Frame or integral? rucksack (pack) design

[Pattree]

A question prompted by the “What I’ve just bought” thread:-

Rucksacks - external frame or integral support?

I used to use an external frame. The first time I tried a rucksack with integral support I had borrowed it and I nearly didn’t give it back.
For me internal frames are a huge step forward but perhaps not for everyone.

I did once see a Finnish rig with an external frame made of ash. It formed a light weight sled and even though there wasn’t any snow, the frame made it easier to haul up a pitch when climbing.

Just a question.

 

[Man of Tanith]

I like both.
External frame tends to offer more air flow when it's warm weather, plus a lot is retro looking which appeals to me
Internal frame when I'm covering distance definitely

 

[Van-Wild]

Horses for courses I think matey....

I've used external and internal frames. I prefer external frames for heavier loads. The best external frame I've used is the DEI 1606MC, matched with a Platatac Z-Alice rucksack and straps. Hands down the best pack I've ever had, should never have sold it, it was perfect in every way.

I currently have 3 main rucksacks. For my 'lightweight' (sub 8kg) set up I use a Mountain Warehouse 45ltr internal framed pack. For woodland trips I use a Platatac 50ltr frameless pack, which I stiffen with a bodged roll mat padding. For heavy/winter camping I have a Kelty Redcloud 110ltr, external framed pack.

 

[Broch]

Backpacking over the hills - modern(ish) inner frame; for lugging miscellaneous gear around, such as logs, or tools, or even primitive camp gear, I wish I still had my external frame - so much more versatile.

 

[Erbswurst]

I think the larger external frame rucksacks nearly died out because the frames broke in the airports and weren't practical for railway transport.

Interestingly you still get the Norrona Recon Syncroflex, Bergans Powerframe, Savotta XL and Särmä RP80 Recon Pack, huge modern Nordic military rucksacks, and in the US military external frame packs are still regularly issued.

The Tatonka Lastenkraxe is another example, that you find in German hunting and expedition shops. Also a very robust looking thing.

 

[Lean'n'mean]

My very first real ruck back in '79 was an external frame which I used for years but when I moved over to internal framed packs there was no going back. I find they carry the weight better, are more adjustable, far more choice in litrage, fabrics, colours etc. & let's face it, aesthetics are important.......I prefer the look of them.
I don't carry monster loads so I can't see myself ever reverting back to an external framed pack.

 

[TLM]

From what I have seen people use and from some testing the main problem with internal frames is that the Al slats are not bent to fit the user, that has to be done if large loads and even some comfort is required.

 

[Pattree]

@TLM
Not sure I understand this?
It’s never been a problem for me. I think frames of both types have adjustable anchor points for shoulder straps and appropriate padding.

 

[Broch]

Some, not all, "integral support" packs (as you describe them) have internal, malleable, aluminium flat-section bars. These are supposed to be curved to fit the user's back shape but many people just leave them straight to the detriment of pack comfort.

 

[Pattree]

Aha! Didn’t know that. Mine has an “S” curved support which alters the fit as the anchor points for the shoulder straps are raised or lowered.

I am getting some impression that the internal system is appropriate for a rucksack but should you want to use the thing for other work or unusual loads then I can see the uses of a frame.


On another site I was informed that: ”Real men do it externally.” I’m not sure what real women think about that. I don’t think I want that as a bumper sticker.

 

[Lean'n'mean]

Indeed where possible, the aluminium stays on an internal framed pack should be bent to follow the contours of your back as not only will the pack hug you better & so be more stable, it will also be more efficient at transfering the weight to the hip belt.

 

[MikeLA]

I like both.
External frame tends to offer more air flow when it's warm weather, plus a lot is retro looking which appeals to me
Internal frame when I'm covering distance definitely

Same here.
I like an external frame for air flow and in hot weather and internal for distance although this must be light otherwise and internal frame has hurt my back, ( even well known brands ). Happened on numerous long distance walks when I was younger.

 

[Stew]

Same here.
I like an external frame for air flow and in hot weather and internal for distance although this must be light otherwise and internal frame has hurt my back, ( even well known brands ). Happened on numerous long distance walks when I was younger.

My Lowe alpine air zone is great - has a curved back to keep the pack off your back.

 

[Springchicken]

I have - and use - both. For shorter trips, say up to a week, I reach for the internal-framed one; for longer journeys or when carrying bulkier stuff, I take the external-framed version.

They do carry slightly differently, though. The internal feels close and snug whereas, as mentioned in earlier posts, the external is airer. The latter can, on occasions, feel as though you are toting your own, personal rack but that's usually just how you pack it!

Of the two, I think I prefer the external as it is so incredibly versatile, despite its greater weight empty. Even when partially filled, everything can be snugged up very easily and attaching stuff like tents or mats to the frame is straightforward. There is something pleasingly 'retro' about it, too and, thankfully, the maker - Savotta - has made very sure that it can easily resist the attentions of Attila the Baggage Handler.

 

[Pattree]

The following appeared on another site a while back:-

“Real men do it externally.”

I didn’t ask what real women thought about that.

 

[Stew]

Yes, you said that already….

Keep taking the dried frog pills…

 

[Pattree]

Oops! I’m currently resting the other brain cell!

 

[Tengu]

Hold steady guys; Im busy trying to think what I want to trade for mine.

 

[tim_n]

I've been down the rabbit hole recently.
I just bought a Bergen 100ltr from eBay. I was looking at external frame packs, but I couldn't beat the £50 price for a larger sort of rucksack. My main purpose for such a beast was to get my insulated hammock, tarp, sleeping bag, mini pillow, clothing, water, food and cookset over a couple of fields to forest knights woodland.
Being 6ft 4ins, I'm a bit out of the height range for the bergen long back and the pack doesn't quite sit on my hips. The previous owner of the pack has everything tied up with sniper tape to prevent snags and most likely wore webbing which would have put the support directly on their hips.
I don't really want or need webbing, but as I'm not doing big miles with it, I'm not too worried. I think my nights hiking and camping away from a car are probably over.

 

[Tengu]

Ive put mine up on the swapshop.