Please help me build my first knife

[Dave Budd]

of the option that you have, I think the most likely to succeed are the angle grinder or the bench grinder. Even if you decide to use those for the rough grinding and then try the other options to tidy it up. In anycase get it done before making a handle, otherwise you risk wasting your time if you foul the blade up on the grinding

 

[mrcharly]

Of the options listed, the drill or sanding drum is the *least* controllable. Oddly, the angle grinder is more controllable because it is more aggressive in its material removal - so you can use it very delicately.

 

[Paddytray]

It's a shame it has been H.T in a way if it wasn't you would have no trouble putting the grind on .

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[Nice65]

think I'll leave out the liners - keep it simple.



I'm thinking how about a handle that's assymetrical? It's only going to be me using it and I'm right handed so make the palm side of the scales shaped to fit - well my palm - more or less just rounded, but the finger side, which is only long enough for three fingers, make some concave shapes for each finger. So it really fits comfortable and provides some grip. How about getting something like bluetack and squeezing it to make a rough model to copy the shape of my fingers? Just a thought. Has anyone else done a handle that's different shape on one scale to the other?

Don't discard the liner idea until you've held the scales against the handle. If it needs bulking out, you can probably gain 3mm by adding them.

Regarding asymmetrical handles and finger grooves. You're seriously going to limit how you hold the knife by doing this. The hold on a knife differs all the time depending on task. Your finger grooves allow for only one hold.

Were you to baton with it, you'd have it in your left hand for instance. I've only had 2 knives with finger grooves, a Buck 110 (sold almost straight away), and a Bark River Canadian Special that I put up with because I love it.

The symmetrical, contoured knife handle has evolved like that for a reason. It works best in any position.

In your first post you say you don't think you can do pics until you're a full member. You can. I don't use Flickr though so I'm not sure how it works there, but the code you need to paste directly into the thread should have at either end, like this Photobucket link, but Ive left gaps so it displays as code.

[IMG] [url]http://i700.photobucket.com/albums/ww2/nice65/image_zpsd289ba22.jpg[/url]

 

[Paddytray]

If you have a smart phone install Tapatalk it's great for here and posting pictures

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[smojo]

In your first post you say you don't think you can do pics until you're a full member. You can. I don't use Flickr though so I'm not sure how it works there, but the code you need to paste directly into the thread should have at either end, like this Photobucket link, but Ive left gaps so it displays as code.
[/QUOTE]

Got it sussed now thanks. Ta for all the other advice everyone.

The angle grinder way just looks so uncontrollable. Makes me think I'd end up with a metal comb rather than a knife ;)Filing would be my preferred option because it's slow and controllable but as Dave says it will hardly touch it. Sorry to be a pain with this grind thing but if I don't get it right first time I think it will end up in the bin.

 

[Paddytray]

Your not being a pain mate if anything you are teaching others from your lessons .
I am a learner myself but I do have a forge .
If you like you can send it to me I will anneal it for you then send it back for you to put your grind on then send it back I will harden and H.t .
No charge just pay for the postage and I'd be happy to help you out .

 

[Nice65]

Your not being a pain mate if anything you are teaching others from your lessons .
I am a learner myself but I do have a forge .
If you like you can send it to me I will anneal it for you then send it back for you to put your grind on then send it back I will harden and H.t .
No charge just pay for the postage and I'd be happy to help you out .

That might be a very useful option

 

[smojo]

Your not being a pain mate if anything you are teaching others from your lessons .
I am a learner myself but I do have a forge .
If you like you can send it to me I will anneal it for you then send it back for you to put your grind on then send it back I will harden and H.t .
No charge just pay for the postage and I'd be happy to help you out .

That's incredibly kind of you and I will think about that. I will still need to make some sort of jig and find my method for grinding so I'll try get my head around that and knock something together. Got a lot of stuff going on in my head right now - just got a new smartphone and tablet (doing my head in) and looking at getting a new car too. Going away shortly so knife making on the back burner right now. Thanks again for all the help everyone has given so far. I will get there eventually.

 

[Paddytray]

I didn't offer to grind it as I thought you wanted to but if you wanted I can do the lot just mark up how high you want the grind to be . No dramas gives me something to do and helps you out .

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[mrcharly]

Seems to me that you are making a lot more work for yourself by wanting to use a jig.

An anglegrinder won't cut your blade into a 'comb' unless you try to use it like that.

I've never shaped a blade with an anglegrinder, but I've ground back welds (god-aweful lumpy ones; I did the welding) on curved surfaces, smooth to the surface. I was standing on a pontoon and the steel was a boat hull, gently moving.

 

[smojo]

I didn't offer to grind it as I thought you wanted to but if you wanted I can do the lot just mark up how high you want the grind to be . No dramas gives me something to do and helps you out .

