not neolithic Britain yet then?

[wanderingblade]

EDIT: tho at least this scaremongering has had a positive effect, as you mentioned normal flu deaths are down.

Positive effect? I don't think so!

Usual seasonal deaths being down is a good thing (although you have to wonder why these people were not practicing good hygene already?) but the panic and distress caused was irresponsible.

My other half works in the NHS and was practically mugged for tamiflu - there has been violence, threats and abuse from people who have been convinced they are about to see their kids die a lingering death because one of them just sneezed.

How the hell are healthcare professionals supposed to get the true facts across when they are constantly contradicted by the mass media?

 

[TallMikeM]

Positive effect? I don't think so!

Usual seasonal deaths being down is a good thing (although you have to wonder why these people were not practicing good hygene already?) but the panic and distress caused was irresponsible.

My other half works in the NHS and was practically mugged for tamiflu - there has been violence, threats and abuse from people who have been convinced they are about to see their kids die a lingering death because one of them just sneezed.

How the hell are healthcare professionals supposed to get the true facts across when they are constantly contradicted by the mass media?

you're quite right, people not dying is a terrible thing.
Besides, toddy mentioned the people not dying as a good thing, I was merely agreeign with her.

 

[wanderingblade]

you're quite right, people not dying is a terrible thing.
Besides, toddy mentioned the people not dying as a good thing, I was merely agreeign with her.

Re-read the post.

 

[TallMikeM]

Re-read the post.

and you re read mine. I said it had a positive effect.

 

[wanderingblade]

you're quite right, people not dying is a terrible thing.

Re-read the above and it still reads the same.
Either it's a typo or sarcasm - or I'm missing the point?

 

[TallMikeM]

Re-read the above and it still reads the same.
Either it's a typo or sarcasm - or I'm missing the point?

this is what you initially lambasted me for:

Positive effect? I don't think so!

I merely said that the reduction in deaths to seasonal flu was a positive effect. I never mentioned anything else. People not dying was/is a positive effect.

And yes, it was sarcasm.

 

[wanderingblade]

I see.

You are of course right, but as I said - a consequential benifit that arises from a manipulative scheme cannot justify the action. I never have bought in to the whole 'well if it saves just one life then it's worth it' sentimental pap.

To take the analogy to the extreme, I'm sure no-one will say that WWI was a bit bad but it's ok because it did produce some good poetry.

 

[TallMikeM]

I see.

You are of course right, but as I said - a consequential benifit that arises from a manipulative scheme cannot justify the action. I never have bought in to the whole 'well if it saves just one life then it's worth it' sentimental pap.

To take the analogy to the extreme, I'm sure no-one will say that WWI was a bit bad but it's ok because it did produce some good poetry.

you can, of course, reduce any analogy the absurd (can't remember the latin phrase for that, been 15 years since I studied philosophy) but I would say that with the swine flu hysteria, the positive effects out weigh the negetive (and even the negetive give many of us a chance to have a good laugh at those who get caught up in hysteria).

 

[wanderingblade]

I guess it is because I'm coming from the viewpoint of having seen the violent reactions of people refused tamiflu on demand at hospital reception desks.

Also seeing the sheer panic among kids when a teacher at our local school was diagnosed with Swine Flu - having a group of 5 & 6 years olds scared silly they will die isn't particularly nice.


And then of course we have the posibility that one day there will be a real threat to public health and it will be dismissed by a panic weary public who will write it off as yet another SARS / CJD / Bird Flu / swine flu episode and ignore the warnings until it's too late.

It is easy to laugh it off as silly media hysteria, but unfortunatley when the vast majority of the population rely 100% on the mainsteam media for their understanding of what is happening in the world around them you see the power that can be weilded and how frighteningly fast panic and fear can be instilled with little or no corroboration.

 

[TallMikeM]

I would say that fear and hysteria are part of what we are. From pre history, right through to the modern age, there have been people only too willing to prey on our fears. Pretty much every single religion (certainly the judeo/christian/islamic religions do) relies on the fear of the afterlife to keep people in line, anything that goes wrong was gods punishment for a sinful people.
Now we have the media as the man in the pulpit, preaching to the ignorant but it's the same thing in different clothes. The deer antlers or vestements have been replaced, but the new clothes serve the same purpose.
All we can really hope to do is to make things a little better as we go along, and I'll continue to look for the positive in a situation and put the negetives down to experience.

 

[wanderingblade]

From pre history, right through to the modern age, there have been people only too willing to prey on our fears.

All too true.
One would hope there may one day be an age of reason where this cycle is broken.

I won't hold my breath.