New pocket axe

why the pocket axe when the small forest axe will do the job?

That's a really good question with answers which will be difficult to accept for many.

Living here on the northern BC coast, I get lots of opportunites to use axes. We have some beautiful trails, but they only stay in existence if people clear all the fallen trees etc. Since I have very limited time, I carry a larger axe every time I go out - in order to do a bit of clearing on each trip. There's always a huge axe behind the seat of the truck, too to deal with any trees across logging roads.
So it's a very logical question as to why I'd want to carry a tiny hatchet along when I have something which is many times more capable. Tiny hatchets are a pain too, because you have to practise with them all the time to have faith in them. Well I still do and I've done lots with them.
Lots of times I've been down on one of the beaches making a fire to warm up, dry up and brew up and I've questioned using the little hatchet when I have a big tool sitting right there which will make the job trivial. Luckily this place is pretty much wilderness so I don't get onlookers who would really question my sanity!
I practise with the little axe, though, because I'd rather practise when I'm still in one piece than do the practising when things go bad. Then I will need to be practised up, already.

In my experience, things will go badly only after you've put down your pack and axe somewhere and just taken a walk to look at something. That's when you depend on what's attached to you. It's easy at this point to slip into the "well I'd never put down my big axe" way of thinking - but you will. Last summer when I was hauling logs I couldn't carry the big axe too - and sure enough I took a fall. that's simply the way things work in the real world. Naturally the log rolled over me and since I had a rope over my shoulders - dragged me a bit. But the original notion was that since I'd got the log up a steep slope and was only hauling it along a trail things were totally safe... I was fine but a person never knows when they're going to need something right at hand to make splints and crutches with. I have so many axes, but not one of them comes when I whistle for it - so much for axe training!

I found myself not carrying a larger hatchet constantly on me when working with larger axes - the bigger hatchet gets in the way. Sometimes though I just go for a walk and leave the axe behind because I know that I simply don't have time to do any chopping. It's tempting then to just take the tiny hatchet. That's when I have to tell myself not to be lazy and foolish because a bigger hatchet is easily carried in those circumstances and will do far more.
I used to think that as long as I had a Mora with me I'd be fine. Here though things are wet and so far more difficult: I'll take the biggest thing that I know I'll carry on me, and that I have confidence in. Lots of people won't have much confidence in tiny hatchets - and if you don't have confidence when you are capable, it can only be worse when you've had an accident so it's worth figuring just what you can carry that you are sure of. If that happens to be an axe, then it's surely worth examining how often you do get further away from it than you'd care to drag yourself. I'd suspect that like me it's more time than you'd think, because I used to believe axes were the total solution.

I'm sure happy if I've inspired people to try axes! It's going to take lots of us to make sense of them. Conditions vary too, so it's more than likely that what I write doesn't make much sense to people in drier or hardwood locations.
 

mrostov

Nomad
Jan 2, 2006
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With a smaller axe than my Norlund, I'd probably just use a big knife like a bowie instead.

I've found my Norlund 'Voyageur' to be just about the right size and weight for most of what I need. My understanding is that there is a company called EZ still making them with the original Norlund tooling and name.

The Hudson Bay style head is light - 14oz - but the 3" bit, IMHO, is about as small as I want to go. I've taken to carrying on my right side behind my knife sheath and leatherman pouch and it rides as well as my bowie, more compact actually.

Yeah the bit cover looks a big doggy, but it works, and has worked well for a long time now. It's one of those situations where 'if it's not broke, don't fix it'. It was sort of a working prototype that just kind of stayed working. It's the original, worn Norlund bit cover that I tweaked a bit for repairs and to make it more practical. I added some leather spacer material into the welt and I modified the original buckle in a hurry to use a Fastex buckle. the Fastex buckle is a major improvement in speed of deployment. That style of bit cover also allows me to use the hatchet as a hammer with the blade edge covered, something which I find to be a plus. I'm making something new and I'll post a pic when I'm done. I usually carry it stuck in my belt, frontiersmans style. It rides well, out of the way, and doesn't make much noise, such as when you're hunting.

