Nikwax or Grangers ?

[Mungo]

I need to proof a cotton smock, not expecting full dry suit levels of protection, but a little light shower protection would be nice.

After having a mooch around here and the net, people seem to be pretty strongly for either one product or the other, so what do you think ?

 

[BorderReiver]

Nikwax is more environmentaly friendly AFAIK.

 

[Mungo]

I'm swinging more towards Nikwax to be honest, but I have heard it said Grangers is technically the better product.

 

[Miggers]

Grangers for me, especially on my goretex. I use the 2 in 1 stuff on my cotton gaberdine too...

 

[Mungo]

Thanks Miggers. Don't suppose you've used Nikwax before ? Any comparisons on the two ?

 

[Jedadiah]

Hi Tahr,

it has probably been noted by other members that i fall into the Nikwax category (quite heavily). Although i am in no way connected to the company or any retailer that sells the stuff, i use Nikwax on more or less every bit of outdoor kit i own (and some others !

I have used Grangers in the past but i found that the Nikwax stuff seems to be more reliable and environmentally friendly. My cotton smock's are a favourite, i always use cotton proof (or TX-10 as it used to be known) and tech wash on them and the trousers. I did a week long outdoor stint in Feb for instance. It bucketed down and blew a gale and when i say a week outdoors, it really was a week outdoors. Bivvying under a tarp was as close to indoor's as i got. Any road up, i used my Nikwax proofed cotton gear (smock, trousers, jungle hat etc) and my Nikwax proofed non-goretex leather boots all week and not once did i feel the need to drag out my goretex clothing. It really can be that good. If you apply it right and maintain it with tech wash, you will not regret it.

Personally, if it is a first application, i initially wash the clothing in a 40deg cotton cycle with no detergent, followed by a 40deg cycle with tech wash, followed by three 40deg cycles with Cotton proof, then hang to dry. After that, if it requires a wash i'll tech wash it and the cotton proof it once afterwards. It might sound a bit of a fuss, but i find this works if you want to get a good proofing from the off. To be honest, i should by rights get a christmas card from Nikwax! I use Gearproof on my bergan and daysack, Fleeceproof on my fleeces, Gloveproof on my gloves, Aqueous wax on my boots, and the spray on stuff, name escapes me for the moment, on my Buffalo Mountain shirt and Snugpak Softy. I even use their saddlery spray on my dog's collars!

Try both, see what you think, my opinion through experience is pretty straight forward.

 

[Miggers]

Hi Tahr - I used it on a Fjallraven polycotton jacket and it never seemed last both wash ins and sprays. That was a few years back when it was seemingly the only product on the market.

 

[Andy]

nikwax for me, mostly because I've had a number of freesamples from them for cleaning and rewaterproofing stuff. I've got a paramo coat and base layer as well and like them very much

 

[Mungo]

Thanks for all the help folks, especially Jedadiah !

I've decided to give the Nikwax a go, it seems more environmentally friendly from what I can see. I went to my local Nikwax stockist and they had everything but ! Seems like the Nikwax cotton proof isn't that much in demand in my local outdoors shop.

I'll be following the patented Jedadiah techwash/cottonproof application method, seems like the way forward to me !

Thanks again for all the help everybody.

 

[Jedadiah]

Hi Tahr,

i know what you mean about the availability of Cotton proof. What i did was basically tell my local stockist that i will be buying it regularly. He got a load in and, you know what, i went to the shop and they had sold out! Luckily he had put two packs to one side for me, but now he stocks it, it's selling as well as the tech wash. He says that the people who buy it have been in, found he doesnt stock it, then left and bought it on the net without telling him what they were after. Now he stocks it, they usually buy two or three at a time. He's learnt his lesson, maybe you could tell your stockist this tale, i'm sure he'll see the light.

 

[Mungo]

Well, I tried it mate and basically got the ol 'three headed space alien' look off my local outdoors shop owner.

Tried the patented Jedadiah techwash/cottonproof application method yesterday, I really hope it works well, I got some abuse of the wife yesterday for basically commandeering the washing machine most of the day !

 

[Jedadiah]

Let me know how you get on, most of my mates have tried it and they were very pleased with the result!

 

[Mungo]

I'm in serious trouble. Just had a severe tongue lashing off the wife. She took my smock out of the machine this morning and the nikwax has left a rubbery film stuck to the inside of the washing machine drum. You can scrape it off with a fingernail, but to get it all off this way would take forever.

