Making the kill

[thebeatmeister]

As a re-enacter i have often found myself with a warbow in my hands having a plink at some butts and i have to say i'm not bad at all!! I don't own a bow but I've often mused over the art of the hunter and how they make a kill using an arrow. Of course making a bow and arrows and spears are all part of the survival ethos and i've often wandered more for curiosity's sake how an effective quick and humane kill is achieved with such a tool. Does anyone have any experience in these methods? where on the animal do you aim? what can you do to ease the animals passing if your aim is untrue?
The art of making a bow is something i will look into in greater detail at a later date just the methods are sought. I understand hunting is an art for which you need practice and i've no intention of 'practicing' on animals for practicing's sake; just a little theoretical knowledge is better than none at all.
For the sake of the compassionate..I do not believe in killing animals for sport, bravado or boredom.

 

[akabu]

http://www.javelinahunter.com/javelina_kill_zone.htm

 

[Bothwell_Craig]

It's illegal to hunt with a bow in this country. There are however some good field archery targets that are full sized and you can practice on if you have suitable land to shoot arrows over.

http://www.quicksarchery.co.uk/superbasket/category.php?category=1201

gives you an idea of whats available but they are expensive!

 

[thelonlywanderer]

I think it depends on the type of animal your hunting,
Im no expert but i would aim for central mass if useing a bow, lungs and heart are what Id be aiming for,
to finish off a smaller animal if i missed id hit it on the back of the head once and hard with a large stick.

dont know about larger animals...cut the throat maybe?

I also am not a fan of killing animals, I only usualy do it to teach someone how to do it, so that they can if they have to :

regards TLW

edit: wow i dident know it was illeagal

 

[Draven]

to finish off a smaller animal if i missed id hit it on the back of the head once and hard with a large stick.

dont know about larger animals...cut the throat maybe?

Killing a wounded smaller animal is generally best done with a shar blow to the head as you say, or breaking its neck. With larger animals, it's more difficult because there's a good chance if you try to slit the throat of, for example, a wounded stag, you'll probably get pretty badly hurt. If you're bowhunting, which is illegal here as already stated, I expect the best solution would be to stand a couple metres away and shoot it somewhere where you know you'll kill it. If you're hunting with a rifle, it's considerably easier to kill once wounded though. You don't want flailing antlers to knock you arrow off course, and wind up wounding it again. I'm fine with bowhunting though, as long as it's practiced by someone with sufficient skill.

Pete

 

[thebeatmeister]

that was a handy link akabu thanks. draven thanks. like i say I'm not going to practice it, its just more curiosity.

 

[Ogri the trog]

So long as the discussion stays on the "Theoretical" side for those of us in the UK - it should be OK.
Taking out the "engine room" of your prey (heart, lung area) is generally the aim of the "lower (bow & arrow or spear) -technology" hunter, it will at least, slow the progress of an animal sufficiently for you to gain ground and administer a coup-de-grace from closer quaters.
Using more accurate means (rifle etc), allows shot placement to be narrowed to an area where the prey is likely to drop immediately, such as the head/brain/upper spinal area, when a coup-de-grace is less often necessary.


ATB

Ogri the trog

 

[Cromm]

Hi,
It doesn't matter if it's a bullet or an arrow if you hit the heart it's going down fast. With an arrow with a sharp broadhead on the front you are cutting a hole into and out of the other side of the animal, I have seen animals(deer) act like they have been bite by a fly and after 10 to 30 seconds just sit down and die. Sometimes you can get two shots with the bow and arrow, as it doesn't make that much sound. And the animal will not jump and run away. Bowhunting is fine if you know were to put the arrow and you train alot with the bow, but tracking is the skill you should look into if you wanted to bowhunt. That way you can follow the blood trail to the animal and make sure it doesn't have a long death.IMO.
Thanks for your time.

 

[smoggy]

As we are talking......

A. thoereticaly.....

and

B. not for sport........

Then we are talking hunting for food, presumably as a neccesity.....ergo.....you hit it where you can! Surely? Yes a nice clean kill everytime would be nice, but even a good clean shot at a well stalked prey could take the slightest deflection of a rib and simply incapacitate the animal one would have thought......I would have thought that the first arrow shot could merley be the start of the hunt!!!!

