Oh dear, and it was going to be such a great thread of people coming up with their own imaginative solutions instead of blaming everyone else for a societal problem.
I'm out
I'm out
How would you fix the Homeless crisis.?
- Thread starter TeeDee
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Brilliant idea! How has no-one thought of it?! Now how do you propose to get the super wealthy to stay still while you milk them, petal?
I shall follow Brock's example, methinks. Deary me.
I'm not going down any political roads on this one.
But, I have a little experience being without home, food nor money, not in this country though and only for a few months. A couple of things that stay with me from that period are, after a certain point, how quickly my morale went down. No hot food and no hot water makes you cold and miserable, but the sense of lonliness and isolation from your fellow man is brutal.
The other thing I think back on sometimes is the gradual drop in standards. It's probably the closest I've come to running on survival instinct and it's not pretty.
I get to think back on this from the comfort of a house I own, with the company of a woman I love. If I think of how much of that was luck, it makes me very grateful indeed.
I don't know how you solve the homeless problem in this country, but I've had a small taste of being in a hole which I can't be sure I would have found a way out of on my own.
Ahh right.
Just recently my wife graduated from her Open University masters degree and we went upto sunny Glasgow for the ceremony.
Near the venue there was a cafe called Social Bite which was also a charity to help homeless people.
This is some bumf off their website which is...HERE.
"The Social Bite Village
The Social Bite Village was launched in May 2018 and provides safe accommodation for people experiencing homelessness, creating an alternative to the sub-standard and ineffective temporary accommodation solutions that currently exist. The Social Bite Village in Edinburgh combines an innovative housing model, using vacant council-owned land, with a supported community environment. The project is entirely geared at breaking the cycle of homelessness and giving residents pathways into employment and permanent housing. This is a project run in partnership with an incredible Edinburgh-based homelessness charity called Cyrenians.
We’re currently fundraising for two new Social Bite Villages".
Just recently my wife graduated from her Open University masters degree and we went upto sunny Glasgow for the ceremony.
Near the venue there was a cafe called Social Bite which was also a charity to help homeless people.
This is some bumf off their website which is...HERE.
"The Social Bite Village
The Social Bite Village was launched in May 2018 and provides safe accommodation for people experiencing homelessness, creating an alternative to the sub-standard and ineffective temporary accommodation solutions that currently exist. The Social Bite Village in Edinburgh combines an innovative housing model, using vacant council-owned land, with a supported community environment. The project is entirely geared at breaking the cycle of homelessness and giving residents pathways into employment and permanent housing. This is a project run in partnership with an incredible Edinburgh-based homelessness charity called Cyrenians.
We’re currently fundraising for two new Social Bite Villages".
On a far smaller scale, last year just before Christmas while walking our dog at about quarter to six in the morning I spotted two homeless people sleeping rough under a bridge with two dogs.
First time I apologised for disturbing them, then went on my way thinking I could have done something.
Cut a very long story short and I pestered the council into fulfilling their obligations, we fostered one of their dogs for a couple of months so they could get into accommodation as they couldn't get in with pets.
Someone else they knew looked after the other (but it was ill and neexed put down unfortunately).
I ferried em about a bit and learned a fair bit myself.
Yeah, they were addicts, still people though eh?
I wouldn't want em in my house but was still happy to help them.
Or, to put it another way, I couldn't just leave them under a bridge in winter, they were burning clothes they weren't wearing to keep warm. They weren't gonna last through the winter.
Last I heard they were still alive, err... not much Iknow but not pushing up daisy's yet.
Could do with knowing how the dog is but to be fair, the lass took better care of her dog than herself.
First time I apologised for disturbing them, then went on my way thinking I could have done something.
Cut a very long story short and I pestered the council into fulfilling their obligations, we fostered one of their dogs for a couple of months so they could get into accommodation as they couldn't get in with pets.
Someone else they knew looked after the other (but it was ill and neexed put down unfortunately).
I ferried em about a bit and learned a fair bit myself.
