Potassium permanganate

thed

Member
Sep 5, 2005
31
0
Way Down South
What is it used for just out of interest, I remeber playing with it in science lab many years ago but dont remeber it being useful for anything other then, Gardening Fertiliser, Water treatment?

Or have i missed the obvious and its the best thing since sliced bread for tanning hides or some such job?
 

sparks

Tenderfoot
Aug 14, 2005
92
1
....................
thed said:
What is it used for just out of interest, I remeber playing with it in science lab many years ago but dont remeber it being useful for anything other then, Gardening Fertiliser, Water treatment?

Or have i missed the obvious and its the best thing since sliced bread for tanning hides or some such job?

if you mix it with glycerine it will make fire:) :) :)
 
Jan 15, 2005
851
0
54
wantage
The good news is that we get ipa (not the beer), in quantities of about, ohh - 600 litres at a time :lmao:

The bad news is it's more than my jobs worth to remove any. I do have the odd half litre now and again because it's a great solvent for tamiya acrylic paint. So no go there. :eek:

The pp is however my private stash :D
 

Toddy

Mod
Mod
Jan 21, 2005
39,133
4,810
S. Lanarkshire
Spacemonkey said:
Oooh, ooh, oooh.. !! (jumps up and down with hand in the air, all excited, like)

Don't s'pose you can get gallons/litres of isopropyl alcohol or even bromopropane??

Cheapest place I've found for isopropyl alcohol is Maplin. £10 a litre.
Must be able to do better than that??

Cheers,
Toddy
 

Spacemonkey

Native
May 8, 2005
1,354
9
52
Llamaville.
www.jasperfforde.com
That is a bit steep! I use a similar compound to 'cure' carb icing on my bike, and that's steep at £8 a litre, so I'm trying to get cheaper.

The bromopropane i use for de greasing and washing hair at work. Don't use it on yourself though... It's also a good solvent for smoothing wax as well. It's quite pricey from where i get it from now!
 

twelveboar

Forager
Sep 20, 2005
166
0
57
County Durham
Isopropyl alchohol is used by lithographic printers in fairly large quantities, we used to get it supplied in four gallon containers. Try looking for a local pressroom supplies and give them a ring, or find a contact in the printing trade. They'll probably want to know what you want it for, as every year people kill themselves trying to drink it.
I found it was a sooty burn in my trangia, and didn't get hot enough.
 

william#

Settler
Sep 5, 2005
531
0
sussex
Potassium permanganate can you still buy it in the uk with out being a chemist - seems like anything which is slightly volitile these days has been taken off the shelf .
i have picked some up in thailand which i am going to use to start a fire - another tick to methods of fire lighting i have tried - i know it may come as a shock though i have never tried the battery and wire wool option yet
 

ESpy

Settler
Aug 28, 2003
925
57
54
Hampshire
www.britishblades.com
IPA -

http://www.cfsnet.co.uk/acatalog/CFS_Catalogue__Isopropyl_Alcohol_104.html

£10 for 5l + delivery & VAT
£28 for 25l

Mostly they're catering to the fibreglass industry, but they're a good source for all sorts of bits & pieces - RTV silicone, acetone, casting resins & fillers etc. etc.

Good customer service too - my first order with them I ordered the wrong catalyst; they phoned me within an hour to say did I *really* mean that one, as it didn't go with the stuff I had on my order form?
 

AJB

Native
Oct 2, 2004
1,821
9
57
Lancashire
Bizarre, I emptied my IPA aerosol yesterday cleaning the heads on my VHS after it ate another tape. Anybody considering a group buy?
 

Cairodel

Nomad
Nov 15, 2004
254
4
71
Cairo, Egypt.
Just wondered why you would want KMno4... unless you want to make a bomb :eek:
Found this on Hoodlums site for those interested..

Main points of US-EPA extract:
Although potassium permanganate has many potential uses as an oxidant, it is a poor disinfectant.

... however, even under these conditions the complete absence of Salm. typhi or Bact. flexner was not assured, even at a potassium permanganate concentration that turned the water an objectionable pink color.

...based on the other disinfectants discussed in this report, protozoa are significantly more resistant than viruses; therefore, it is likely that the dosages and contact times required for protozoa inactivation would be impractical.