Or am I totally wrong?

Smoggy

 

[British Red]

Bow hunting and rifle hunting are different. The method of kill is of its anture different.

A hunting bullet is designed to expand and "mushroom" as it passes through the prey (and on occasions "tumble)" causing enormous trauma. It can often end life quickly by causing huge damage to brain, spinal column, heart etc. In the event that this does not occur then blood loss is the next most likely cause of demise.

A broadhead hunting arrow is primarily designed to end life by cutting - organs and blood vessels. The broad head increases the size of the "cut". With luck, a heart shot or major artery will be severed, or the lungs compromised. Otherwise the animal is likely to bleed out after a period.

Good shot placement is key - with a rifle bullet, head spine or transverse shot (heart lung) is good depending on quaryy, backstop etc.

With an arrow, if I were a bow hunter (which I'm not), I would aim for a shot with the animal side on and to place the arrow behind the shoulder (a transverse shot). With this you have a very good chance of taking the heart and / or lungs and / or major blood vessels. Penetration must be key with an arrow - on large prey I can easily see an arrow glancing off a skull or breastbone. Generally a rifle of suitable calibre will penetrate - although some creatures (e.g rams) have remarkably thick skulls.

Red

 

[Joonsy]

It doesn't matter if it's a bullet or an arrow if you hit the heart it's going down fast. (deer)i

A deer shot through the heart will very often run a considerable distance before it drops, they can run 100 yards before they drop even though they are dead (the headless chicken scenario) only a well aimed shot through the neck that breaks it's neck will drop it on the spot.

 

[Joonsy]

where on the animal do you aim? what can you do to ease the animals passing if your aim is untrue?

If a large animal such as a deer, if you do not hit a vital organ you will almost certainly not be able to do anything at all to ease it's suffering, it will run off and probably die a lingering death, it will not lie down and simply wait for you to dispatch it. They will travel a considerable distance when stomach shot or with broken legs, it's not uncommon to find deer with limbs missing, or puss-filled head wounds, head shots should never be taken on deer, only heart or neck shots.

 

[Cromm]

Very true Joonsy....That's why I said that tracking would be one of the skills you should learn, that way you can hopefully find the deer if it has bedded down after it has been shot....

 

[Front Room Woodlander]

If one is using a bow or spear, then one is going to have to get close enough to use said weapon. knowing the habitat and habit of the creature in question is central to your success or failure.
When hunting rabbits with a catapult one has to be very thoughtful about approaching your quarry. I would suggest that anyone wanting to experience a little theory in practice might start by hunting small food quarry with limited means of dispatch. Squirrel makes good drum sticks for the BBQ.
Listen to the woods and your feet moving through it. Watch the movements of the creature and its behaviour through its habitat and through the year as the purpose of its behaviour changes priority.

This last tip is a bit weird, but I'm sure that creatures can sense intent. Dont intend to ,kill a creature', rather intend 'not to be there'.

 

[Cromm]

Now that is very true, Front Room Woodlander....

 

[DavidJT]

It's my understanding that most bow hunting (in America + Africa etc) is done from hides, at very close range (like 10m - 15m). A well placed broadhead, shot from a powerful bow at these distances is bound to dispatch the animal almost as quickly as a rifle.
Although I'm an archer, I don't really see the appeal, or the sport in this type of hunting, although have hunted / shot with shotguns.

 

[Goatboy]

It's illegal to hunt with a bow in this country. There are however some good field archery targets that are full sized and you can practice on if you have suitable land to shoot arrows over.

http://www.quicksarchery.co.uk/superbasket/category.php?category=1201

gives you an idea of whats available but they are expensive!

Though I believe ( and hope it's true as I did years ago ) legal to hunt salt water fish in this country. Used to fill aluminum shafts with wet sand, and made the balance rod on my compound into a basic reel. Hunting mackerel was pretty effective - though so was a line of bare hooks...lol.

