How safe is river water?

[blacktimberwolf]

Remember too folks, when you do drink river water & if you fall ill, even mildly, you will lose a lot of precious kidney cells as they try to filter out the toxins, & like brain neurones, kidney cells don't replace themselves once dead.....not to worry, just a question of frequency, like drinking alcohol, a pint of beer will cost you 30,000 neurones & most of us can afford to loose them now & again, but if you sink a couple of pints a night , soon adds up.......................

 

[blacktimberwolf]

In the UK, we graze sheep on upland pastures. This means you can't assume clear babbling brooks in the hills are ok for drinking unboiled. Just google liver fluke.

Absolutly......clear does not = pure or clean.

 

[blacktimberwolf]

Just a word about water filters, these were originaly developed for military use, to be used by special forces in extreme conditions, where there is no alternative but to drink any water available & the idea is just to reduce the side effects on the soldiers so they would be able to continue their mission. They do not render the water pristine, the filters do not remove all polluants...what these men HAVE to drink & what we choose to drink should be 2 different things.

 

[bearman]

very true, but many things we take for granted now were developed by the millitary, I would hazard to say that increased demand from the recreation industry would have sped along the development of this kind of filter, and they are by no means corse or inferior. The katadyn pocket filters to 2 microns, and according to my sibling that is small enough to filter out most bacteria found in the water supplies in this country, and will definitely filter out all cysts and protazoa. However being of a more cautious nature, I still use the UV to give it a final sweep. I have had no trouble with this system and have used it in the UK, Europe, Canada and Alaska and more recently i used it for around 80% of the water i drank throughout sub-saharan Africa.

 

[John Fenna]

I hate chlorine - makes me chuck up - Iodine is OK if post treatment the water has vit C added to it, boiling works well for most living nasties but not chemical pollutants, filtration through iodine resin worked very well, the new Katadyn filters seem very good and Lifesaver Bottle is supurb if not too compact!
I have spent half my life drinking from untreated mountain streams (above habitation level) and have also drunk streamwater that proved to have half a green sheep in it (furthur up) without harm...
I have drunk the River Severn by Iron Bridge using water bottles of various integral filter types and been fine.
I have relied on filtration and boiling around the world with good results (though other nasties have got me none were from drinking water!)

I have also seen a live tapeworm come out of a domestic tap in a farmhouse on the Welsh borders.....and folk got seriously ill from chemical polution of the domestic water supplies in the South West a few years back...sometimes the water in my taps at home (taken from a river that has several sewerage treatment plants feeding into it....) is so heavily chemically treated as to be disgusting to the taste buds - while the village well is just up the road and is seemingly pure!
I have at times filled watercans from a local (tested) spring rather than use the tap water....

Stick to wine, beer or whiskey as they did in Medeaval times and you should be fine (most spirits also go by the alternative name "Water of Life)

Do your research then....
Pick your poison

 

[blacktimberwolf]

What I like about forums is that there are as many differing points of view as there are stars in the sky, which goes to prouve that no one holds the absolute truth.....................................

 

[bearman]

What I like about forums is that there are as many differing points of view as there are stars in the sky, which goes to prouve that no one holds the absolute truth.....................................

Good point, I think its just a case of using what you're happy with and drinking from where you feel confident. When traveling i learnt that most people were ill through poorly prepared food and poor hygiene than through bad water!

 

[blacktimberwolf]

I think I got off at the wrong stop here, mountain & hill walkers / bushccrafters apart, I cannot see why anyone going to a bushcrafing location, to play about with bits of wood & do a bit of cooking would choose to risk drinking from a river in the UK, when they are only a few miles from a tap or their car, should they be stupid enough not to bring any with them....we are talking bushcraft here, not survivalism......prehaps it's a widerness fantasy thing or gadget junkies wanting to test their expensive toys.., I don't know............enlighten me someone.please..........................

 

[Retired Member southey]

I think I got off at the wrong stop here, mountain & hill walkers / bushccrafters apart, I cannot see why anyone going to a bushcrafing location, to play about with bits of wood & do a bit of cooking would choose to risk drinking from a river in the UK, when they are only a few miles from a tap or their car, should they be stupid enough not to bring any with them....we are talking bushcraft here, not survivalism......prehaps it's a widerness fantasy thing or gadget junkies wanting to test their expensive toys.., I don't know............enlighten me someone.please..........................

