Talented Blacksmith Sought.......

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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Extended counterweight at ground level is the only thing that springs to mind for making it balance - a leg of a flat tripod with a big old lump of metal threaded on the end.

Alternatively perhaps four legs - one of which passes under the grate for stability?

Not an easy one I grant you

Red
 

mr dazzler

Native
Aug 28, 2004
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83
uk
Does it HAVE to be freestanding? I know you siad you were moving next year. But couldnt you have a design that just needed a couple of rawlbolts to fix the main post in the fireplace (presumabaly its quite generously sized opening) When you move, unbolt and make good the holes, drill new ones at the new place and re-fit? It could be quite calamitous if the whole lot crane chain and pot of boiling stew tumbled over.
 

ForgeCorvus

Nomad
Oct 27, 2007
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I've been playing with an idea for a pot-jack to use at events thats like this one, mine would also have to be free-standing as its for use on firebowls

I can't work out how the crane arm changes on the pic, I take it you want something that can be used like this one rather then this one with a stand


How deep is your fireplace and how high, how wide is the grate and how far does it extend along the side of the wall (I'm assuming you want it on the right of the fire place......not that it would make a difference)

Which is more important to you decoration or function

I might be able to help, but I wouldn't call myself 'Talented'....more like stubborn
 

Mike Ameling

Need to contact Admin...
Jan 18, 2007
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The only tricky part is that "base plate/structure" to support it free-standing, and still allow swiveling.

The solution is something like two arms of a v sticking out to brace it up. Those two arms need to be long enough and strong enough to balance the pressure from the weight of any pot on the crane while over the fire, but also need to be spread out far enough to at least one side to brace the crane when you swing the pot off the fire.

The one other method would be a large/thick base plate. Like a 1 inch thick disk of iron that the crane is loosely riveted through. This would give you the weight to hold it in place, and then be wide enough to counterbalance the crane and pot. (Think manhole cover plate from the street!) And then have the crane stick down through it and be either loosely riveted on the other side, or loosely bolted or pinned.

Actually, an old manhole cover from the street would work pretty well. You could pin/bolt/rivet the crane through one of the holes already in it around the side. And the thickness/weight will balance out that crane in most any position. Plus, it is thick enough to not be affected much by being under the fire in the hearth.

The crane itself is a pretty normal blacksmith project. It is that base that requires ... innovation.

There are a number of old fireplace grates or fire dogs that were designed/built with a crane as part of them. The fireplace grate/log dogs provided the mass and bracing, and the crane slipped down through a pair of modified eye-bolts sticking out from the grate - so they could still swivel. (large one on top to slip the crane through, small one at bottom to slip the tenon on the bottom through)

The simplest solution would be two normal eye-bolts set into the fireplace wall. The bottom one could be just a normal one. But the top one modified so that you could open it up or with a threaded bolt/nut to connect it to the rod coming out of the wall. An adjustable top rod comes to mind. Set a threaded rod into the fireplace wall with an inch or so sticking out. Attach an eye-bolt "swivel" to the top of your crane. Then make up a section of pipe with a nut welded into each end. Be careful to get the nuts orientated right - like in a standard turnbuckle. Set the crane into the bottom swivel. Then put that "turnbuckle" on the top threaded bolts, and turn it to hold things in place. That "turnbuckle" coupler at the top could also be made from a thick bar that is drilled and threaded at each end (but with one end threaded in the reverse direction). If you do it that way, you can then really tighten it up - to firm up the whole arrangement.

Hope these humble rambling help.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands
 

Mike Ameling

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Jan 18, 2007
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Another thought.

Mount two threaded bolts into your existing fireplace - to attach that crane. But only have them sticking out an inch or so. Then slip a U shaped strap of iron onto them and bolt it tight to the wall. Have a hole drilled through both ends of that U strap. Have your crane made up with the two attaching bolts/rods on it. Cut them off and drill those through at the right point to bolt them to the two U straps attached to the bolt in the wall.

When you move, just unbolt the crane rods from those U straps and take it with you. And you can either leave those U straps, or take the nut off and take them with you - leaving only those two short threaded rods sticking out from the wall of the fireplace. Putting the nuts back onto them would help cover up their look, and make them look more like reinforcing bolts through the masonry.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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How deep is your fireplace and how high, how wide is the grate and how far does it extend along the side of the wall (I'm assuming you want it on the right of the fire place......not that it would make a difference)

Which is more important to you decoration or function

I might be able to help, but I wouldn't call myself 'Talented'....more like stubborn

Call the fireplace 2' wide by 2' high by 13" deep and its not far off - grate a bit smaller clearly

I do want something pretty similar if at all possible - which bit don't you understand - the sprung arm or the top one or how it pivots?

I am coming more around to the idea of bolting it in if needs be - Mikes idea to have it bolted on but "de-mountable" seems good to me.


The idea of making an integral grate and crane less so - I burn out a grate every 3 or 4 years (even the heaviest ones) and I want the crane to last

Red
 

Mike Ameling

Need to contact Admin...
Jan 18, 2007
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www.angelfire.com
2 foot by 2 foot by 13 inches deep is a pretty small fireplace. So the whole crane assembly will have to be pretty small to fit into it.

But that also then gives you the option to have that crane assembly mounted and anchored outside the fireplace. The base only needs a small depression in the hearth stone to hold it in place. And the top could them extend up far enough to engage a mounting bracket attached to the mantle or the wall above. That would take any modifications out and away from the bricks in the fireplace. That bottom depression could also be an iron or stone block with two iron legs sticking out far enough to be attached/bolted to the floor.

With the crane mounted just outside the fireplace at one corner, it would also give you more clearance in use - depending upon how far out that adjustment arm protrudes. But mounting the crane a little farther out into the room from the fireplace solves that - if you have the room.

The big point is that this crane is not a 3 foot by 5 foot or larger hunk of iron.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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Might be a poor choice of words on my part, 2' square is the size of the opening. Its not an Inglenook or what have you - just a domestic fireplace. Clealrly there is a large (brick) surround beyond those dimensions. I already have a large set for an Inglenook - I am looking for something "bijou" here :)

Red
 

ForgeCorvus

Nomad
Oct 27, 2007
425
1
52
norfolk
Call the fireplace 2' wide by 2' high by 13" deep and its not far off - grate a bit smaller clearly
Sorry, poor choice of words. I wanted to know how far along the wall the hard platform goes (the bit that goes from the back of the fireplace out into the room)
I do want something pretty similar if at all possible - which bit don't you understand - the sprung arm or the top one or how it pivots?
Does the top arm pivot or is it a brace to the other side of the fireplace. If it pivots, how?
I am coming more around to the idea of bolting it in if needs be - Mikes idea to have it bolted on but "de-mountable" seems good to me.


The idea of making an integral grate and crane less so - I burn out a grate every 3 or 4 years (even the heaviest ones) and I want the crane to last

Red
OK, crane as one piece, fire basket another....thats what I thought you wanted
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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Both arms pivot together - the whole upright pivots

To be honest, on mine I'd be happy to lose the top arm altogether and have only the lower, height adjustable one

The brickwork extends 6'6" all told - more than 2' each side of the grate

Red
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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:D

I'm down to my last 7 stoves Sean ;)

Bleeding leccy fails all the time up here - and the phone line lately.

You'll have to let me know where East Meon forge is (if he's cany good) next time you look in or I bump into you in t' shop :)


To be fair the fire crane is mainly cos BB has always loved em and it would be interesting as well as useful

Red
 

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