Yeah, they were addicts, still people though eh?
I wouldn't want em in my house but was still happy to help them.
Or, to put it another way, I couldn't just leave them under a bridge in winter, they were burning clothes they weren't wearing to keep warm. They weren't gonna last through the winter.
Last I heard they were still alive, err... not much Iknow but not pushing up daisy's yet.
Could do with knowing how the dog is but to be fair, the lass took better care of her dog than herself.
I'm tempted to say it's not possible, but of course it is, but not easily.
If you consider it in a sort of blue sky ideal fix-the-world way, without getting embroiled in the financial and political realities that prevent such stuff from happening. I think this is what Tee Dee meant.
Looking at subjects in this way can actually come up with solutions and options not considered, which is why some companies have Blue Sky group sessions. They need careful external "referees" to keep them on course, the usual problem being the boss being there, or a bully, or strong opinions that find it too difficult to let go and think wider.
The other problem is the lack of knowledge or experience of the subject matter, which can also be a strength if someone else can describe it for them without expressing the limitations perceived by others.
There is a demographic that is significant but has not been mentioned - Youth. A substantial number have not learnt to live within a home with others, or accept what we see as the realities of life. Their refusal to moderate or accept limitations has led to them effectively making themselves homeless, deliberately or by being excluded from a home situation.
There is a situation that we could all agree is not acceptable, e.g. abusive, violent, incapable adults - There are several organisations who can help on this. Many youngsters claim this as a reason, when it is just an excuse for their own behaviour. There are a variety of reasons for their attitudes and behaviour, and it is very difficult to help this cohort, even with limitless resources, and time.
Viable employment and it's location is another key factor. There are areas with vacant housing but nobody wants to live there, due to location, lack of facilites/amenities and employment. It would take a huge amount of relocation of services, skills and manufacturing to change this. Which is where the financial and political realities of life become the blockers.
If this were possible it would rebalance many of the aspects causing honelessness, but has to be done with care. Typically one hand tries to do something like this, but the other hand dumps a problem of their own on to it and ruins it.
If you consider it in a sort of blue sky ideal fix-the-world way, without getting embroiled in the financial and political realities that prevent such stuff from happening. I think this is what Tee Dee meant.
Looking at subjects in this way can actually come up with solutions and options not considered, which is why some companies have Blue Sky group sessions. They need careful external "referees" to keep them on course, the usual problem being the boss being there, or a bully, or strong opinions that find it too difficult to let go and think wider.
The other problem is the lack of knowledge or experience of the subject matter, which can also be a strength if someone else can describe it for them without expressing the limitations perceived by others.
There is a demographic that is significant but has not been mentioned - Youth. A substantial number have not learnt to live within a home with others, or accept what we see as the realities of life. Their refusal to moderate or accept limitations has led to them effectively making themselves homeless, deliberately or by being excluded from a home situation.
There is a situation that we could all agree is not acceptable, e.g. abusive, violent, incapable adults - There are several organisations who can help on this. Many youngsters claim this as a reason, when it is just an excuse for their own behaviour. There are a variety of reasons for their attitudes and behaviour, and it is very difficult to help this cohort, even with limitless resources, and time.
Viable employment and it's location is another key factor. There are areas with vacant housing but nobody wants to live there, due to location, lack of facilites/amenities and employment. It would take a huge amount of relocation of services, skills and manufacturing to change this. Which is where the financial and political realities of life become the blockers.
If this were possible it would rebalance many of the aspects causing honelessness, but has to be done with care. Typically one hand tries to do something like this, but the other hand dumps a problem of their own on to it and ruins it.
To cut the gordian knot, the cause of homelessness is evictions, ergo you need to prevent that in some way.
Taking housing back into public ownership would be a good strategy. As it stands, if you can't pay your rent it's in your landlords best interest to evict you, but this is negative for both the person and for society. Homelessness is very expensive to the taxpayer.