ERE! I don't use expensive toys or gadgets, I am a hill walker, I do go to wild places in the UK, sometimes with the intention of staying for longer than a one night, I plan routes via water sources so as to keep pack weight down, as said before I use a milbank bag( very cheap) to filter water from where ever I get it from (streams/dew ponds/lakes/rivers/hill run off) and replenish my drinking bottles at night for the next day. it's not fantasy or survival-ism it's using skills and techniques to make life easier for myself by reducing the weight of my pack, I don't like to stay on camp sites, and I'm not always only a few miles from my car or a tap so processing water by the best (in my opinion) means available to me with minimal chance of failure makes for a much more enjoyable trip. calling people stupid and fantasists is not helpful or instructive, it is poor manners and bad form.

southey.

 

[John Fenna]

I think I got off at the wrong stop here, mountain & hill walkers / bushccrafters apart, I cannot see why anyone going to a bushcrafing location, to play about with bits of wood & do a bit of cooking would choose to risk drinking from a river in the UK, when they are only a few miles from a tap or their car, should they be stupid enough not to bring any with them....we are talking bushcraft here, not survivalism......prehaps it's a widerness fantasy thing or gadget junkies wanting to test their expensive toys.., I don't know............enlighten me someone.please..........................

I know some folk never get far from civilization to do their bushcraft... but many do!
I have personally used bushcraft skills to make my life pleasant in the UK, Thailand, wilder parts of South Africa, remote areas in Ghana, mountainous Morrocco, deep in Croatia etc etc while on expeditions with young people, on my own or just in good company of other Bushcrafters.
Not all "Bushcraft locations" have running hot and cold and flush toilets mate!
I hope that helps enlighten you a little

 

[bearman]

ERE! I don't use expensive toys or gadgets, I am a hill walker, I do go to wild places in the UK, sometimes with the intention of staying for longer than a one night, I plan routes via water sources so as to keep pack weight down, as said before I use a milbank bag( very cheap) to filter water from where ever I get it from (streams/dew ponds/lakes/rivers/hill run off) and replenish my drinking bottles at night for the next day. it's not fantasy or survival-ism it's using skills and techniques to make life easier for myself by reducing the weight of my pack, I don't like to stay on camp sites, and I'm not always only a few miles from my car or a tap so processing water by the best (in my opinion) means available to me with minimal chance of failure makes for a much more enjoyable trip. calling people stupid and fantasists is not helpful or instructive, it is poor manners and bad form.

I totally agree, i often go walking for several days at a time and am no where near conventional water sources, anyone that can carry enough drinking water for 3-4 days hiking (especially in the summer months) plus all the gear needed to stay out for that length of time is a better man than me. Personally sitting in the woods a few miles from your car is not what its all about, if i do happen to be in my local spots its only to hone my skills for when i'm really out in the wilds. Its nothing to do with survivalism its about common sense-water weights a kilo per liter! If it is possible to source processed water i'm sure many (including myself) would take that option, i thought the whole point of this thread was to discuss the best methods of treating water when normal sources are not available. I do use a rather expensive system but thats my personal preference, and after careful consideration I decided that it was the best system for me. Besides tap water is the same water that runs in our rivers, streams and reservoirs all the water companys do is filter it, add in chemicals and UV treat it before it arrives at our taps, and as Mr Fenna mentioned, in rural areas the water supply to homes can be compromised anyway. I consider sourcing food, water, shelter and heat the fundamentals of bushcraft regardless of where one may find oneself, perhaps i should start bushcrafting in my back garden and save myself the bother...

 

[mayobushcraft]

Amen
To what Southey and Mr Fenna say. Even a three day stay a 1/4 mile from road or tap is a lot of water to carry.

