bushcrafters unite and buy land

[RonW]

I reckon you will need about 30 acres per family for that to be truly self sustaining. Probably nearer £500k per family. For 200 souls, say 4 to a family, thats 1,500 acres. Doable but a fair sized island.

30 acres?
I guess you mean that including woodland for hunting, firewood and building material? I regularly see estimates that say far less than 30, if you are only looking at foodproduction.
And no one can be truly self sustaining. You need a community for that.

As far as the original post is concerned; there already are such designated places. They're called campings.

 

[British Red]

30 acres includes fuel, winter fodder for stock, grains, hay, straw and all the rest. 10 acres would be pretty intensive for fuel alone. You would be surprised how many people buy in chicken food on their "self sustaining" place or Winter animal bedding, etc. 5-10 acres is, as you say enough for human food if you buy in the rest.

I think people can be self sustaining - just not self sufficient!

 

[Tony]

Ultimately one would be looking at a combination of self sustaining and living in the world, it would only become properly self sustaining and self sufficient if the world went to pot. I think there's always going to be the need for some income, especially as everything is taxed and there are some needs in this day and age that just need to be met. So a combination of money earning and haven is needed.

When it come to the 200 odd acres above near belfast (beautiful part of the world) i'd imagine that it will actually sell for far far more than that, we all get excited at the prospect of a good deal but when people start bidding on it reality is soon the winner and there's no way most of us could afford to even consider it.

Buying a big bulk of land, it's a great idea that we've been thinking about for years and when I say we I mean many of us on bushcraft uk, there's a few problems with it, I think the biggest one though is ownership, it would be really hard to have multiple owners of a big piece of land, there would be way too many opinions and issues raised and created by people involved.

There's the ongoing costs of managing a woodland have to be factored in etc etc It's really quite a complicated thing. I often look for woodland and it just goes up and up in cost, it's nuts but I suppose some people have taken advantage of the business opportunity.

The ideal would be people donate to a woodland fund (mine of course ) and then whence've enough money we buy one, or a few smaller ones and have a network of people that look after them, anyone that contributed gets to camp on them for a small fee (there's that ongoing costs issue again) and anyone else wanting to use them gets charged more.

 

[Brynglas]

A good example of this principle is the Dyfed Permaculture Farm Trust, they were neighbours of mine when I lived back in West Wales as my land adjoined theirs. They obtained a few acres and have farmed and developed it over the years. I suppose it's a sort of self sufficient co-operative. They sustain the trust by running volunteer days and workshops at their site in Penboyr. There is obviously a big commitment in terms of legislation and time etc. But they've managed to work the land effectively for a number of years and the wildlife and biodiversity they've managed to sustain is fantastic.

 

[Tony]

Yeah, that's a great example of how it can work, the issue is having that commitment, the whole thing bemuse the full time job of more than one person, then the land needs some sort of income, especially in the early days or if it's expanded (future investment).

Dont' get wrong anyone, I do think it's possible, it's just a case of the right people, the right land and the right time...

 

[Brynglas]

It's definitely a big commitment, and long term. Identifying the right plot to purchase and then the actual management of the woodland are obviously key but still a big undertaking. Great idea though.

Sent from my HTC One M9 using Tapatalk

 

[Swallow]

Buying a big bulk of land, it's a great idea that we've been thinking about for years and when I say we I mean many of us on bushcraft uk, there's a few problems with it, I think the biggest one though is ownership, it would be really hard to have multiple owners of a big piece of land, there would be way too many opinions and issues raised and created by people involved.

We would be talking shareholders in a Limited Company then?

 

[Brynglas]

Or possibly trustees of a charity.

 

[Post Tenebras Lux]

I've considered this too but as another member mentioned, what happens if/when someone wishes to sell their stake?

I looked at land recently and it was 3 acres of woodland(a plot in a larger woodland) and it was £19,000. That's ridiculous.

I'd love nothing more than to buy 30-50 acres and live as self-sufficient as possible, but there's no way I'd do it in the UK and land prices are a part of that problem.

The issue I'm facing most of all is the ability to move somewhere that it would be possible; i.e. Canada or somewhere in the U.S. where land is far, far cheaper.

 

[British Red]

I looked at land recently and it was 3 acres of woodland(a plot in a larger woodland) and it was £19,000. That's ridiculous.

Thats cheap. Empty fields go for £10k an acre here.

Its supply and demand. They keep packing more people on an overcrowded island. They aren't adding land though so it turns into a bidding war.

 

[Post Tenebras Lux]

Thats cheap. Empty fields go for £10k an acre here.

Its supply and demand. They keep packing more people on an overcrowded island. They aren't adding land though so it turns into a bidding war.

Well that's just it -- land is a commodity in increasingly short supply here compared to other places.

There's no way I could justify those prices for the land that was offered, anyway.

If I were someone that had their wits about them and skills I could market and sell workshops on the site then that's different because there would be some return.

 

[Swallow]

I've considered this too but as another member mentioned, what happens if/when someone wishes to sell their stake?

There's a lot of restrictions that can be written into the articles of association that lay down how the company is run. I think it could be written in that they can only sell their share

1. back to the rest of the shareholders
or
2. to someone approved by all the shareholders
or
3. to someone approved by the majority of shareholders

 

[Stevie777]

There's a lot of restrictions that can be written into the articles of association that lay down how the company is run. I think it could be written in that they can only sell their share

1. back to the rest of the shareholders
or
2. to someone approved by all the shareholders
or
3. to someone approved by the majority of shareholders

Or the land is passed down to family only for the use of bushcrafty activities. Or You could have in a contract that if a member decided he was selling up to a outsider for other purposes then the land could only be sold at something ludicrous like 1% of it's value. I would sign up to that knowing the land would always be in the family. Though i'm sure nothing is as simple as that.

 

[Swallow]

Or the land is passed down to family only for the use of bushcrafty activities. Or You could have in a contract that if a member decided he was selling up to a outsider for other purposes then the land could only be sold at something ludicrous like 1% of it's value. I would sign up to that knowing the land would always be in the family. Though i'm sure nothing is as simple as that.

I'm under the impression that it is as simple as that if you decide what it is you want and get a solicitor to write it in the articles properly.