However if the government (big or local) own the homes, then there won't be evictions. Because all it does is pass the problem from office A to office B. If they evict you... You are still their problem, a much bigger and more expensive one. So it's in everyone's best interest to keep that person in their home.
Basically, guaranteed housing as a general principle in society. Once someone has become homeless, they have so many more problems to solve & it's further to get back on track. I agree the projects which house the homeless are effective, but this is taking one step further upstream to keep them in a house in the first place.
Taking housing back into public ownership would be a good strategy. As it stands, if you can't pay your rent it's in your landlords best interest to evict you, but this is negative for both the person and for society. Homelessness is very expensive to the taxpayer.
However if the government (big or local) own the homes, then there won't be evictions. Because all it does is pass the problem from office A to office B. If they evict you... You are still their problem, a much bigger and more expensive one. So it's in everyone's best interest to keep that person in their home.
Basically, guaranteed housing as a general principle in society. Once someone has become homeless, they have so many more problems to solve & it's further to get back on track. I agree the projects which house the homeless are effective, but this is taking one step further upstream to keep them in a house in the first place.
Not disagreeing with your central premise, there has always been a sector of the population that are unable to have their own home and for whom the rental sector, public or private, exists.
But believe me, if you are evicted from a council place you are not really handed to office B, they make it very clear that you are no longer their problem!
If you are very lucky, you might be put into a hostel or rough bed and breakfast, at the bottom of the scale, but usually not. Their view is that you have refused to comply or accept what was put before you, and that is the end of the responsibility.
First of all
That is a good thought at this and any time of the year so thank Tee Dee. First and foremost though it is not a crisis. It seems that every problem we have in society is a crisis so let's get it into perspective. The capitalist system works on demand and competition Ie. ten people trying to get one house. Therefore it is set up in a way so there is not enough and prices etc can be controlled. That creates a problem from the off. If anyone in power really wanted to do something then they could build a load of houses and the problem would be solved. That's the reality of the market and many people are priced out of it. The subject of homelessness has several facets. There are many causes and no one answer to them all. Many people living on the street have a drug problem and others with mental health issues. They find a camaraderie on the street. Many lack the life skills to integrate back into society if indeed they were ever there in first place.. Others have lost their job or gone through a divorce and find themselves homeless that way.
I don't know what the answer is or if there even is one.
I do know that I was street homeless drug addict thirty years ago and I got clean and went on to work with the homeless. Even then with all the services we had in place the success rate was disappointingly low. All I do nowadays when I encounter homeless people is to be kind and help in whatever small way I can. I think a little love goes a long way. d x
Good for you mate, and I agree with your latter point entirely.
I was thrown out of my family home at the right time in history, I was able to fall back on a Council flat. Homelessness has always been a thing, particularly after the war, but it was solved by the mass building of Council housing. My grandparents were saved by Council housing during the depression when they couldn't pay the mortgage, my brother was able to get a start in Council housing before he moved out an bought his own. In case anybody says that Council house is a left wing socialist invention, it isn't it was a Conservative party innovation.
Mod hat on:
Thanks to everyone participating in the spirit in which the thread was started. A few posts have been pruned, and a few more were straying close to the line, but I don't think they crossed it.
Mod hat off:
I have no suggestions, certainly nothing that hasn't been suggested by others here. One thing that all us armchair economist should bear in mind is the Law of Unintended Consequences. Government intervention has often been rather lacking in the sort of foresight needed to avoid such consequences, even when it was well intentioned to begin with.
Thanks to everyone participating in the spirit in which the thread was started. A few posts have been pruned, and a few more were straying close to the line, but I don't think they crossed it.
Mod hat off:
I have no suggestions, certainly nothing that hasn't been suggested by others here. One thing that all us armchair economist should bear in mind is the Law of Unintended Consequences. Government intervention has often been rather lacking in the sort of foresight needed to avoid such consequences, even when it was well intentioned to begin with.
Somewhere in Germany they have experimented with placing out these pods here and there where homeless people can at least sleep sheltered for the night even if not live in them.
Something like this I think would be a good solution.