Used to be a chap in my old club who traveled the world hunting animals, though his skill level and ability to pull an enormous draw weight was pretty legendary. Basically aiming at the same point as a firearm would, though fieldcraft had to be better. Also using arrows heads ( multi-bladed broadheads) that would cause massive bloodloss. Basicaly he could punch an arrow through both shoulder blades of a moose, so taking out the heart on the way. Most animals just dropped where they stood.

Anyway, to be a good enough shot you pretty much have to shoot every day. Another chap I worked with was a deadly catapult shot, could take a squirrel ( grey ) out of a tree or take down a rabbit from about 20 - 30 yards with the thing. Stone dead... in fact that's what he used, stones from a certain band on the shore from a beach at Speybay, the tide grades them for you.

TTFN
GB.

 

[Joonsy]

This last tip is a bit weird, but I'm sure that creatures can sense intent.

yes i think that as well, i have stumbled right onto animals very close-up when just plodding along but go prepared to catch something and they suddenly become very wary, it has happened too many times just to be coincidence, i try to avoid direct eye contact but there's more to it i'm sure, i once watched a pike with small fish swimming inches away from it, i'm sure those fish knew they were safe somehow, some people say you have to act like a red indian to get close to deer but i have stumbled into them only ten yards away when shuffling along noisily without a thought about anything, they obviously heard and saw me coming but made no attempt to take flight, however i have never stumbled into one when out hunting and then you do have to use fieldcraft to get close, in the local park the geese take food from your hand but when the wardens tried to catch one they couldn't get anywhere near it, i think ther is definately something in the ''sensing intent/danger'' and it's an interesting topic in itself.

 

[Pict]

Here in Pennsylvania deer hunting is legal and we have a long tradition of harvesting deer every year with rifle, bow, and more recently crossbow.

The preferred shot is pretty much the same with rifle or bow, behind the front leg into the heart/lungs. Head shots are risky with a rifle. You either get a solid head/spine hit and drop the animal like a sack of rocks, you get a clean miss and the animal runs, or you shoot it through the face and mutilate an animal that will run and die slowly.

If you hit the heart/aorta of a deer it will go down very quickly, within 5-35 yards is typical. A lung shot deer will go farther but they will be down in 50 - 100 yards if they aren't pushed but the hit is quickly fatal and you shouldn't have to track long.

A deer hit in from the diaphragm back (gut shot) will go into the next county.

Modern hunting arrows, even from traditional bows can achieve pass-through penetration, as in the arrow actually falls on the other side of the deer. Lung shots do this often as there isn't much to stop the arrow.

My brother shot a very large buck a few years ago in which the arrow struck the shoulder blade and apparently failed to penetrate. He heard a loud "Crack" as the arrow struck and as the deer took off he could see most of the arrow sticking out. You don't chase a deer hit with an arrow, you just wait about a half hour and they bed down and bleed out. If you chase they bolt and keep running. Anyway, he figured he was in for a long track and as he was waiting he heard the deer pile up in the forest and it seemed to go down hard. Upon examination the arrow had struck the shoulder blade and penetrated to the lungs, as the deer ran the broad head shredded him internally.

A few years ago he had a total pass through on a doe. When she was hit she only flinched and her tail went to half flag. She just looked around nervously and started to walk away, stopped, started to wobble and laid down. The arrow had entered between two ribs and exited between two and never touched a bone. She didn't even know she had been shot.

Never underestimate what a modern arrow can do with a sharp broad head and enough pounds of draw weight. Here in PA you have to use a bow with at least 45 lbs draw but typical is 55 - 60 in traditional bows. I know a guy who hunts with a 95 lb draw compound bow but that is at the upward extreme. Mac

 

[Chinkapin]

Just to give you a comparison, I once shot a broadhead arrow from a Bear Alaskan bow that was 55 lbs pull. I shot an abandoned refrigerator, (it was a large trophy sized one LOL) from about 10 meters distance. The arrow penetrated the exterior metal of the door, the insulation, the thick plastic inner part of the door, the metal wall of the back interior, the insulation in the back, and the metal on the exterior of the fridge. I discovered the arrow hanging by the knock from the cooling coils on the backside. It had penetrated the frig completely. Interestingly, the arrow head was completely unharmed. That is why they will penetrate a moose from one shoulder to the other and exit.