 

[Paganwolf]

I think I got off at the wrong stop here, mountain & hill walkers / bushccrafters apart, I cannot see why anyone going to a bushcrafing location, to play about with bits of wood & do a bit of cooking would choose to risk drinking from a river in the UK, when they are only a few miles from a tap or their car, should they be stupid enough not to bring any with them....we are talking bushcraft here, not survivalism......prehaps it's a widerness fantasy thing or gadget junkies wanting to test their expensive toys.., I don't know............enlighten me someone.please..........................

a litre of water weighs 1kg you need about 2/2.5 ltres in a temperate environment to stay properly hydrated (that more than most drink in 2 days!) then you have other water needs personal admin ect, do the math, or take a donkey, i aint carrying lots of water when i have the knowledge to precure it and make it potable in the field, knowledge weighs nowt bud..Im with you John F, i deffo wouldnt drink tap water most places i go to!! lol

 

[ex member mick sturbs]

Just joining in , James hit the nail on the head we camped for 3 days only a mile or so from tap , but our gear was plenty heavy enough, i know i am very fortunate because the spring water where we were is perfectly clear and good , i know i have it tested twice a year , because we rent holiday cottages and it is a legal requirement ,it would be extremely difficult ,if at all possible without a sherpa, to carry enough water for a 3 day trip , and as mentioned before common sense , a millbank bag and boiling , does the trick. dont get me started on the weight of beer !

ps even with testing there is not a scenario where a sheep carcass etc is not a few metres up stream , which might upset my delicate bushcrafting tummy !

 

[Paganwolf]

take dehydrated water and dehydrated beer easy

 

[bearman]

take dehydrated water and dehydrated beer easy

 

[John Fenna]

take dehydrated water and dehydrated beer easy

Ooooooooooo! Can I buy some off you?

 

[blacktimberwolf]

Wow! thanks for that guys, a rap on the Knuckles does sting a bit, but if you don't know or understand.....ask.
I can see your point & glad to be hearing from real bushwhackers.& I'm envious of the untamed wilderness you seem to have found in Britain......the UK does have some incredible " wild" places, the lakes, the beacons, yorkshire moors, dartmoor just to name a few, & I'll willingly drink the river water from these places, but I had in mind the water courses in more down to eath landscapes, those which pass through towns & agricultural land.....but if you say it's safe to drink, then it must be.
For a 2 nighter I carry 6 litres ( I have to carry my dog's supply too) & this is enough ( for me/us) summer or winter..Unfortunatly I can't do longer stints for the forseable future but if I did then I suppose I would have to resolve to drinking river water, radio-active or not.
Sorry for taking this thread away from it's original topic, I do tend to do that, but you guys are so damn interesting, I don't often get the chance to talk to "real people" about these things & I do like to " explore" a subject.
I am learning all the time & you guys have certainly taught me a thing or two.........................

 

[John Fenna]

Wow! thanks for that guys, a rap on the Knuckles does sting a bit, but if you don't know or understand.....ask.
I can see your point & glad to be hearing from real bushwhackers.& I'm envious of the untamed wilderness you seem to have found in Britain......the UK does have some incredible " wild" places, the lakes, the beacons, yorkshire moors, dartmoor just to name a few, & I'll willingly drink the river water from these places, but I had in mind the water courses in more down to eath landscapes, those which pass through towns & agricultural land.....but if you say it's safe to drink, then it must be.
For a 2 nighter I carry 6 litres ( I have to carry my dog's supply too) & this is enough ( for me/us) summer or winter..Unfortunatly I can't do longer stints for the forseable future but if I did then I suppose I would have to resolve to drinking river water, radio-active or not.
Sorry for taking this thread away from it's original topic, I do tend to do that, but you guys are so damn interesting, I don't often get the chance to talk to "real people" about these things & I do like to " explore" a subject.
I am learning all the time & you guys have certainly taught me a thing or two.........................

You asked for enlightenment ...and I think you got some
I would say that - once you have treated any health threats that you might think are present, with an apropriate method - then water is water
Drink it

 

[blacktimberwolf]

You asked for enlightenment ...and I think you got some
I would say that - once you have treated any health threats that you might think are present, with an apropriate method - then water is water
Drink it

yeah I'm begining to believe it, & all those chemicals that can't be filtered out, just adds body to your brew.....as soon as I find a way to remove the insecticide, fungicide & herbicide residues, dioxins & the radio activity of the rivers I have on my haunts, I'll certainly drink it, I'll also drop a word to the water & health authorities of my success, as they've been trying for decades.