Norlund2.jpg
 

heath

Settler
Jan 20, 2006
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Birmingham
Ok here goes Red I'll try and answer your questions;
I haven't done anything to the handle yet, those dark areas were there when i got it.
The reflection on the first picture is a secondary bevel (only on one side). The two areas you spotted are slight indentations and the heel is very blunt (it looks like they didn't bother to finish it).

As for tools I'm afraid I don't have much at all, just a combination 1000/6000 waterstone.
 

mrostov

Nomad
Jan 2, 2006
410
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heath said:
Ok here goes Red I'll try and answer your questions;
I haven't done anything to the handle yet, those dark areas were there when i got it.
The reflection on the first picture is a secondary bevel (only on one side). The two areas you spotted are slight indentations and the heel is very blunt (it looks like they didn't bother to finish it).

As for tools I'm afraid I don't have much at all, just a combination 1000/6000 waterstone.

A simple tool that's good for redoing axe heads and knives is a small vibrational sander such what is commonly used for wood and auto body work. They are cheap and small and work well. I recently used one for restoring a much abused 4" bit Norlund Hudson Bay style medium forest axe and a medium sized double bit head that scavanged up at a yard sale.

Still working on the double bit and I need to install a new handle on the 4" bit Norlund. Having a hard time finding an original length 19" handle for the Norlund, so I might have to special order a Gransfors Bruks replacement handle for their Hunter's Axe.

Get a bunch of 100grit sandpaper for a lot of the work and finish it up with 220 and then up to 400.

I'd be mainly concered with smoothing out and rounding the edges of the poll, and with a uniform profile and edge on the bit.
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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Heath,

As a minimum, you are going to need a coarse metal file (known as a bast**d file), a finer file and some wet and dry paper for finish. We need to even the bit out by taking some metal off from the left hand A - (which is supposed to be B :eek:), losing the secondary bevel and smoothing the lot back to the depth of the dent A. I'm less worried about D to be honest - int wont affect performance much. Personally, I'd also be tempted to sand the helve back to raw wood and oil finish it. Does it feel quite rough now? Mine did!

So we have two choices,

(1) You can invest in a coarse metal file (we might get away without a fine one) and some wet and dry ( a mixed pack they sell in B&Q of 240, 400 and 600 will do). This will be hard work (but not too onerous...say a couple of solid evenings). This is quite an investment given what you paid (you are going to have to put at least £10 into tools), but you will have the file at the end.

(2) Buy a belt sander. Even a 1" type will do. A slack belt can be used to refinsh the head. This is more Old Jimbo's area than mine and will cost more than the axe did, but you will do the job fast and well and have the tool for future.

(3) Send the axe to me and I'll re-profile the head for you and oil finish the helve if thats what you want. Upside is - it won't cost you a penny and you will get a sharp axe. Down side is you will miss out on the learning (don't know if this matters to you yet - if this is a first proper axe, just getting it set up right will probably be enough for now)

Let me know which way you would like to go mate

Red
 

heath

Settler
Jan 20, 2006
637
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Birmingham
Red you are a gent and I must say that it is very tempting to just send it to you as I know I'll end up with a quality result, however it is likely that my future axe buys will be more expensive so this is probably the best opportunity to learn. So thanks for the offer but I think I will go for option 1 this time.
Can you reccomend anything specific tool wise. I know Gransfors do axe files but they do seem rather expensive, any cheaper alternatives?
I did notice that the little booklet that came with the axe said not to use files, should I just ignore this?
Also (sorry again for my ignorance) what kind of oil should I use for the haft?

