Do you really think................

[MSkiba]

Depends what you mean by survival kit.

Last time I was stuck I had to dig my car out of snow using a CD in my tee shirt. That tought me a lesson and now I have a spare coat, rope and a spade in my car. I class this as a survival kit for my environment.

As John pointed out, because your not expecting to be robbed does not mean you shoudnt have insurance.

 

[sandbender]

"...actually find themselves in a survival situation?.."

I have found myself in one.

Although I survived not because of any gear or kit that I had with me but because I was in the company of some bright, well trained folk who were equipped with an expedition sized medical kit, communications gear appropriate for the region and perhaps most importantly they had a prepared plan for what to do when everything went wrong.

Possibly the neatest and most practical personal survival kit I've yet seen is described by Pict in this post and this video.

And as he writes...

"...Items get lost or forgotten enough that it is always good to have a self contained PSK to give an extra layer of security..."

 

[MartiniDave]

Does laying in the bottom of a dive boat, with the start of the bends, breathing O2 count as a survival situation? If so then yes, I have.

 

[atross]

Interesting read this one, I initially started thinking about total end of the world stuff a but as I worked my way down the thread started to trigger an interesting thought process. Is there a difference between a survival kit or just being prepared for what you may face?

I think we live in a very safe society and it is interesting to see what happens when a few things change that. Last winter was a good example of this, the snow meant we were house bound for 2 weeks and for 4 of those days we had no power. Now my interests meant that actually this was no an issue, we cooked on the camp stove we were heated by the open fire and we could get to the supermarket due to the kit we had (winter clothing, rucksacks, winter boots and spikes). I always keep extra tins pasta rice long life milk, egg/milk/flower powder and this meant we only needed to walk to the shops on a couple of occasions (mainly as we had run out of wine!). My wife’s micky taking of my gear has changed a bit since then!

What i did find interesting was the utter panic buying that was happening in the super markets and some of the comments that I heard, couples literally rushing down the isles trying to load up on as much as possible!

I also carry a first aid kit with me at most times, i have a little pea lighter torch and syderco bug on my keychain. I have used all of theses frequently, what I carry when I am out and about has allowed me to help fellow walkers, campers and canoeists on numerous occasions. Even the knowledge has helped me, recently coming of Ben Nevis we were able to help a lady with a fractured ankle, we were able to recognize signs of shock and made her a lot more comfortable until Mountain rescue arrived, who were pleasantly surprised by what we had done. What did amaze me was the panic of people around her, and also who they had rung for help (the visitors centre which closes at 5, it was 6:30).

Mountain rescue were great, we bought one of their little pamphlets on the way back. What surprised all of us were the number of serious injuries and even fatalities caused by people being ill prepared for what they may face, one lady was recovered from the summit suffering from sever hypothermia due to summiting in a bikini!

I personally feel a little bit of preparation and a little knowledge can make a big difference to your outcomes, I am by no means an expert in anything but I do feel over protected by society and want to be able to look after myself if this fails. I prefer to refer to what I carry as preparedness kit as apposed to a survival kit, and I will adjust it to where ever I am.

 

[Paul_B]

Well I haven't been to wilderness areas or anywhere extreme (unless winter conditions in England, Wales and Scotland count). I don't carry a fishing kit, knife, wire saw or anything like that when I'm out. What I do is consider what I'm doing, where I'm doing it and when I'm doing it. It then take what I need for that. I don't take anything I don't need. I quite often go out without a first aid kit too. I do have a lot of knowledge and experience in the activities I do which I consider to be the most important piece of any "survival" kit. I have common sense and have so far been risk averse (for my skills) to avoidf major incident. I did get stuck on a a grassy ledge next to a scrambly, easy graded climb chimney once with a nasty injury that resulted in a blood soaked large ambulance dressing. MRT came for us but I was walking wounded and if they had taken any longer I would have buggered off unser my own steam. I did have a lovely couple of hours on some powerful painkillers that we perhaps should not have had access too watching the wildlife and people pottering in the valley below. I thoroughly enjoyed that day until I had to A) confront my parents and ask for a lift to the local A&E and B) hang around in the A&E from about 3pm to 2am!! Wish I'd stayed on the ledge.

Anyway, my point is NO. I don't expect myself to be in a survival situation. I do expect to be in some difficult situation in the future but I won't need to trap rabbits to survive as I'd just walk out. If I can't walk out then I am probably in a rescue situation. In that case it is a sit tight and survive situation so a Lofty Wiseman style survival tin would not be much use. It is Britain I'm in not some wilderness area days or weeks from help afterall. I do put stuff in the car in winter. It do back out of things if the conditions warrent it. I am quite happy being called a chicken by backing out if I feel the conditions warrent it. I do challenge myself but I know my limits. I have had injuries in the hills. I have crawled out of the hills unable to walk properly due to injury. I have had the onset of hypothermia more times than I can remember. I have always had the kit and the knowledge to sort myself out. That to me is as near to survival I will truly get. At the end of the day perhaps survival is just that, you survive. How you do it is not important and the gear you have to do it isn't neither. The knowledge and experience is the essence of survival in my book not a rabbit snare in the pocket. Sorry if I'm not bushcrafty enough but I come from the other outdoors camp - whitewater kayaking, mountaineering, hillwalking, etc. - so bushcraft is a new thing to me (prefer campcraft really). Its just another what if piece of knowledge. BTW I do think we all spend a period of learning, I was fortunate to learn through experience and the companionship of some very experienced friends over the years. A good apprenticeship. This was most evident in my whitewater kayaking.

