The Amish as a source
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I have encountered a few Amish and Menonites - they have a lot to teach me (and in my opinion most of the rest of the world) about tolerance, self reliance, community and living with not off the land. As others have said, there are large variations between individual communities and the rules are not "fixed". For example generators and electric washing machines are widely used. The idea of a closed community couldn't be further from the truth - as others have pointed out, Amish teenagers are encouraged to live with other commuities and decide how they want to live. How many of us can say we have encouraged our children to try lifestyles alien to our own, live in them for months, and then choose?
For those who would like to see how the Amish live, and a UK perspective of it, I reccomend the excellent documentary, "Living with the Amish" - a channel 4 documentary where half a dozen UK teenagers spent time in a variety of types of Amish community. I feel it set out to show the UK teenagers laughing at or despising the life. The results were ....surprising.
http://www.channel4.com/programmes/living-with-the-amish/4od
Red
For those who would like to see how the Amish live, and a UK perspective of it, I reccomend the excellent documentary, "Living with the Amish" - a channel 4 documentary where half a dozen UK teenagers spent time in a variety of types of Amish community. I feel it set out to show the UK teenagers laughing at or despising the life. The results were ....surprising.
http://www.channel4.com/programmes/living-with-the-amish/4od
Red
Interesting point about the hog-slaughtering. Presumably it wouldn't be allowed in Europe, where "non-approved" slaughter-houses have been banned (well, in the UK at least - no-one else in Europe actually bothers obeying EU laws they don't like!).
Absolutely correct. A "farm" being defined for domestic slaughter purposes as ANY premises where livestock are kept.
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That was the documentary i watched but i couldnt recall the name. It was a superb watch and i may well watch it all again. I loved the barn raising episode. thanks for the linky Red
Cheers - interesting read. Not quite as simple as just slaughtering on the farm though - still have to go through hoops re testing etc.
De Nada Paul,
Were you also wishing that the young lad who lived in a hostel would just settle there? I have never seen a townie so take to the hard work that self sufficiency involves! I also liked the young Amish lad with the "pimped" buggy - young lads are young lads - culture irrelevant!
We always enjoy having people to stay who haven't ever made their own bread from wheat or tasted food out of the ground. Its just so rewarding when somebody "gets it". I also know how the Amish feel - we have lots of consumerist people ready to condemn or laugh at our lifestyle (without a minute of actually living it).
Everyone should eat one meal that they raised from the dirt. Its a life changing moment.
Red
Were you also wishing that the young lad who lived in a hostel would just settle there? I have never seen a townie so take to the hard work that self sufficiency involves! I also liked the young Amish lad with the "pimped" buggy - young lads are young lads - culture irrelevant!
We always enjoy having people to stay who haven't ever made their own bread from wheat or tasted food out of the ground. Its just so rewarding when somebody "gets it". I also know how the Amish feel - we have lots of consumerist people ready to condemn or laugh at our lifestyle (without a minute of actually living it).
Everyone should eat one meal that they raised from the dirt. Its a life changing moment.
Red
The system is designed to keep man struggling. 
Nothing is made simple in this country for people who don't break the law
What "hoops" or testing do you believe are necessary for pig slaughter from your reading of the regulations Andy?
A nice leading question there, BR! From an initial read-through it appears pigs are exempt (other than meeting the humane killing requirements). However, cattle, bison, sheep, goats and of course not forgetting buffalo aren't - I refer you to pages 7 et seq of the guidelines.
I'm not sure how it relates to your point that "hog -slaughtering" would be illegal in the UK . Nor is it about exemptions. The certification of certain species as fit for consumption relates to certain communicable diseases (e.g. BSE). It also doesn't apply to chickens, ducks, turkeys, geese, llamas, alapaca and all sorts of other meat animals.
Its not a question of "exemption" but that certain red meat species need to be tested because of a disease introduced through factory farming for profit (e.g. feeding animal spinal waste to herbivores)
You started off by stating that home pig slaughtering is "presumably" illegal in Europe (and your assumption that only the UK complies) - which is untrue
You then imply that paperwork is necessary - it isn't
You then object to being corrected on both points
Red
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In your haste to score a point, BR, you seem to have missed that this earlier post has already been pointed out to me by others as being incorrect, which I acnowledged, and resulted in Silverback referring me to the guidelines. True, alpacas and llamas might be exempt as they aren't specifically mentioned in the homekillguide (although I wouldn't put money on it as I haven't examined the specific detailed legislation) but certainly cattle, buffalo, bison, goats and sheep aren't, and there are quite specific requirements in the guidelines - again I refer you to page 7 et seq.
It also points out that providing home-slaughtered meat to b&B or paying guests isn't allowed under the home-slaughter rules as that would be a commercial transaction.
Indeed - I was the person that pointed it out immediately following your erroneous post.
You wan't to pick an argument about a subject that you patently know nothing about Andy. I'll leave you to argue with yourself, I have pointed out the fact to anyone who cares to be informed.
Sorry BR - the point-scoring seems all to be coming from you, but I'm glad you've got it off your chest! I was just interested, and appreciated silverback pointing me in the right direction. I'll now know the facts if I ever take up small-holding (although I suppose I could have asked the wife, as her family are all farmers and they're always bitching about bl**dy government interference!)
The Amish way of life is the antithesis of bushcrafting and as such they have nothing to teach us. Land ripped by ploughs and milking overbred cows, energy imported in the shape of hay and presumably feed. They may have some craft but how relevant are these? I wonder how many Amish type communities a country could afford.
Of course they offer the attraction of a kind of "Good Life" but would anybody like to exchange the life of Tom and Barbara for one of theocratic rule?
Of course they offer the attraction of a kind of "Good Life" but would anybody like to exchange the life of Tom and Barbara for one of theocratic rule?
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