How many?

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chris

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How many new Bushcraft/survival Schools have appeared in the last year or so?

And how many are there in existence in the British Isles now?

Is anyone able to list them all?

I know Gary started his Bearclaw recently and Woody is starting his Bushcraft school this summer, I keep seeing allsorts of Survival and Bushcraft organisations starting up allmost monthly now, do you think there is enough interest to feed all the schools.

;)
 

Wayland

Hárbarðr
Judging from the TV coverage ( Ray Mears, Going to Extremes et al. ) someone obviously believes there is.

When I first got interested in backwoods stuff, back in the late 70s, there was very little info. available to the general public. Now there is a section in most bookshops and gear in most outdoor sports shops.

Someone must be buying it.
 
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bombadil

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Dunno the answer to that one, but they seem to be popping out of the woodwork left, right and centre. Funnily enuf, here in Portugal and in other countries, when people see me in the bush with a sharp knife, rubbing sticks together, stooping to identify some plant or fungus and any other weird stuff, they put it down to my being some eccentric englishman. I wonder if there's an opportunity here......
 
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bombadil

Guest
Wayland said:
Judging from the TV coverage ( Ray Mears, Going to Extremes et al. ) someone obviously believes there is.

When I first got interested in backwoods stuff, back in the late 70s, there was very little info. available to the general public. Now there is a section in most bookshops and gear in most outdoor sports shops.

Someone must be buying it.
Everyone's buying it.
There's even websites devoted to the ways of the woods......how ironic is that..... :p
 

Gary

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Apr 17, 2003
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Wayland said:
Now there is a section in most bookshops and gear in most outdoor sports shops. .

Which book shops do you visit Wayland? Best I can fine is the odd book either under travel writing or Nautural history!

As for schools some come, some go - its the natural order of things, whats important is that the potential student gets the best value for his buck!
 

Wayland

Hárbarðr
Waterstones in Manchester, Borders in Stalybridge, I've even found quite a few in the secondhand bookshops.

These days my bookshelves have 20 - 30 books that relate to wilderness skills whereas when I found Richard Graves' book on Bushcraft in the late 70s I'd never seen anything like it before.
 

Gary

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Wayland said:
Waterstones in Manchester, Borders in Stalybridge, I've even found quite a few in the secondhand bookshops.

These days my bookshelves have 20 - 30 books that relate to wilderness skills whereas when I found Richard Graves' book on Bushcraft in the late 70s I'd never seen anything like it before.

Oh right I thought you meant they had a dedicated bushcraft/survival section!! :eek:

Me first book I got back in 82 it was Eddie Magee 'no need to die' and I still have it too!
 

Toddy

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Jan 21, 2005
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Gary said:
Me first book I got back in 82 it was Eddie Magee 'no need to die' and I still have it too!

Me too, but it was," Stay Alive with Eddie McGee", and I bought it for my young sons so that they saw a man doing these sorts of things, and it was not just them having a weird mum :rolleyes: The boys loved it.

Toddy
 

Gary

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Toddy said:
Me too, but it was," Stay Alive with Eddie McGee", and I bought it for my young sons so that they saw a man doing these sorts of things, and it was not just them having a weird mum :rolleyes: The boys loved it.

Toddy

I didnt even know he had written two - do you have the details Toddy I'd love to get hold of a copy!!
 
Apr 20, 2005
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It would be interesting to see how many of those new schools are full time
and depending on feeding their kids and paying a mortgage with the money
they earn.
I wouldn't mind betting that some of them already have a full time job and
a wage that enables them to radically undercut the real professionals by one
subsidising the other. It begs the question, Why? Is it something to do with
ego or malice?
 

leon-1

Mod
Mod
ben919 said:
It would be interesting to see how many of those new schools are full time
and depending on feeding their kids and paying a mortgage with the money
they earn.
I wouldn't mind betting that some of them already have a full time job and
a wage that enables them to radically undercut the real professionals by one
subsidising the other. It begs the question, Why? Is it something to do with
ego or malice?
Ben you may find that the new schools with instructors with full time jobs are probably struggling to stay afloat, a lot need to run at nearly no profit at all to start off with just so that they can prove themselves, it is not neccesarilly about ego or malice, but a dream.

The world would be a sorry and sad place without dreams and if people benefit from your dream then good on you, if you make a profit from that over time then once again good on you.

If you are doing it for the money watch out, there is very little in it to start with and if youre subject matter is not upto scratch then it will show quite soon and other job or no the potential business will go down the pan.
 

Moonraker

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ben919 said:
It would be interesting to see how many of those new schools are full time and depending on feeding their kids and paying a mortgage with the money they earn.
I wouldn't mind betting that some of them already have a full time job and
a wage that enables them to radically undercut the real professionals by one
subsidising the other. It begs the question, Why? Is it something to do with
ego or malice?
I don't see why someone who is not doing it full-time is necessarily any less professional or 'qualified', or may offer just a good a level of instruction than anyone else, including those who do it full-time. Surely it is the expertise, ability to teach of the individual or business, safety of clients/ customer care and value for money that are important.

Are you in the business yourself ben?
 
B

bombadil

Guest
This begs another question.....
I was thinking about doing a bushcraft instructors course....what's the deal with running a group as far as legalities go?
Obviously experience is needed, anything else would be a farce, but with so many schools out there now, are there any requirements about certification?
 

Gary

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leon-1 said:
Ben you may find that the new schools with instructors with full time jobs are probably struggling to stay afloat, a lot need to run at nearly no profit at all to start off with just so that they can prove themselves, it is not neccesarilly about ego or malice, but a dream.

