How to keep warm without a fire?

[taws6]

Hi,

I like to do a spot of wildcamping, but having a fire will give away my being there.
What methods / kit do you all use to keep warm on a cold winters night without the comfort of a fire?
A hot water bottle, the missis ( wink wink ), and a drop of wiskey are things I am already considering. Have you any other tips / tricks I could use to help keep me warm?

I am sure I once saw battery heated socks, but can't find them now, and have looked high and low, seen any lately?

On a side note, all this snow should be great for tracking today!!

 

[Ogri the trog]

There are a number of measures you can take, but in sub-zero temperatures without a fire, you will be at a serious dissadvantage.
Effective insulation, diet, hydration and shelter are all things that you'll need to consider. Can you use a stove to make hot food & drinks or will you be out for the whole trip without using any heat source?

Have fun

Ogri the trog

 

[Shambling Shaman]

Hot food and drinks (Avoid Alcohol) insulation - Stay dry

Ogri the trog asks a good question about the stove?

 

[rik_uk3]

To be honest, if you don't have good winter kit I'd stay home.

As Ogri said, take a stove for hot food and drinks, no reliable stove = no trip, hot water bottle is good, alcohol is not good; and without upsetting the hammock lovers here, I'd take a tent. You don't need a fire to enjoy cold weather camping and to stay warm, but you do need the right gear and experience.

I'm making some bread in my bread maker just now, without doubt the whole of Aberdare will be sold out now we have had some snow

 

[Jared]

Pile of hand warmers.

http://www.peacockhandwarmers.co.uk/

And I agree not taking a stove is unwise.

 

[Black Sheep]

Pile of hand warmers.

http://www.peacockhandwarmers.co.uk/

I've got some similar too these (although mine must be 30 years +) they work really well and get very warm.

I didn't know they still made them.

 

[sandbender]

What methods / kit do you all use to keep warm on a cold winters night without the comfort of a fire?

Mors Kochanski's site has a useful downloadable .pdf on dressing for the cold here...

http://www.karamat.com/articles.html

However a stove to provide hot food and drink is your best bet

 

[Bushwhacker]

As an improvisation, you can pee into a plastic bottle and use it as a hot water bottle.
It's enough heat to warm your hands and feet for a bit.

Avoid tucking your head into your sleeping bag - condensation from your breath will make you damp and even more cold.

Avoid sweating.
Sleep with minimum amount of layers on, have your boots inside your bag underneath your knees, socks across your chest to dry off if slightly damp and pull your trousers down to your ankles. If you get cold you can add layers as neccessary/pull trousers up. If you start off with all layers on, you could fall asleep, start sweating and get cold very quickly.

Increase your calorie intake, you'll be burning more energy to stay warm.

 

[BorderReiver]

Hi,

I like to do a spot of wildcamping, but having a fire will give away my being there.
What methods / kit do you all use to keep warm on a cold winters night without the comfort of a fire?
A hot water bottle, the missis ( wink wink ), and a drop of wiskey are things I am already considering. Have you any other tips / tricks I could use to help keep me warm?

I am sure I once saw battery heated socks, but can't find them now, and have looked high and low, seen any lately?
On a side note, all this snow should be great for tracking today!!

Try motorcycle clothing outlets; socks, gloves, waistcoats. You'll need a sledge to carry the battery too.

 

[helixpteron]

How to keep warm without a fire?

Her name is........

 

[Melonfish]

stove is a must, hot food/drink will warm you and keep you hydrated and fueled!
the handwarmers are a brill idea btw, the rechargable types last a good while and you can also get the mini burner ones. you'll reek of charcoal but you'll be toasty warm.
the snap type ones i hear work well under the armpits, helps heat your core and so the warmed blood gets pumped around your body and you'll be nice and toasty warm
remember good socks and hat too to keep those big radiators insulated.

 

[Nagual]

Another thing you may try is vapour lock. The theory is quite simple - you wear a plastic suit as a base layer. This stops any moisture from evaporating. Since evaporation is a primary cause for heat loss you can stay warmer with less. Now don't get me wrong here, I've over simplified the explanation, I'm sure a simple google search will turn up more.

It doesn't remove the need to wear good clothes and have decent bedding, however it does help reduce the amount of kit you have to take. Trail mag had a piece on it last year, with the tester up in the hills over night. He was surprised at the difference it made. He was keen to point out though that he had to get the balance right,as if you sweat too much you get water sloshing about.. once you take off the plastic in the morning, the little moisture there is quickly evaporates, he said.

 

[sandbender]

Have you any other tips / tricks I could use to help keep me warm?

I have worn a Buffalo Teclite shirt and trousers in very cold and wet conditions and by keeping active and eating high calorie foods I have managed to stay warm, however its the staying active part that stops you freezing, Buffalo clothing doesn't stop you getting wet but it does a good job of regulating your temperature however when you stop to make camp you must change into something warmer and dryer.

 

[Steve M]

It might also be worth asking about the sleeping arrangement you have. Are you ground dwelling with lots of insulation or in a hammock with an under slung mattress?