 

[British Red]

Does laying in the bottom of a dive boat, with the start of the bends, breathing O2 count as a survival situation? If so then yes, I have.

Good point.

On a similar note if watching an arterial bleed hit the roof of a car, then so have I.

If finding a tree lying across the banks of an unlit road, on a blind bend, in the dark counts that makes 2...........

 

[Andy B]

Some great points and posts here.

Of course another point worth throwing into the mix is that of carrying a survival kit and never having practised with the items.

Training and knowledge is far more important than all the items in the world.

 

[Matt.S]

To me a 'survival situation' is one where my survival hangs in the balance. In good old overcrowded Britain that's unlikely to include having to improvise snares. Being benighted on a hillwalk or surprised by inclement weather could easily become a 'survival' issue though. Terrorist attack, chemical spill, awkward fall off an ATV, doesn't really matter. The emergancy services do very good work but I never assume that they will me immediately available and while I appreciate their being there the one time I had need of emergancy medical treatment (tumbled off a wall onto tarmac, cushioning the fall with my skull) I think it's a massively arrogant and false assumption that they will always be there.

Survival kit? Could include anything from a field dressing to a knife to an Epipen to a condom. However to be useful it has to relevant to you and your environment.

 

[Thecarotidpulse]

G'day Andy



As much as I hate the term "survival situation", I guess there is a possibility that I may encounter something other than an inconvenience.

Considering the wilderness areas I venture into (in nearly 30 + years, I have yet to see any sign of anyone else having been through the areas I frequent), there is a chance I may experience a medically related incident (especially a snake bite).

G'day Mick!
I think you've said it right there... When you go out in the brush, you go into areas that are well known to you, (almost 30+ years, is that the same thing as 30 years? You'd think the + and the almost would even out...) and you go in with thourough knowlege of the terrain, routes, and environment.
The only thing that can surprise you is injury, and someone experienced like you would always tell someone about where you were going.

A Survival situation is more where you're in an unfamiliar environment, and you become separated with the tools/gear that you would bring to actually accomplish your task be it travel or bushcraft.

I"m sure when you went to those I think South American countries and you met those Jungle guys with the Fallknivens (post a long time ago, forget which one)
you brought a little extra something along with your H1.

Perhaps there are also some Ego issues here which seem to be common among bushcrafters. "oh well I can make fire with a firebow, I don't need to carry a lighter"
"i do'nt need a survival kit, I carry everything I need in my head"
Those people that prefer to refer to a SK as a "possibles pouch". (though maybe Ive got the terms mixed).

When you fall through the ice it's time to break out the matches in the waterproof container and the Green Heat packets, heck (i'm going to get banned for this!) even throw gasoline on the wood!

p.s i'm not saying that you yourself have an ego issue, just saying that everyone becomes complacent to a certain degree.

 

[Conrad81]

I dont carry a survival kit on me as such. The way I see it, my sleeping bag and cooking pots etc are just as important to me as say a small tin with a signal mirror and a few fishing hooks. Anything that makes life more comfortable and gets you through another day is of use.
I would hope that I wouldn't find myself in a situation where I would be seperated from my bergen but if I do my knife is always on my belt and my firesteel around my neck. Anything else would need to be improvised. (including a knife and fire lighting kit if need be)

I think when it comes to survival, how you deal with the situation mentally is of more importance than how you deal with it physically. A sharp mind is perhaps your best tool in getting yourself out of a fix.

 

[_mark_]

I can only think of a survival situation in England being due to hypothermia/hyperthermia, serious injury or being lost, Scotland or Wales is, perhaps a little different. Whilst care to avoid hypothermia is second nature, people often neglect precautions for hyperthermia.

 

[Mastino]

In our world the only survivors that come to mind are homeless people in our cities. Every time I tend to observe their skills in finding security, shelter, food etc. under circumstances that are much more dangerous than any other in nature. IMO they are that great survivalists of our time.

