a drink as countless generations of our forefathers have done before us...
Part of the enjoyment of being outdoors is seeing the ture beauty of nature and the land and living in harmony with it... I think anyone who de-faces that natural beauty with their own rubbish that they can not be bothered to pick up and take with them obviously doesn't understand what it is we clearly enjoy about being outside.

Anyone can get drunk outside - if thats what you want do it in your garden!
To enjoy a drink (or five) responsibly with like minded people while enjoying all that nature has to offer is something much more and something that should be appreciated.

I enjoy a drink around the fire but i always make sure i am able to find my way back to my hammock! The last thing i wanna do is end up in someone elses!!!!! could be embarressing and probably told as a story at every meet for the next 12 months!

J

 

[Black Sheep]

I agree with all the above.

I was looking at booking a Local Scout camp for a BCUK meet but they have quite a strict set of rules to follow and I didn't feel I wanted the responsablity of booking it then worrying about other peoples actions

I have to say I only stayed one night at Middlewood, payed Simon when I got there and had a few beers round the fire that night. That said next morning when I packed up I filled a carrier bag of empties (not all mine) from around the fire and dropped them in the bin on the way out.

It would be a shame if we lost all these meets because of the action of a few............

Richard

 

[locum76]

Perhaps there is a place for both and organizers just have to be more explicit when posting about gatherings. I like to do most things outdoors - party being one of those. I also like to sit quietly by a fire whittling or some such. So I could enjoy a meet at either end of the spectrum.

Neglecting to tidy up yer own dross is inexcusable though.

 

[Cobweb]

You've hit the nail on the head as to why I don't go to meets any more, at first it was a good way to meet like-minded people, share skills and pick up some tricks n tips.

I don't drink and I find that everyone getting wasted (not just at night I may add) is really off putting and can get a little dangerous. As a female, I'm more worried as I've usually not met some of the male members before and I know how men behave when pi**ed. Luckily, all of the meets I've been on there hasn't been a problem but I'll add the word yet to the end of that.

I like the big moot, it's focus is on skills and having fun, there is an understanding that during the day, it's calm and responsible and at night - it's time to let your hair down.

Sure you don't pick up all of the nuances of doing or learning something in a large group but even if one person gets completely trashed there are usually four or five people relatively sober enough to deal with any problems arise, and it's kept to certain areas which you don't have to go near if you don't want to.

Although saying that, the mess that was left the past two years around the main camp fire and around the whole site was deplorable. We are supposed to be responsible adults - e.g. if you see a mess or a bit of rubbish it dosen't hurt to pick it up or ask a small child to do it.

 

[Andy2112]

I've read the posts and agree with them but surely it's easier to say in the rules beforehand that you must take all your own rubbish away with you ?

At the last meet i attended there were a few folk who'd bought black bin bags with them for their own use and friends use. Why not make that a stipulation of attending a meet ? or sell them at the meet for 50p with the proceeds going to the HTH or Scout Camp or something ? It's just bad drills in my mind.

 

[Melonfish]

Perhaps there is a place for both and organizers just have to be more explicit when posting about gatherings. I like to do most things outdoors - party being one of those. I also like to sit quietly by a fire whittling or some such. So I could enjoy a meet at either end of the spectrum.

Neglecting to tidy up yer own dross is inexcusable though.

QFT, don't see why that couldn't be the case, specifically post that its a skills meet or that its a social meet.
as for mess, yes its inexusable not to clean it up regardless.

 

[MartinK9]

Sorry to play Devils advocate here, but is it all down to those bushcrafters that drink?

I, along with some others personally enjoy a drink or two or three or four around a fire at the end of a hard days shrafting/skill sharing.

When we leave the area; it is as tidy as when we arrived.

 

[TeeDee]

Sorry to play Devils advocate here, but is it all down to those bushcrafters that drink?

I, along with some others personally enjoy a drink or two or three or four around a fire at the end of a hard days shrafting/skill sharing.

When we leave the area; it is as tidy as when we arrived.

Agreed , at the end of the day if you carry it into camp , carry it out aswell.

 

[DavidJT]

I've personally never been on one of these meets but how dissapointing that this needs pointing out to people.



I really like this, I wish my father had passed on such knowledge to me. I'm looking forward to passing this on to my boy. Bit of a wait though he's only 4.

Dan

Mine's 5 so I've got a bit of a wait too, but will be using it.