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yes thanks, much appreciated. I like to do as much as poss myself, that way I learn as much as I can but I might need a help out with tempering - see my next few posts for expalantion

 

[smojo]

Seems to me that you are making a lot more work for yourself by wanting to use a jig.

It's because I don't trust myself to make a good job doing it freehand. Not experienced with angle grinders. Had a go with one a few times and on some simple jobs and the result was a rough as a badgers bum.

 

[smojo]

OK guys, some progress to show you and a few questions. I'll spread it all over a few posts to make it easier to deal with. So today I decided to make a filing jig like ones I've seen. Then I could try filing and if it was too hard, then the jig will come in later. If you don't try stuff yourself, you'll never know. So for the benefit of anyone else just starting out I'll describe how I made it and you can decide for yourself if it is the way to go for you (or me).

To get an idea of how big to make the jig I started by drawing to scale a sideways view that would give me an angle of about 22 degrees for a scandi grind (that's 11 degrees each side). The blade is 3.6mm thick so the angle, to be accurate would have to start at the midway point on the blade edge (that's where it's gonna finish on each side). I figured the distance from blade edge to the upstand was about 250mm and the height of stand about 70mm to give me my 11 degree angle (I set the angle first with a protractor and measured it) Cut some scrap blockboard to mount it on. Cut some threaded round bar I had and drilled holes for it at about 300mm distance from edge of board. Mounted the rods with nuts sandwiching the board and drilled some metal plate to form a bridge. I set the blade just protruding from the edge of the board and angled it so that I could get an arced "sweep" to keep roughly 90 degrees to the blade edge as I was filing round it. Secured it to the board with two screws through handle.

Next fastened a ******* file to a piece of aluminium tube with cable ties. Laid it on jig and checked angle again and adjusted the height of the bridge with the nuts.

Now the weird bit (see photos). I needed something to act as a stop to the file where I wanted the grind to end near the handle. Needed to be hard to resist the file edge so I found an old masonry chisel and anchored it with nails so that the buttonhead acted as the stop. Yeah it's a bit Fred Carno but I wanted to get on with it. I like improvising with what you have too. It works surprisingly well if you just take things steady and keep checking. See next post for questions on heat treating and hardness please.

 

[Paddytray]

Perfect I use a vice on the end of mine and a bit of old woodplane blade for a straight edge clamped down for a tidy finish .

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[smojo]

Next step - start filing. First I marked the centre line down the blade edge with a drill point and coloured a section of the blade with marker pen so I could scribe a guide line on the side of blade. Used a micrometer set at 6mm to scribe a line through the pen mark by running it along the blade edge. Took it nice and steady with the file working evenly back and forth along the full edge (remembering only to push the file Dave). Keeping an eye on my guide lines I stopped when I got to about 1mm of the centre line and turned it over, reset the blade with the old chisel and did the other side. Now here's what's puzzling me and hope someone can throw some light on it.

It was relatively easy to file, took about 10 minutes each side. After all the talk of heat treatment and hardened metal, I'm now wondering if it had been tempered or not. I bought it from a guy on this site who makes knives. He said it was heat treated and as you can see it was black when I got it. He gave me the impression it would be hard but because it is small, could probably get the grind using files. That's why I bought it and ended up with all these questions. Surely the heat treatment wouldn't have been to anneal or soften it as he had had them laser cut and presumably they would already be quite malleable. So I assumed the heat treatment was to temper it. I shall PM him to try to solve the puzzle. Is there an easy way to test it so I can know for sure? I need to know whether to carry on with the grind or stop short in case it needs heat treating again. Some photos of my first rough grind with the file jig.

 

[Paddytray]

Get some rockwell hardness testing files ?

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[Dave Budd]

glad to see you got going and that you remembered to only push the file

I don't think it was heat treated, or if it was then it won't hold much of an edge. Do you have a swiss army knife (proper victorinox)? try and shave a sliver of the steel away from the knife edge you've just filed. A SAK is about 55RC so at the lower end of useful in a knife. If the blank IS heat treated then it shouldn't be scratched y the SAK, but if it is NOT heat treated then the SAK will cut into it.

 

[smojo]

I don't think it was heat treated, or if it was then it won't hold much of an edge. Do you have a swiss army knife (proper victorinox)? try and shave a sliver of the steel away from the knife edge you've just filed. A SAK is about 55RC so at the lower end of useful in a knife. If the blank IS heat treated then it shouldn't be scratched y the SAK, but if it is NOT heat treated then the SAK will cut into it.

Don't have a SAK but do have a Leatherman and a Mora black carbon bushcraft knife. Would either of those do? I did find it hard to make a scratch mark with a drill bit when marking the edge though. Would a small test drilling on the handle tell me anything?

 

[smojo]

Once upon a time, life was simple. Eat, drink, pee, poo, go to sleep, wake up. Yeah but boring!