 

[oldtimer]

I have a camper van, well equipped backpack, possibles pouch, and pocket kit. I can't count the times OTHER PEOPLE have had to rely on my kit- and often those who think I'm odd. It always gives me a laugh. I agree with Wayland- always a man of common sense- that all the things I carry are what I use in everyday life. However, I do have to watch out that superflous items don't creep into my pack. I carry out a regular audit and always before and after a trip. Duplication is the enemy. One time I checked those little items that "weigh nothing" including stuff sacks, they came to nearly a kilo. Survival situations do happen and age has a bearing. Last one was when my wife slipped on a remote trail in the Pyrenees and when you are over 70 this can be serious. Luckily we had only just set out and were able to stagger back to the trailhead. The Boy Scouts are right "Be Prepared" is a good motto. I've never been in a Survival situation in 60 years, but I've been in plenty that would have been had I not been properly equipped.

 

[demographic]

<Don's Nomex undercrackers>

Its the concept of ambling through a bit of woodland just off the A590 and calling it being "In the Bush" and needing several knives to survive it that kind of creases me up.
That's the part when I think that fantasy might just be getting a hold.

Lets face it, go onto any Landrover forum and there's one or two tin foil hatters. Go onto a Biodiesel forum and there's a few as well as one or two on here.
Struggling to be Army wanabee folk seem to have their fair share as well so I spot someone get out of a Landrover that smells of chip oil with a BCUK badge sewn into their M65 jacket I'll most likely avoid making eye contact with them for fear of the interminable conversation about how the worlds going to end and why we should hoard jellybeans.

That's not saying that everyone on here is like that mind as there's some very practical people on here and I really enjoy reading their stuff.

Having said that, I still have a decent warm jacket in my van, a shovel in winter and a few odds and sods that make it better if it breaks down.

 

[lucan]

I've had this conversation many a time, over a few beers with friends, There's one lad who always takes it to the extreme and starts the " Yeah cool, I can't wait for the End of the world".

I used to think that help was never that far away living in the U.K. But if you're out on a bimble somewhere and you haven't decided to take even the basics with you like water or something to munch on, People soon start to panic, The wife used to think i was mad taking a rucksack with odds n sods in, on the shortest of walks, But on a Scorching hot day, Even the most level headed people soon realise, a walk in the woods can be dangerous.

SWMBO, Once said to me, It's as though you're waiting for something to happen so you can use your "stuff", No, i've got it with me just in case.

When you see people trying to drag pushchairs round Dalby Forest, in nothing but t shirt and shorts, That scares me.

 

[swyn]

Great thread this!
I have a small backpack kit that lives in my vehicle and to date, luckily, I have not yet used it in anger, even though I now travel some miles between my work life and home life. I have reasoned that I will never be more that 24 hours from civilisation even in the terrible weather that has been hitting us recently and last year. Most of the stuff has been tried and tested over the years...That's the fun part. The serious part...Well I think I'm prepared, although not keen! Funny bit here though, as I see the day-glo coat as a seroius piece of my kit too! In certain situations you really need to be seen!
I still hold the 'First make a cup of tea' strategy as a very good example....Earl Grey or builders.....With honey too

Swyn.

 

[3bears]

I keep a small tin full of useful bits, but it's more a mini BC kit rather than a 'survival pack' despite having a lot of bits from a AMK kit. it's small and fits in my jacket pocket, I keep it hand as I'm not always carrying my BC bag on me but living on a small island there's always an opportunity to be 'crafty! when it comes surviving in the UK, well top of the list is a charged mobile phone! after that a space blanket, and a £20 note! I cant think of anywhere i've been in the UK where you're not 15 miles from a road, and roads mean people- it's not as if you've spent 3 days hiking without seeing or hearing a soul to get where you are here!

thread:

http://www.bushcraftuk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=66872&highlight=

 

[East Coaster]

By christ i hate to admit it, but,,,

A mobile phone is the best survival tool most of us would ever need (TEOTWAWKI and out of reception areas exepted)

 

[armie]

As a kid I read desert island survival stories (including 'Kidnapped' - my favourite), nowadays some urban event seems more likely to me, and I always imagine that I would break a leg or an arm in such a situation, rendering me and my 'survival experience' useless and making me a liability in stead of an asset...

 

[_scorpio_]

im not going to get in a "lost somewhere survival situation" in England. which is why all i have on me in a normal day is a little non locking knife.

when i might be in a "survival situation" is on holidays, anywhere from Scotland to Morocco.
i get round the problem of not having a knife to survive after a plane crash by never ever flying...ever.
when on any holiday i am going to cut up bits of wood at some point, even a weekend at a 5 star hotel i would still spot a brilliant bit of hawthorn for a walking stick or something, so i have at least a folding knife and laplander saw.
im going to morocco in april and i have a 2'x1.5'x1' box just for the bushy tools im taking. this is in anticipation of not one of the other 10 people bringing anything capable of sharpening a twig. not because i expect their lives to depend on it, but because if they think im chopping up all the firewood myself they are very wrong lol! its also because i like to have too many tools because i can in the car.

i have no real survival situation plan or anything, i carry a knife all the time because it doesnt feel right not to, just like i hate going out without a watch. if there is a chance of a situation where i would need to survive on my own, there is a much larger chance i would be dead rather than in that situation to be perfectly honest, so its not worth bothering with.