Taken from this:

POTASSIUM PERMANGANATE

Potassium permanganate (KMnO4) is used primarily to control taste and odors, remove color, control biological growth in treatment plants, and remove iron and manganese. In a secondary role, potassium permanganate may be useful in controlling the formation of THMs and other DBPs by oxidizing precursors and reducing the demand for other disinfectants (Hazen and Sawyer, 1992). The mechanism of reduced DBPs may be as simple as moving the point of chlorine application further downstream in the treatment train using potassium permanganate to control taste and odors, color, algae, etc. instead of chlorine. Although potassium permanganate has many potential uses as an oxidant, it is a poor disinfectant.

5.4 Pathogen Inactivation and Disinfection Efficacy

Potassium permanganate is an oxidizing agent widely used throughout the water industry. While it is not considered a primary disinfectant, potassium permanganate has an effect on the development of a disinfection strategy by serving as an alternative to pre-chlorination or other oxidants at locations in a treatment plant where chemical oxidation is desired for control of color, taste and odor, and algae.

5.4.3 Use as a Disinfectant

A number of investigations have been performed to determine the relative capability of potassium permanganate as a disinfectant. The following sections contain a description of the disinfection efficiency of potassium permanganate in regards to bacteria, virus, and protozoa inactivation.

5.4.3.1 Bacteria Inactivation
High dosage rates were required to accomplish complete inactivation of bacteria in three studies. Early research showed that a dose of 2.5 mg/L was required for complete inactivation of coliform bacteria (Le Strat, 1944). In this study, water from the Marne River was dosed with potassium permanganate at concentrations of 0 to 2.5 mg/L. Following mixing, the samples were placed in a darkened room for 2 hours at a constant temperature of 19.8oC. Banerjea (1950) investigated the disinfectant ability of potassium permanganate on several
waterborne pathogenic microorganisms. The investigation studied Vibrio cholerae, Salm. typhi, and Bact. flexner. The results indicated that doses of 20 mg/L and contact times of 24 hours were necessary to deactivate these pathogens; however, even under these conditions the complete absence of Salm. typhi or Bact. flexner was not assured, even at a potassium permanganate concentration that turned the water an objectionable pink color. Results from a study conducted in 1976 at the Las Vegas Valley Water District/Southern Nevada System of Lake Mead water showed that complete removal of coliform bacteria were accomplished at doses of 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6 mg/L (Hazen and Sawyer, 1992). Contact times of 30 minutes were provided with doses of 1 and 2 mg/L, and 10 minutes contact times were provided for higher dosages in this study.

5.4.3.2 Virus Inactivation

Potassium permanganate has been proven effective against certain viruses. A dose of 50 mg/L of potassium permanganate and a contact time of 2 hours was required for inactivation of poliovirus (strain MVA) (Hazen and Sawyer, 1992). A “potassium” permanganate dose of 5.0 mg/L and a contact time of 33 minutes was needed for 1-log inactivation of type 1 poliovirus (Yahya et al., 1990b). Tests showed a significantly higher inactivation rate at 23oC than at 7oC; however, there was no significant difference in activation rates at pH 6.0 and pH 8.0.

Potassium permanganate doses from 0.5 to 5 mg/L were capable of obtaining at least a 2 log inactivation of the surrogate virus, MS-2 bacteriophage with E. coli as the host bacterium (Yahya et al., 1989). Results showed that at pH 6.0 and 8.0, a 2-log inactivation occurred after a contact time of at least 52 minutes and a residual of 0.5 mg/L. At a residual of 5.0 mg/L, approximately 7 and 13 minutes were required for 2-log inactivation at pHs of 8.0 and 6.0, respectively. These results contradict the previously cited studies that potassium permanganate becomes more effective as the pH decreases.

5.4.3.3 Protozoa Inactivation

No information pertaining to protozoa inactivation by potassium permanganate is available in the literature. However, based on the other disinfectants discussed in this report, protozoa are significantly more resistant than viruses; therefore, it is likely that the dosages and contact times required for protozoa inactivation would be impractical.
 

Tantalus

Full Member
May 10, 2004
1,065
149
60
Galashiels
IMVHO firelighting is not really a good reason for carrying the stuff around

just asking for an accident to happen

better by far to learn how to make a fire without it

so far we got , it doesnt sterilise unless high doses are used, its dangerous (oxidising agent), its difficult to store (absorbs moisture from air) and if it leaks it stains everything in site

if you want a convenient sterilising agent, a little bottle of iodine solution is a much better option, works well if applied to minor cuts and grazes too

forget potassium permanganate please

Tant
 

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