Thanks again
Heath
 
mrostov: Have you seen any of the new Norlunds? I haven't had the opportunity of handling one and the current price plus comments on other forums haven't given me great hopes.
The old Norlunds have all been of high standard in terms of heat treat, and I've finished all types - though that means less than a dozen. Mine, now lightened up, but with longer handle is 19oz.
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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heath,

the thing with files is that they do remove a lot of metal - not normally a great idea, but useful on this occasion. The GB axe file and diamond file are well made and suited to the job being very short in length, but they are, as you say, an expensive option. If you are trying to keep the price down, pop down to B&Q or the like and ask for a b**tard file - you should get one for less than £10.
You can use linseed or tung oil on the handle - I tend to use plain olive oil or sesame oil (which smells great). Give me a shout when you have one and we'll take it from there

Red
 

cyclist

Need to contact Admin...
Sep 9, 2006
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holstein
jason sears said:
why the pocket axe when the small forest axe will do the job

touring with a bicycle you´ll pretty soon take only what´s useful. Weight matters.
Thinking on those tiny mini hatchets: they have the same blade length as a Swiss army knive.....
SAKs dont have a 25 or 30cm long handle. If you don´t see the usefullness of a well designed 10" piece of wood try to split logs with a SAK. Ok, a SAK has a saw. Good luck.
A tiny hatchet can also be used as a hammer. On long cycling tours you have to deal with more than enough repairs - needless to say a hammer is very useful.

Out of curiosity I transformed an ex German army hatchet into a small camping hatchet: The head was 900g, now the hatchet is at 450g.
A cheap departmemnt store hatchet was converted into a micro hatchet. Lots of work with angle grinder, belt sander, files, waterstone etc. to go down from a 600g head to 250g and reharden it with the help of a charcoal camping grill - for sure those Gränsfors are not overprized for what you get: tools needed and time spent would probably pay for 3 mini hatchets made by LP.
That converted micro has a blade of just 50mm - about the minimum an axe or hatchet works.
 

mrostov

Nomad
Jan 2, 2006
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Texas
OldJimbo said:
mrostov: Have you seen any of the new Norlunds? I haven't had the opportunity of handling one and the current price plus comments on other forums haven't given me great hopes.
The old Norlunds have all been of high standard in terms of heat treat, and I've finished all types - though that means less than a dozen. Mine, now lightened up, but with longer handle is 19oz.

No, I haven't tried any of the new Norlunds. I saw a bunch them on a shelf at a military surplus store in Mesa, Arizona a while back, but I was in a hurry and when I went back they had been cleaned out. They had the smaller Hudson Bay hatchets and a larger Hudson Bay small forest axe.I haven't heard any feedback on any yet from the Internet. They were in a plastic package with no sheath/bit cover, and the instructions on the clear plastic packaging said to use the plastic packaging as the storage container when not in use - how cheesy is that? They are made by a company IIRC is named 'EZ'.

I may pick up another older Norlund Bay hatchet head off of Ebay as a spare. About the closest thing I can think of that I'd want to replace it with if I couldn't get another Norlund is a Gransfors Bruks.

Lately I've been trying to find an original length handle for the larger Norlund Hudson Bay head I just refurbished that has a 4" bit. It originally came with a 19" handle that was beyond salvaging.
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
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heath - just passing through - remind me tonight and I'll do you a quick write up of stage 1. Have you got some gardening gloves or the like?

Red
 

hollowdweller

Forager
Mar 3, 2006
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jason sears said:
why the pocket axe when the small forest axe will do the job

When I am home at my house hiking thru my woods I carry a khukuri almost exclusively. It will chop stuff up to about 6" really easily and will also swing easy enough to clear brush and small saplings. If I know I am going to be chopping a lot of thicker stuff, then I take the GB Wildlife. The Hunters axe IMO is too bulky to carry far unless I am going specifically to chop out some obstacle.

When I am backpacking I almost always take an axe that is just about a pound plus or minus . When we hiked North Fork Mountain where you have to carry all your water I carried the GB mini. It's the smallest I have.

Not really sure why someone not into backpacking would carry one of the smaller hatchets.
 

jasons

Settler
Jan 15, 2006
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hollowdweller said:
When I am home at my house hiking thru my woods I carry a khukuri almost exclusively. It will chop stuff up to about 6" really easily and will also swing easy enough to clear brush and small saplings. If I know I am going to be chopping a lot of thicker stuff, then I take the GB Wildlife. The Hunters axe IMO is too bulky to carry far unless I am going specifically to chop out some obstacle.