The world would be a sorry and sad place without dreams and if people benefit from your dream then good on you, if you make a profit from that over time then once again good on you.

If you are doing it for the money watch out, there is very little in it to start with and if youre subject matter is not upto scratch then it will show quite soon and other job or no the potential business will go down the pan.

Also I would consider the fact that those running courses and working in other jobs are showing more 'business sense' and dedication to their subject. Some instructors out there have run themselves into huge debts some owing tens of thousands to the bank because they gave up work - surely this puts a great strain on them, not that it would make them any worse an instructor of course but in very real terms it would dictate their actions unless they plan to end up bankrupt..

Surely a dedicated amatuer with a good set up (legally insured and with all the health and safety ect in place) and an experienced team will be just a professional when teaching and inparting knowldge as anyone. Even a guy who knows bushcraft skills but doesnt run a 'regular' school can make an excelllent teacher - in some cases more so as he is teach from the heart, after all that is how it was originally done, father to son, chief huntsman to young aduleciants ect.

There is also a thing called personality - a good instructor needs to have one of these regardless of what he is teaching - I have know army instructors who were walking knowledge banks but could not teach a lesson to save their life and this is true in many fields not just bushcraft.

Last thought. when people like myself, Ben Mcnutt ect worked for woodlore we were all doing other jobs - did that make us less qualified or substandard instructors?
 

chris

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Feb 25, 2004
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ouch!

Don't know about ego or malice, maybe you need to explain that one.

I do understand about the basic business sum of, if someone sets up a school to run courses at say 100 quid a weekend (50 - 75 quid less than established market costs) and they already have a job that pays the mortgage and bills, if they get 50 customers a year on their weekend courses - does that not pay for "the love of it" or will that person need to use money from his own weekly wages?

So what your saying Gary, is go to someone who runs courses at weekends on top of their day job, that will be better than learning at a school who's actual day job is teaching what these other's do at weekend. When enquiring about booking a course, ask the person what they do during the week and if they say, Bushcraft/Survival teaching then look elsewhere?

Out of interest, other than the obvious, is there any full timers left, I thought all the schools were part time now.
 

Paganwolf

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Jul 26, 2004
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www.WoodlifeTrails.com
ben919 said:
It would be interesting to see how many of those new schools are full time
and depending on feeding their kids and paying a mortgage with the money
they earn.
I wouldn't mind betting that some of them already have a full time job and
a wage that enables them to radically undercut the real professionals by one
subsidising the other. It begs the question, Why? Is it something to do with
ego or malice?
Hmm funny old post for your 1st one ;) I take my hat off to anyone who can make a living out of a full time bushcraft school and nothing else,and if they have a job going can you get them to post it on here as there will be many people interested :cool:

RM is the most prominant guy in the UK bushcraft world has part time instructors and still runs a shop,and produces TV shows, good buisness eh, or does he just bear malace against everyone else who runs a bushcraft buisness :confused: I think not.

What you are suggesting is that anyone with a buisness who also works for "the man" is egotistical and bears some kind of malace to everyone who runs a souly bushcraft buisness, i really cant get my head around that one buddy, explain :confused:,I would look at it that they do it because they are passionate about it and loved the subject.

if you think you can make a living in Bushcraft and want to sit around indoors waiting for people to come to you so you can play in the woods and be the Great Bushcraft instructor every now and again you will have a very rude awakening as i have said above 90% of schools have a shop to stay afloat, and has been already stated RM has to have part time and not full time instructors, says it all really doesnt it. And REAL PROFESSIONALS?who are they then? even RM wouldnt class his self as that i wouldnt of thought, bushcraft is a life long learning curve and any one who tells you that they are a professional! will be the one with the ego that needs boosting i can assure you.I can hear the bag of worms opening lol :D Anyway welcome to the forum and may your posts and imput be forth coming and plentifull :D ;)
 

chris

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Feb 25, 2004
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To get back on track here perhaps it would be a good idea to do a current industry research to answer the post questions - sounds like a job for bcuk

1.How many Bushcraft/survival schools are there in the British Isles?

2.Can anyone list them all?

3.When established?

4.Are they full or part time?

5.How many staff - full or part time?

6.Where do they operate?

7.Shop or no shop, ie do they just run courses or depend on selling gear also?

Rather than repeated answers in multi posts, if people pick one organisation to research and post about that one and when we have exhausted the breadth of our fine nation - list them. :)

Chris :)
 

Gary

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chris So what your saying Gary said:
No Chris, what I am saying is that each CAN be equally good or bad. It isnt a question of time (full or part) it is a question of ability, knowledge, dedication and passion for the subject they are teaching. Unlike other industries there is no recognised qualification, you cant get city and guilds bushcrafter - or Corgi registered, the only recommendation worth anything in bushcraft is word of mouth. Have a look on this forum and see which courses students have enjoyed and recommend - these wil tell you who the good schools are and you will find an even mix of fulltime and part time ones.

Personally if I wanted to learn something I wouldnt give a monkeys whether the teacher was full time, part time or on over time as long as he could impart the knowledge I wanted and just as importantly to me make it a safe/enjoyable experience.
 

jamesdevine

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Coming from an Irish perspective I known of only two Wild-Live run by Anthonio and John Hancock of Wilderness Range. Both have shops and of other services such as bow making or guiding services. There are others running weekend course but not through formal companies like the above non of which makes the less conpedent(sp).

May I ask why the interest is purly to have a complete list of the companies out there and what the offer in order to help give us enthusiest more choice?

I hope so.

Also the whole what qualifies someone to teach bushcraft thing as been beaten to death here before as has the part time full time issue. It's a little boring if you ask me.

James

This is just my view and no else please be kind
 
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