We've got a two month old daughter, the washing machine is constantly on. I'm afraid now if we use the machine the film on the drum will wreck whatever clothes we've washed. My other half has already tried a 45 degree C wash with detergent and the machine empty to no effect, we've just put it on a 95 degree C wash and are hoping for the best !

Please someone tell me this has happened to someone else before and is no big deal. I'm seriously in the doghouse at the moment and if I've written off the washing machine it's going to get a whole lot worse.

 

[andyn]

How much of the product did you put in the drawer?

Ive not used nikwax as much as it would seem Jedadiah has, but ive never had a problem like that. :s

Might be worth calling Nikwax :01892 786 400 and getting advice from them directly?

 

[Mungo]

3 lidfuls, exactly what it says on the bottle. The 95 degree C wash had no effect either, managed to find some washing machine cleaner in one of the local supermarkets, so I'm trying that now.

The Nikwax has managed to coat the velcro wrist closures on the smock with the same rubbery substance as is on the inside of the machine, which has rendered the wrist closures on the smock pretty much useless.

It's a good job it's only a cheap cotton smock, if this was a expensive garment with multiple velcro tabs, I might be looking at a new washing machine and a ruined smock/jacket.

At the moment I think I can safely say I'm distinctly less than impressed with Nikwax.

 

[Jedadiah]

Did you check that nothing was left in the drum before doing your wash? Maybe something like a plastic backed bib or something? I've never had this happen to me and have never heard of it happening to anyone else. Was there anything in the smock pocket? It is a cotton smock isn't it, not lined with anything?

I'm sorry if this sounds like i'm grabbing at straws, but i'm desperately trying to suss out what's gone wrong. I very much doubt that the Nikwax was to blame, but i'll wait with baited breath for your answer!

 

[Mungo]

Yep, I checked it for everything mate. There was absolutely nothing in the drum.
I even spent about 15 minutes getting the detergent drawer spotless !

I really have no idea why this has happened. The smock is 100% cotton with no lining, the only thing in the machine was the smock, water and Nikwax.

The only thing I can think of is that maybe that we're on water from a borehole and not mains water might have made a difference ?

Tried two bottles of the washing machine cleaner, one after the other and it's had little effect. Just softened the residue slightly.

 

[Jedadiah]

I don't understand it. Everything Nikwax does is water based not chemically based, there should be no adverse reaction when coming into contact with water.

I'm at a loss mate. The best thing i could recommend is to contact Nikwax directly and explain the situation. They should investigate and come to you with a solution and if it has happened before.

What is the difference with water from a bore hole and main's water? Is it cleaner or fresher? It probably will not have the addatives mains water has, but i cannot see that being an issue.

Good luck mate, keep me posted.

 

[andyn]

3 lidfuls, exactly what it says on the bottle

Not sure how much difference it will make..but i've always been under the impression that it is

2 caps for 1 item

3 caps for 2 or 3 items.

So i'd double check the bottle if i was you.

Even so though I can't imagine it would make enough difference to wax the drum.

I'd try sticking some old clothes in there, to help rub the residue off and putting a hot wash on.

If still no joy, ring nikwax consumer support.

 

[Mungo]

I think I know what it is. It took me a while to realise it though.

The smock has a smallish yellow and orange logo on the chest, around two inches or so across. Being a bit funny like that, I used a permanent marker to black out the logo before I put it in the washing machine and used the nikwax. I think the black ink reacted with the nikwax and left the dark rubbery coating in the drum.

I still think it's a bit strange how a small amount of black ink managed to react with the nikwax and coat the whole drum, but I suppose to cover a orange and yellow logo you have to use a fair amount of ink !

I ended up scrubbing the drum out, took me well over a hour to get it all out with a scourer. I thought I'd chance my arm, and went out and bought some nikwax softshell proofer and techwashed and treated a old windstopper fleece I have with the patented Jedadiah intial application method. I was a little apprehensive, and the wife wasn't looking too happy, but it worked fine !

Just have to try the fleece and smock out now. Thanks a stack for all the help folks ! ! !

P.S. Andy, I can't remember now what the exact amount was, it's been used up and the bottle binned now but I checked the label a load of times in a panic after the act and I'm sure I put the right amount in.