When I am backpacking I almost always take an axe that is just about a pound plus or minus . When we hiked North Fork Mountain where you have to carry all your water I carried the GB mini. It's the smallest I have.

Not really sure why someone not into backpacking would carry one of the smaller hatchets.
I use my knife with a batton for smaller stuff
 

British Red

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Dec 30, 2005
26,891
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heath said:
ok Red I'm tooled up, what do I do now?

Have

This is my advice to you using the minimal tools we have to use. Its not text book stuff, but we are bushcrafters - we work with what we have to hand! Anyone else wants to chip in here...feel free!

Righto, point one put your gloves on!

No really! Doing this you WILL slip and you WILL bleed as this is a small axe I'm going to show free hand sharpening. You might think mine look grubby and feeble in the piccs but they are kevlar and have saved my hands many a time!

Right some basics first. Your axe blade is convex...see the picture of various grinds below.

367288956_e287fb1f43.jpg


This means that the outer edge of the blade is curved. We want to keep it that way as it adds a measure of strength to the bit. Your file will be flat. This makes life a little tricky, but far from impossible. I may use some odd terms here.. if I do, please refer to this other picture I did to explain what I mean by "the toe" etc.

axepartssu2.jpg


A: Heel of Head
B: Bit
C: Toe of Head
D: Cheek or Ramp
E: Poll
F: Neck
G: Belly
H: Shoulder
I: Toe of Haft
J: Heel of Haft
K: Eye
L: Wooden Wedge
M: Metal Wedge


Right now we have a few things to do here! we want to remove that thick, blunt area at the heel of the head, grind that secondary flat bevel into a smooth concave area and grind out the ding in the bevel.

To do this we need to remove metal with the file.

The side view of your head will be something like this

367288961_1fee082a57.jpg


What we need to do is file backwards, from the bit of the axe towards the poll. If we file forwards, we'll "push" metal towards the cutting edge forming a wire that will block cutting efficiency and thats not good. Sadly this means we are pushing towards the cutting edge. GLOVES.

When we file, because we are using a coarse file, we'll leave grooves in the metal. These are tricky to get rid of later so we'll file bit to poll but on an angle (toe to heel). At the next stage we'll reverse the angle and this will get rid of the file marks.

So this is the desired motion - imagine the green bar as the file.

367336794_13e41e9a85.jpg


Got it? Good!

Now if thats all you do, you will file the bit flat, and thats not what we want, so lift your hand holding the file as you push and roll the file around the convex bevel.

If this is the bevel

367288966_7b38d173b8.jpg


Then this is the motion you want

367336798_c9116f99b4.jpg


Concentrate on long sweeping strokes right across the bevel (although you made need to take a bit of metal off the thick area by the heel first and then even out with long strokes).

Dont do lodes on one side. Keep turning the axe over and working both sides evenly. Sight along the bit and make sure you are keeping it in perfect line with the haft

headalignsp9.jpg


On both sides, keep the file strokes going down towards the haft - this will feel awkward on one side, but don't worry.

The bit, when finished, should be a bit thinner than now, an even thickness, and have no dings. It should be in a straight line as you sight along it and be in line with the haft.

Go slow and steady. You can take more off, but you can't put it back

Put your index finger on top of the file to guide it and work one way....(note where the haft is pointing)


367336793_e6e3c3df6c.jpg



And then the other.....

367336791_37ebfa9cdd.jpg


At the end of this process, your bit should be even, but rough. Shout when you are done and we'll cover the next step...

Any questions? :D

Red
 
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Shinken

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why the pocket axe when the small forest axe will do the job

Hi Jason!

Your small forest axe got as good as it is by people being as interested in axes as Red is. If people didnt care about kit it would all be crap, the flint knife wouldnt have became a metal knife because a flint knife will cut and it'l do.

:lmao:

Take it easy mate
 

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