Build a large hangar type of structure and inside that make small one man cabins where homeless can at least spend the night and have shared fascilities to get a shower and perhaps get clothes washed.
Something like this:
German pod for homeless.
Something like this I think would be a good solution.
Build a large hangar type of structure and inside that make small one man cabins where homeless can at least spend the night and have shared fascilities to get a shower and perhaps get clothes washed.
Something like this:
German pod for homeless.
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The charities I worked alongside were really only short term fixes, they would turn up in vans, offer a hot meal AND a bag with sandwiches, crisps, water, sweets (for the next meal) then leave a few hours later. Would feed hundreds of people in the Charing Cross area.
Disappointingly was the amount of rubbish left behind by the customers. The food trays and bags would be left on the street, to the point that the council were looking to find the charity for littering!
A short term fix I worked on once was an ex student halls turned into a hostel over the winter. On arrival people would be given a starter kit of toothbrush, paste, soap and a set of clothes (primark sweatshirt and jeans). Their own clothes were put in a net bag and washed (some were binned and replaced as would not survive the wash)
Hot showers and 3 hot meals a day, dentist and nurse on site as well as citizens advice, mental health workers and councillors availible.
It was an eye opener. Fights common, staff and volunteers physically and verbally assaulted. Many left a few days in.
It was not repeated the next year and deemed a failure. Sad because for some it made a real difference and gave them time to get back on the right path, build bridges with family etc.
Not a long term solution I know
Disappointingly was the amount of rubbish left behind by the customers. The food trays and bags would be left on the street, to the point that the council were looking to find the charity for littering!
A short term fix I worked on once was an ex student halls turned into a hostel over the winter. On arrival people would be given a starter kit of toothbrush, paste, soap and a set of clothes (primark sweatshirt and jeans). Their own clothes were put in a net bag and washed (some were binned and replaced as would not survive the wash)
Hot showers and 3 hot meals a day, dentist and nurse on site as well as citizens advice, mental health workers and councillors availible.
It was an eye opener. Fights common, staff and volunteers physically and verbally assaulted. Many left a few days in.
It was not repeated the next year and deemed a failure. Sad because for some it made a real difference and gave them time to get back on the right path, build bridges with family etc.
Not a long term solution I know
There is no one route to homelessness.
There is no one cure to homelessness.
There is no cheap easy option to reverse the homelessness situation.
I think it needs a multi-pronged, and not just funded properly, but done so with open minds and an acceptance that the homeless are all indivuals with individual issues and lives.
With rights come responsibilities. Too often no responsibility gives a kind of carte blanche for utter selfishness, aggression and entitlement.
There are so many who genuinely need help, would accept and work with help to get their lives on a sound footing again, but all too often their needs are subsumed by the selfishly and uncaring few.....and it's those who make the headlines, not the quiet folks who get back on their feet.
The failures get more notice than the successes.
It means that its all too easy for folks to wash their hands, and refuse to provide consistent funding, for the whole issue.
It's not just one size fits all.
It never has been.
A genuinely social society which provides a multi pronged range of support, consistently, is I think the only way to resolve what is a horrendous indictment on our country.
M
There is no one cure to homelessness.
There is no cheap easy option to reverse the homelessness situation.
I think it needs a multi-pronged, and not just funded properly, but done so with open minds and an acceptance that the homeless are all indivuals with individual issues and lives.
With rights come responsibilities. Too often no responsibility gives a kind of carte blanche for utter selfishness, aggression and entitlement.
There are so many who genuinely need help, would accept and work with help to get their lives on a sound footing again, but all too often their needs are subsumed by the selfishly and uncaring few.....and it's those who make the headlines, not the quiet folks who get back on their feet.
The failures get more notice than the successes.
It means that its all too easy for folks to wash their hands, and refuse to provide consistent funding, for the whole issue.
It's not just one size fits all.
It never has been.
A genuinely social society which provides a multi pronged range of support, consistently, is I think the only way to resolve what is a horrendous indictment on our country.
M
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