UK Bowhunting laws

[santaman2000]

Here you go Dwardo. Here's a link to the Florida website. www.myfwc.com/license

The basic licenses are fairly cheap for state residents and a bit more for non-residents. They do nickel and dime you to death with the add-ons; that is unless you opt for the Sportsman's License (mine is only $20 with military discount) which covers every aspect (hunting, freshwater fishing, saltwater fishing, muzzle loader stamp, archery hunting stamp, entry fees to the special game management areas, state duck stamp, etc.)

No license at all is required when hunting or fishing on your own land or when freshwater fishing with live or natural bait (not artificial lures) from the bank or a permanent structure attached to the bank (piers, bridges, etc.) in you home county and when NOT using a reel. This is called the "cane pole law." Seniors (over 65) and disabled also get a discount; their licenses are $1 or free.

 

[Toddy]

Edwin do you not use blunts for reenactment ? Flaming arrows at longships to be burnt apart, that's all that's allowed here at the reenactor's events, etc.,

The Trader selling in Glasgow had armour piercing points The neighbour most definitely did not have blunts and nor did the cretin who shot one of the deer in the Necropolis in Glasgow city centre and left it alive with a bolt sticking out of it's neck

Santaman2000 I think it's the organisation of hunters who are aware of public sensibilities as well as the qualifications/ training/ fees/bag limitations/recording, that might sway opinion here. That said, I doubt that 3% of our population hunt. Might be wrong, but I don't think it's anything like that number.
I do think that if there were a structure to the hunting process, one that did pass muster, then more people would be interested in making the steps to be involved.

cheers,
Toddy

 

[santaman2000]

Yeah our hunting population here is going down ATM. That said it's probably about at least 40% or more that either hunt regularly or occasionally. Higher if you count those that used to but are no longer able for whatever reasons.

Oddly, the fastest growing segment of our hunting population (like the shooting population) are women and girls.

 

[santaman2000]

.....I do think that if there were a structure to the hunting process, one that did pass muster, then more people would be interested in making the steps to be involved.

cheers,
Toddy

Up to a point. But then again, you can over-structure it to the point that it sucks out all the fun.

 

[dwardo]

I doubt that 3% of our population hunt. Might be wrong, but I don't think it's anything like that number.
cheers,
Toddy

Just a feeling here too but there are very few that I know off outside of this forum that hunt. Maybe that is dictated by the lack of a license access to "Public/state" space where hunting is allowed.
Here its all permission and permission plus a lot of £££ for the deer hunts usually over a short period.

Seems to hark back again to the amount of "public" space with adequate numbers of game against the price and availability of a license.

 

[dwardo]

As a matter of interest there is a company in Australia (the owners of which I know) that do fantastic Bushcraft courses - one of which includes bow hunting.

http://www.aussiesurvivalinstructors.com/course-content/

For me, if I was ever to bow hunt, thats how I would like to do it - in context as part of a wider foraging, bushcrafty, outdoor experience. Their knapped arrowheads are the prettiest I have ever seen too

They are just stunners. What philistine would put them on the end of a stick and shoot them at something!

 

[boatman]

Edwin do you not use blunts for reenactment ? Flaming arrows at longships to be burnt apart, that's all that's allowed here at the reenactor's events, etc.,

The Trader selling in Glasgow had armour piercing points The neighbour most definitely did not have blunts and nor did the cretin who shot one of the deer in the Necropolis in Glasgow city centre and left it alive with a bolt sticking out of it's neck

Santaman2000 I think it's the organisation of hunters who are aware of public sensibilities as well as the qualifications/ training/ fees/bag limitations/recording, that might sway opinion here. That said, I doubt that 3% of our population hunt. Might be wrong, but I don't think it's anything like that number.
I do think that if there were a structure to the hunting process, one that did pass muster, then more people would be interested in making the steps to be involved.

cheers,
Toddy

Blunts when we shoot at people, sharps when we demonstrate archery and have them on display. Our have-a-go archery arrows either have field points of blunt cheap "bullet" points as do the arrows we sell mostly. A full range of arrowheads can be bought online or at reenactment events including bodkins and broadheads. My favourites for shooting from my heaviest bow are a modern bodkin version.

According to a Kenyan archaeologist I met some of the broadheads produced in the UK have found their way to Kenya where they have been used in various fights, some by archers against cattle raiders armed with Kalashnikovs.

 

[mrostov]

Faulty arrows.

There is nothing special about compound bows that mean they can't be shot with wooden arrows. I've done thousands of times. If the arrow is damaged or too weak for the bow poundage, then it can break, yes, but this applies to any bow.

Then you have either been using a low strength compound bow or you have been very, very lucky, or both. Compound bows, especially of those of a strength you would use for serious hunting, have a much sharper initial string release that stresses the arrows much more than a traditional style bow, such as a long bow or a recurve. Using wooden arrows with a full strength compound bow is courting disaster. That isn't just my personal wisdom or opinion, that is pretty much gospel with bow hunters.

I've seen the results of this with a friend of mine that wounded himself really bad like that. When I got certified as an archery instructor, one of the things we were stressed to inform people of is to not practice with or hunt with wooden arrows with a compound bow. It's right in the instructor's manual we're required to use, and for good reason.

 

[mrcharly]

For me the skill of stalking is getting the rifleman to within 100 meters where a safe humane shot can be taken.

I'm not rubbish with a bow by any stretch but I wouldn't be confident of shot placement at that range and to hit a saucer sized target zone with certainty I would need to be way closer. It takes more skill.

I was always a rubbish shot, with bow, rifle or pistol.

When I bowhunted, nearly all of the animals I shot were within 10yards. I may have been a rubbish shot, but I got good at stalking.

I think that the reason bow hunting has been banned is because when an animal is wounded by an arrow, it often runs/flies off with the arrow hanging out. Bullet/pellet wounds aren't as visible, so there hasn't been the public objection to hunting with rifle or shotgun.

 

[boatman]

Wooden bolts, even the longer ones, tend not to break when shot from crossbows and the power behind the arrow if far greater that that from a compound bow. The myth about not shooting arrows from a compound is much the same as claiming that wooden arrows shot from a bow of higher poundage than their warranted spine is dangerous. Arrows can break on being shot from a weakness in the arrow of course but that is just the nature of the material.

In fact it is claimed that a wooden arrow from a compound is actually more accurate because it will flex less.
http://www.archeryfocus.com/5-1trad.pdf

Note he is concerned about variations in accuracy from incorrect spine rather than the "danger" of them breaking.

 

[Countryman]

Absolutely agree. There was the case last year of a deer running about with a crossbow bolt sticking out. Press has a field day and the manhunt for the poacher was unprecedented.

10 yards? Only another 9 and you could have gone hand to hand like a real man.

* can't find the video*


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[mrostov]

Wooden bolts, even the longer ones, tend not to break when shot from crossbows and the power behind the arrow if far greater that that from a compound bow. The myth about not shooting arrows from a compound is much the same as claiming that wooden arrows shot from a bow of higher poundage than their warranted spine is dangerous. Arrows can break on being shot from a weakness in the arrow of course but that is just the nature of the material.

In fact it is claimed that a wooden arrow from a compound is actually more accurate because it will flex less.
http://www.archeryfocus.com/5-1trad.pdf

Note he is concerned about variations in accuracy from incorrect spine rather than the "danger" of them breaking.

The danger of shooting wooden arrows from a full strength, pulley style compound bow isn't a myth, it's a fact. The string release has a different dynamic than a conventional bow, even a conventional bow of the same theoretical pull strength. You do it enough and odds are you will, at some point, shatter an arrow shaft immediately upon string release, with the shattered shaft potentially going through your wrist and hand. I live in a state with a lot of bow hunters (Texas), and no one uses wooden arrows with a full strength compound bow specifically for that reason, even though wooden arrows are much less expensive.

I read that article and I disagree with the author about wooden arrows and compound bows, as would most bow hunters. For example, he states the 'power' of the compound bow being the myth, and it's not. It's the dynamic of the sudden string release of the compound bow which is what can shatter a wooden arrow. Now, if you have superman style x-ray vision and can peer into an arrow and determine that it's perfect and strong enough, then, maybe. However, will you reuse your arrows? Every time you fire an arrow and then reuse it, you have a potential problem of possibly causing a flaw.

 

[santaman2000]

The danger of shooting wooden arrows from a full strength, pulley style compound bow isn't a myth, it's a fact. The string release has a different dynamic than a conventional bow, even a conventional bow of the same theoretical pull strength. You do it enough and odds are you will, at some point, shatter an arrow shaft immediately upon string release, with the shattered shaft potentially going through your wrist and hand. I live in a state with a lot of bow hunters (Texas), and no one uses wooden arrows with a full strength compound bow specifically for that reason, even though wooden arrows are much less expensive.......

You've just stated the problem: Not wooden arrows, but cheap arrows. And for the record, a compound bows initial pressure at release is milder than a traditional bow but increases after the first few inches of travel.

Yes. it's a myth.

As for all the bowhunters that don't use wooden arrows, so what? I know scads of firearm hunters that all the same brand of ammo their grand-dads used. And scad more that refuse to use factory ammo. And the biggest one of all! They won't use any brand from Walmart even if it's their favorite (because everybody knows that the ammo companies send their rejects to Walmart)

 

[mrcharly]

I can understand compound bows putting more stress on an arrow - the major 'shove' comes partway through the cycle, and hence the arrow shaft is already flexing.

In my experience (which has been extensive, spanning recurves, flatbows and compounds), arrows made from good quality Port Orford Cedar or Osage Orange don't shatter with splinters. When they break, they do so with a pretty clean snap across the shaft. I've seen cheap arrows made from what looked like pine; frankly I'd never want to use them, for fear of the sort of accident you describe.
The only arrow I've ever seen break on release was carbon fibre, in the early days when this material was not well understood.

If a wooden arrow broke on release, I strongly suspect it was either damaged, or very underspined (possibly with a heavy head).

Wooden arrows with heavy heads have been shot from bows with vast poundages (I've read of 150lb). Unless you are elephant hunting, tbh I don't see much point in bow poundages over 60lb.

I know there are some compound shooters who excel at very accurate shooting out to 90yards (as in grouping in 6"). They are using high-poundage bows, sights, mechanical releases and very light arrows to get a flat fast trajectory. For that sort of shooting, aluminium or cabon fibre would be best. They are pushing the limits of archery and I applaud their skill.

 

[santaman2000]

I can understand compound bows putting more stress on an arrow - the major 'shove' comes partway through the cycle, and hence the arrow shaft is already flexing.

In my experience (which has been extensive, spanning recurves, flatbows and compounds), arrows made from good quality Port Orford Cedar or Osage Orange don't shatter with splinters. When they break, they do so with a pretty clean snap across the shaft. I've seen cheap arrows made from what looked like pine; frankly I'd never want to use them, for fear of the sort of accident you describe.
The only arrow I've ever seen break on release was carbon fibre, in the early days when this material was not well understood.

If a wooden arrow broke on release, I strongly suspect it was either damaged, or very underspined (possibly with a heavy head).

Wooden arrows with heavy heads have been shot from bows with vast poundages (I've read of 150lb). Unless you are elephant hunting, tbh I don't see much point in bow poundages over 60lb.

I know there are some compound shooters who excel at very accurate shooting out to 90yards (as in grouping in 6"). They are using high-poundage bows, sights, mechanical releases and very light arrows to get a flat fast trajectory. For that sort of shooting, aluminium or cabon fibre would be best. They are pushing the limits of archery and I applaud their skill.

Thanks. As usual, your explanation is spot on and much clearer than my attempt.

 

[mrostov]

You've just stated the problem: Not wooden arrows, but cheap arrows. And for the record, a compound bows initial pressure at release is milder than a traditional bow but increases after the first few inches of travel.

Yes. it's a myth.

As for all the bowhunters that don't use wooden arrows, so what? I know scads of firearm hunters that all the same brand of ammo their grand-dads used. And scad more that refuse to use factory ammo. And the biggest one of all! They won't use any brand from Walmart even if it's their favorite (because everybody knows that the ammo companies send their rejects to Walmart)

No, it is not a myth. Do it at your own hazard and don't say you were not warned. You are opening yourself for a world of hurt.

You are trying to split hairs on increments on the string release when the whole process happens in the blink of an eye. When that cam rolls over on a full strength compound bow, that wooden arrow will get stress that wooden arrows were not meant to take, regardless of the wood it's made out of.

Take the perfect wooden arrow, one of the 'not cheap' ones, use it more than once and it will start developing flaws. That is what happens when you take a wooden shaft, any wooden shaft, and impact it into a target, even a soft one. Even the 'not cheap' wooden arrows, if you fired them and you fortunately found them without flaws, take a guess at what happens when you start reusing them a few times.

 

[santaman2000]

No, it is not a myth. Do it at your own hazard and don't say you were not warned. You are opening yourself for a world of hurt.

You are trying to split hairs on increments on the string release when the whole process happens in the blink of an eye. When that cam rolls over on a full strength compound bow, that wooden arrow will get stress that wooden arrows were not meant to take, regardless of the wood it's made out of.

Take the perfect wooden arrow, one of the 'not cheap' ones, use it more than once and it will start developing flaws. That is what happens when you take a wooden shaft, any wooden shaft, and impact it into a target, even a soft one. Even the 'not cheap' wooden arrows, if you fired them and you fortunately found them without flaws, take a guess at what happens when you start reusing them a few times.

Not sure where you're going? You seem to be contradicting your own earlier posts.

Edit: Never mind. I misread who had posted.

 

[mrostov]

Not sure where you're going? You seem to be contradicting your own earlier posts.

Not contradicting myself at all with earlier posts, you are either confused or you haven't read what I wrote.

I'll make it real simple for you. I don't care what wood you make an arrow out of. Use them out of a full strength compound bow and you are playing Russian Roulette with injury.

Let's say you have that elusive critter, the perfect, flawless wooden arrow (flawless and wood tend to seldom be in the same object). If you use that arrow more than once, you will induce flaws, so, what do you gain? Do you throw the arrow away after one use?

Go ahead, use wooden arrows out of a full strength compound bow, even the 'not cheap' ones. Don't say you were not warned.

 

[santaman2000]

.....Take the perfect wooden arrow, one of the 'not cheap' ones, use it more than once and it will start developing flaws. That is what happens when you take a wooden shaft, any wooden shaft, and impact it into a target, even a soft one........

Any wooden shaft? Impact repeatedly? You mean like an axe handle? Or a hammer handle? Or a baseball bat? Yes I've seen all of those break; but it's not the norm.

 

[mrostov]

An arrow undergoes different proportional stresses than any tool handle.

Fine, don't believe me, I've only been shooting arrows and bow hunting both large and small game for over three decades and I'm a certified instructor, what do I know? Go shoot all of the wooden arrows you want to out of a full strength compound bow. You'll enjoy yourself.