 

[Zappa]

Must say I agree with Rik-uk3; Alcohol is a Bad idea; tends to reduce your body's core temperature; so your system draws blood away from hands & feet in order to protect vital organs; NOT Good at all.

 

[taws6]

Thanks for all the replies.

I aways have my crusader cooker and mug combo.
I am thinking of swapping it for something lighter, as it's quiet heavy, but I like the way it packs up small.

Rechargeable hand warmers are great, I can reboil them for reuse also.

Diet is something I hadn't considered, but I always keep well hydrated with warm drinks. Same for the sip of wiskey, shame I'll leave it at home.

I am a ground dweller, in tent with plenty of natural insulation underneath as standard. I am considering going the hammock route for summer use just for the reduced weight and pack size. Is a hammock warm enough in winter with a underblanket??

Any more tip, post em up.......

 

[Pict]

Good advice here. Go to sleep bone dry, change your socks to dry ones. Boil water in your stove and fill your canteen, use the cover on the canteen to hold the heat longer. Sweep away the snow under your shelter and layer natural dry cover as thick as possible, cover that with a thermal pad. A windproof shelter is a must to keep air convection to a minimum. Eat a meal before going to bed, load up on carbs. Wear a warm hat while sleeping.

Don't lay there and shiver, if you are that cold you won't fall asleep anyway so get up, get moving, get warm, and try again. Take that half hour to resolve your problem and make a change that will allow you to get back to sleep. If that means reheating your canteen water with a stove do it.

Even if you are not planning to make a fire for fear of being seen have one laid out and ready to light. If you do this while you are still warm and not hypothermic you will appreciate the effort later when you are. Chances are there will be very few people up and about when you light it at 3:30 AM. The last thing you want to do at 3:30 when you wake up mumbling and stumbling cold is go out and find fuel. If you don't need the fire fine, but have it ready just in case. Mac

 

[ZDP-189]

Exactly how low profile do you want to be? Here are some ideas, depending on how desperate you are to be undetected.

Level 1: Leave no trace
Use a stove held off the ground and burn low-ash fuel.

Level 2: Be undetected by passers by
Camp well back from the trail, use a stove held off the ground alcohol-based fuels. Diffuse steam under a tree.

Level 3: Be undetected by people looking for you like game wardens and caretakers

This is closer to my situation. If I want to camp in a country park outside a campsite there'd be big fines and potentially a year's imprisonment threatened (the law's designed to stop unofficial property development, squatters and prevent wildfires).

Canvas Option - Camp low to the ground, under the hill ridge line, but not in a gully where cold air will flow down and pool. Use a long, low one man tent. Lie on a thermal pad, and line the inside of your tent with a reflective blanket.

Hammock Option - I think I may be on better legal ground if I hang in a string hammock in a simple bad and bivi, because I'm not "erecting a temporary shelter". Avoidance of shelter means I can't have a underquilt and will try to use a short pad. I also have two very low profile hammock set ups, one is a bridge bag hammock that adds just 2-4 ounces extra weight to a sleeping bag and eliminates the need for a pad or underblanket, and the other is a full cocooned bridge bivibag, complete with elastic baffles.

Both options involve using MRE reheaters to cook food and and fill canteens, wrap them and use them as hot water bottles.

Level 4: Be of low thermal profile to FLIR

I dunno, but at a guess, entrench, use a thick blanket lined bivi and use a camoflaged and thermal lined tarp. Ensure a gentle breeze that will diffuse a build up of heat from your breath.

Level 5: Be completely invisible

Perhaps a well sited snow cave?

 

[Peter_t]

two sleeping bags?

pete

 

[Mike Ameling]

A lot depends upon what you consider ... comfortable.

I've camped many times at below zero (farenhiet) temps without a fire, and been "comfortable. But I was much more acclimated to the outside temps, and was not expecting normal inside household temps. In fact, my outside layer of clothing was froze in some places.

Tips? Many were already given.

Insulate yourself from the ground.
Protect yourself from falling moisture and any wind/breeze.
Keep hydrated - and "warm" liquids are not necessary but are nice.
Eat lots of high-calorie foods - to stoke up those internal fires.

And look into wearing an insulated coverall. Make sure it is large/big enough to not be tight on you - especially with a couple extra layers of clothing underneath. That one simple garment becomes your outside clothing layer, protects you from wind/moisture, and is almost like walking around wearing a sleeping bag. Farmers, construction workers, laborers, loggers, dock workers learned about these many many years ago. And the snowmobile people quickly followed their lead. (Forget those ski slope snow-bunny suits. They are more fashion than useful.) I've spent a number of days hunting and several nights out with just that insulated coverall - in the snow with temps down well below zero (Farenheit). (probably in the minus 20 to minus 40 range Celcius)

Bring along food that you like and that DOES NOT require heat to cook it.

If you can't carry along enough water, then carry a filter instead of relying upon boiling "found" water to make it safe to drink.

And then mentally prepare yourself to being cold. Don't fight it. Just "accept" that you might be cold, and live with it. That "fighting the cold" stuff just ends up making it worse. Once you make that mental decision, things do go better. That "worry" about the cold really saps and tires you out.

Just a few humble thoughts to share. Take them as such.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands