The Covid19 Thread
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Just change the spelling a bit and you get a new drink: quarantines. Like a martini but you drink it alone.
Have you enrolled on the free Future learn course on COVID-19 being given by Dr Anna Seale Associate Professor, and Deputy Director of the UK Public Health Rapid Support Team at the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine? No? then I suggest it's you that's not taking this seriously enough
No, the process adopted will work if those that are at risk self isolate and we all do our bit at the right time. You would complain when all the resources and money ran out. Even with the gently gently approach taken a large number of small businesses have already gone bust - that's peoples livelihoods, dreams and future down the pan. I personally know of several self employed who are looking at total loss of everything they've worked for including their homes. A more dramatic attitude to the situation would make it even worse.
80% of us are going to get it; most will be mild symptoms. If you are at risk stay out of the public for as long as you can but, in all probability, it's still going to be around in Autumn.
Of course, these are just my oppinions.
Well the government and banks are saying they will help with mortgages so hopefully if that goes ahead things will not be so bad.
I lost a home that I was working 4 jobs and all my limited spare time to refurbish from top to bottom in the 80s. I had worked so hard and only had the kitchen left to fit. 9 months of 18hr days gone in a week. It happens. Part of life's ups and downs. My plans to make a profit and buy a little smallholding to become self sufficient all gone. Still trying to realise that dream. I
We have to accept this is going to be a world wide problem with everyone affected. Airlines are going down like nine pins and super qualified staff and pilots are going to be out of work. It's going to affect every single person in this country and many others too. Not just the self employed. We are all going to struggle unless you are not reliant on modern society in any way.
Opinions will be as varied as there are people. Who knows who's opinion will win out, or what will become of society in the next few months. But if your house is on fire you don't hang around flapping a tea towel at it and wait till it gets out of control before you take action.
I lost a home that I was working 4 jobs and all my limited spare time to refurbish from top to bottom in the 80s. I had worked so hard and only had the kitchen left to fit. 9 months of 18hr days gone in a week. It happens. Part of life's ups and downs. My plans to make a profit and buy a little smallholding to become self sufficient all gone. Still trying to realise that dream. I
We have to accept this is going to be a world wide problem with everyone affected. Airlines are going down like nine pins and super qualified staff and pilots are going to be out of work. It's going to affect every single person in this country and many others too. Not just the self employed. We are all going to struggle unless you are not reliant on modern society in any way.
Opinions will be as varied as there are people. Who knows who's opinion will win out, or what will become of society in the next few months. But if your house is on fire you don't hang around flapping a tea towel at it and wait till it gets out of control before you take action.
To suggest that is what people are doing just because they are not panicking is mildly insulting. You do what you think you need to do I will continue to 'flap a tea towel'.
Have you enrolled on the free Future learn course on COVID-19 being given by Dr Anna Seale Associate Professor, and Deputy Director of the UK Public Health Rapid Support Team at the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine? No? then I suggest it's you that's not taking this seriously enough
these are just my oppinions.
Erm...... you do know I'm currently locked down in Spain don't you?
I'm not going to argue with you Broch, my intentions here are to hopefully give people a head start on what's about to hit..
You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts.
We should be talking about what we know is happening like the current UK ventilator crisis, this is the biggest problem since the war so don't belittle it.
As far as preparation goes, just understanding what's going is a good start. And stocking up with everything under the sun is probably not helpful, this is one time where doing nothing (no contact with others) might be the best preparation! Might even save your life, young, fit & well have died though it's rare but no one is immune.............
So our Lipstick gang finally did something besides rouge. Finland is going for nearly total shut down in human movement. Schools close, borders close etc.
Looks like a totally different approach from Sweden. Only time will tell if it is too late, there is not much more they could have done.
Looks like a totally different approach from Sweden. Only time will tell if it is too late, there is not much more they could have done.
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I'm not panicking Broch, nor am I suggesting anyone should. Flap your tea towel and I hope sincerely you stay fit and well, or only get the milder symptoms.
It's fine to ignore things if they are not relavant or you think you know better.
Personally. .I'm ignoring the current advice for the older and compromised and doing my own thing which I feel I need to do to remain safe and well. I'm not putting myself or others at risk. If I were to catch it and survive (highly unlikely to survive ) and I'd passed it on to another who succumbed I'd feel dreadful.
What some of us are saying you may feel irrelevant and it may be to you, but it could be pertinent and life saving to others so please don't knock those who think differently. If we are saying these things it's because we care and want to save others a lot of misery.
I'm not getting at you at all, and if you are fine the way you are that's great, but don't forget that many of us are not living in an isolated area and face many more dangers than you do.
I realy wish I had an isolated property and a family around to support or support me if I need them to, but I don't, so please don't downplay others situations and awareness. It realy doesn't help at all.
What I'm concerned about is how we get back from this. Also 50% of our food comes from abroad so with this lockdown of Europe we may well find a greater impact than we think possible. Despite all the platitudes from our government.
I'm planning for future food security for myself. And for some time now have been retro fitting to future proof life rather than future proofing with tech.
Europe are going to pool recourses medicaly. We are on our now and under resourced in the NHS. It's going to get realy bad here. It's not a time to panic.. that time is gone. It's now time to consider how we are going to cope in a few weeks time calmly and positively.
It's fine to ignore things if they are not relavant or you think you know better.
Personally. .I'm ignoring the current advice for the older and compromised and doing my own thing which I feel I need to do to remain safe and well. I'm not putting myself or others at risk. If I were to catch it and survive (highly unlikely to survive ) and I'd passed it on to another who succumbed I'd feel dreadful.
What some of us are saying you may feel irrelevant and it may be to you, but it could be pertinent and life saving to others so please don't knock those who think differently. If we are saying these things it's because we care and want to save others a lot of misery.
I'm not getting at you at all, and if you are fine the way you are that's great, but don't forget that many of us are not living in an isolated area and face many more dangers than you do.
I realy wish I had an isolated property and a family around to support or support me if I need them to, but I don't, so please don't downplay others situations and awareness. It realy doesn't help at all.
What I'm concerned about is how we get back from this. Also 50% of our food comes from abroad so with this lockdown of Europe we may well find a greater impact than we think possible. Despite all the platitudes from our government.
I'm planning for future food security for myself. And for some time now have been retro fitting to future proof life rather than future proofing with tech.
Europe are going to pool recourses medicaly. We are on our now and under resourced in the NHS. It's going to get realy bad here. It's not a time to panic.. that time is gone. It's now time to consider how we are going to cope in a few weeks time calmly and positively.
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It's an online course - you have access to the internet. I would rather hear stuff from experts in the field than listen to the media (we probably should have locked that down first) or some idiot with a YouTube channel.
What you quote as facts are not - there is no current ventilator crisis there is a warning that there could be one and so action is being taken.
But, to be honest, this is getting nobody anywhere and I have far better things to do (oh, hang on, that's all trivial, I should be locking myself in a room and worrying
).Don't worry, rolls Royce are being coopted into making ventilators. Well they're not using their jet engines as much these days so there will be spare capacity there. Having met a few of their top tech guys a good few years back I have no doubt they could make ventilators if needed to.
" Don't worry, rolls Royce are being coopted into making ventilators "
That's good news....Just hope Boeing don't start making them too......
That's good news....Just hope Boeing don't start making them too......
I've just been vaguely listening to the radio while getting on with other things like the garden and I stopped to listen to a bit about these companies that have been asked to manufacture ventilators saying it could be three or four months before they can begin and that's if they can get the parts!
Jeez!
Now forgive me if I'm wrong but do not metal working lathes make component parts?
Can they not be programmed by computers to churn these bits out in their thousands?
Do these companies not have lathes anymore or are there no companies with the ability to do so? (Two I know of and worked at could do this easily Vessas in alton hants and dzus fasteners in Farnham surrey)
Is EVERYTHING made abroad now? I think not.
So we have to raid garages or home brew stores for piping for airways... they are not gonna be working anyway so no problem there.
Let's just get our act together and stop making problems instead of solving them. ...we managed in ww 2 why not now?
Sometimes I despair of this country!
Jeez!
Now forgive me if I'm wrong but do not metal working lathes make component parts?
Can they not be programmed by computers to churn these bits out in their thousands?
Do these companies not have lathes anymore or are there no companies with the ability to do so? (Two I know of and worked at could do this easily Vessas in alton hants and dzus fasteners in Farnham surrey)
Is EVERYTHING made abroad now? I think not.
So we have to raid garages or home brew stores for piping for airways... they are not gonna be working anyway so no problem there.
Let's just get our act together and stop making problems instead of solving them. ...we managed in ww 2 why not now?
Sometimes I despair of this country!
With product approval and quality considerations I doubt it's that simple. I know it's not. Automotive parts can take longer so I fully expect medical devices to need stricter controls. So many parts that need to be made reliably to tolerances that will be strict. So many parts that could fail. You'd want them to be right if your life depended on them I reckon.
Present day medical ventilators are quite complicated and include a lot of controlling electronics. During Vietnam war US army developed a very simple ventilator that, if remember correctly, did not require electricity but only compressed air. That probably could be manufactured in most garages. If the ventilation function is the only one required.
Ventilators have a lot of electronics in them, which have lots of parts, which often come from overseas. We buy a lot of electronics from Celestica, and I am pretty sure they are going to struggle to deliver.
There is also the issue of the people who make them sharing their IP, or do you want JCB to design their own from scratch?
Best bet would be coming up with a cruder ventilator, if that is possible, something with fewer bells and whistles that would not be commercially interesting in normal circumstances. That isn't exactly rocket science idea, and two of us in our engineering office thought of it this morning, so I am sure that if that is a solution, Rolls and Co will be looking into it.
There is also the issue of the people who make them sharing their IP, or do you want JCB to design their own from scratch?
Best bet would be coming up with a cruder ventilator, if that is possible, something with fewer bells and whistles that would not be commercially interesting in normal circumstances. That isn't exactly rocket science idea, and two of us in our engineering office thought of it this morning, so I am sure that if that is a solution, Rolls and Co will be looking into it.
That is a totally ridiculous statement. Piping from home brew kits or garages for airways????
Have you ever seen just how complex an ICU ventilator is? Sadly I have first hand experience of being hooked up to one 6 weeks ago. They are highly complex machines which require precision moulded parts and electronics not to mention trained and skilled personnel to put it together and quality assure it's fit for purpose. They can't just be churned out in their thousands and placed into hospitals.
Added to that it's not just having the staff and compenents to make them it's also having the medical staff who have been trained to use them and intubate a patient safely. They can't be pulled out of a ward and told just get on with it.
So make simpler more old fashioned ones. They worked in the past. We should be saying can can can not can't can't can't. !
Present day version, look at pic of "hayek mrtx". in the company introduction they say something like: designed for rapid increase of production.
Well I'm not an engineer so don't expect me to come up with the perfect answer. I have often found that a child with no education in a matter will solve a problem that adults fail to get their heads around as they are conditioned to think a certain way with all their training.
If you are going to just dismiss an idea as ridiculous just because it doesn't fit in with your trained poodle ideas then fine. I give up.
But let me remind you they managed to build a large bomber plane in a day in ww 2.
Show me a company that can do that nowadays.
Alison spoke the most sense a couple of posts ago. Go girl! Don't let the naysayers stop trying any idea that could have a germ of hope.
Whenever I hear people say we can't do this or that because I don't have xyz I often think of the guy that used a biro to do a makeshift tracheotomy. No "I can't do it because I don't have sterile equipment and workspace." From him.He saved a life.
So modern machines are complicated and expensive of course we can't just suddenly started churning them out. I know that. I'm not totaly mentaly defunct quite yet! But sometimes only looking forward and not looking back to what worked in the past when resources were not what they are now can possibly have a solution. Just sayin'
Anyway I'll just get on with my pre emtive "bugging in" and watch with interest the struggles of humanity to control the flu bug that does no harm to most but is a killer to thousands of others.
Ps I got my loo rolls hand sanitiser mask garden seeds and tinned goods first week in Feb. I got told I was stupid!
If you are going to just dismiss an idea as ridiculous just because it doesn't fit in with your trained poodle ideas then fine. I give up.
But let me remind you they managed to build a large bomber plane in a day in ww 2.
Show me a company that can do that nowadays.
Alison spoke the most sense a couple of posts ago. Go girl! Don't let the naysayers stop trying any idea that could have a germ of hope.
Whenever I hear people say we can't do this or that because I don't have xyz I often think of the guy that used a biro to do a makeshift tracheotomy. No "I can't do it because I don't have sterile equipment and workspace." From him.He saved a life.
So modern machines are complicated and expensive of course we can't just suddenly started churning them out. I know that. I'm not totaly mentaly defunct quite yet! But sometimes only looking forward and not looking back to what worked in the past when resources were not what they are now can possibly have a solution. Just sayin'
Anyway I'll just get on with my pre emtive "bugging in" and watch with interest the struggles of humanity to control the flu bug that does no harm to most but is a killer to thousands of others.
Ps I got my loo rolls hand sanitiser mask garden seeds and tinned goods first week in Feb. I got told I was stupid!
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