Alternatives to ventile?

[slaine_23]

Are there any recommendations for alternatives to ventile?
It’s expensive material for a start and this article casts some of its credentials into doubt https://welldresseddad.com/2017/05/20/ventile-ugly-facts-they-dont-tell-you/
Does anyone know of an alternative material offering similar weatherproof qualities for breathable clothing projects?

 

[Laurentius]

It is all in the weave basically, I can remember back in the day gabardine being a thing, not sure what that is exactly but it is what they used to make macs out of. At the moment I am wearing wool as my outer layer. I have given over my ventile trousers for wool because that is more comfortable when it is soaking wet.

 

[slaine_23]

Interesting. Gabardine was suggested today in a fabric shop as an alternative - they’d not heard of ventile (it’s a brand not a type of material) but mentioned it when I said the purpose. Am hoping to make a smock out of wool but have some doubts about its wind proofing.

 

[Nice65]

Are there any recommendations for alternatives to ventile?
It’s expensive material for a start and this article casts some of its credentials into doubt https://welldresseddad.com/2017/05/20/ventile-ugly-facts-they-dont-tell-you/
Does anyone know of an alternative material offering similar weatherproof qualities for breathable clothing projects?

That’s an informative read, thanks for backing up your post with it.

My Keela Falkland is ancient, been washed several times, and good as gold in the wet. So the cotton is doing what it’s supposed to do, and swell. I doubt very much any of the original coating remains, a raindrop sinks in immediately.

But it’s a sod to dry, and it’s just been removed as main waterproof in the campervan for that reason. But the replacement is either a plastic mac or my Paramo Halcon. The Paramo is supposed to be ethically ok, I don’t have such a link as yours, but it also wets out and as such I have a condensation and long drying process. I know there’s the sweat argument with plastics, but I watched a lot of videos of people using a Snugpak poncho for long walks. One old guy had his for years and reckoned he’d hiked 1000s of miles.

 

[slaine_23]

I suppose a poncho has more airflow and might be a reason its not so sweaty? Leads to theory of wool layer for warmth with poncho outer shell which could be a true waterproof fabric and forget about worrying about breathability. Not a particularly new idea I know.

Wonder if a stink free lanolin as a proofer would work but suspect it’s the cause of the reputed stink of Italian surplus wool blankets.

 

[Nice65]

If you’re looking to make a smock then perhaps we’re a bit at cross purposes here, but no harm in thinking about alternatives. Ventile, waxed cotton or plastic fabric won’t breathe when wet. Totally waterproof outer layer is fabric of choice for fishermen and sailors, and trawler men work long and hard in theirs. I’ll find that video for you of the poncho guy, he has a healthy if it ain’t broke don’t fix it kind of attitude. Part of it is pick something that is going to keep you dry no matter what because wet = misery. I know of nothing made from wool that is waterproof and windproof.

 

[slaine_23]

Thanks for the links Mr Nice, interesting and I think advice worth heeding.

As for the smock, am thinking of the smock/anorak/cagoule - rather than the zipped up jacket - more like a half zip hoodie. I have a rain coat which is respectable enough looking walking down the shops, not always that great in the wind/rain of north west Ireland winter nor the forest when foraging mushrooms, and terrible round a fire. As I don’t want advice to buy some mad priced gear (Very expensive coat 560 eur?!) making one, or trying to, makes sense. Which leads down the rabbit hole of the right material to use.

 

[TLM]

I know of nothing made from wool that is waterproof and windproof.

Well, this answer is slightly semantic but not totally. Wet wool coat is quite windproof, have tested it enough times. It is "water proof" in the sense that once it is totally wet it does not let much water trough. Weights a ton though.

"Breathing water proof" wet fabric does not exist because once it is wet that water blocks any out going moisture from going out.

The physics of water (as gas) transfer in clothes seems to be a recurring subject a few times a year. Nothing odd or bad in that but it has been explained by various persons here many times, maybe we should have a sticky on the subject with some pointers to the better articles on the net.

A short: almost all of the various "breathable" films work when the outer fabric is dry but as that is not really the weather they are made for that is a moot point.

 

[Nice65]

Thanks for the links Mr Nice, interesting and I think advice worth heeding.

As for the smock, am thinking of the smock/anorak/cagoule - rather than the zipped up jacket - more like a half zip hoodie. I have a rain coat which is respectable enough looking walking down the shops, not always that great in the wind/rain of north west Ireland winter nor the forest when foraging mushrooms, and terrible round a fire. As I don’t want advice to buy some mad priced gear (Very expensive coat 560 eur?!) making one, or trying to, makes sense. Which leads down the rabbit hole of the right material to use.

I had a No 8 and it’s not in the slightest bit waterproof, only the shoulders are treated, there’s a ton of work to get that to UK wet weather standard, it’s for dry snow, and you’re paying for the name. They do look fantastic though, so you’ll be cool, and wet.

You’d have liked the Twodogs stuff, he was a member here but stopped making. I had one of his in brown waxed cotton and while it was a pain to get on and off, it never leaked. Twodogs Stormdog I think it was called. You could look him up for ideas?

 

[Tengu]

I have s Titantex fishermans smock. A lot cheaper than ventile

 

[slaine_23]

I had a No 8 and it’s not in the slightest bit waterproof, only the shoulders are treated, there’s a ton of work to get that to UK wet weather standard, it’s for dry snow, and you’re paying for the name. They do look fantastic though, so you’ll be cool, and wet.

You’d have liked the Twodogs stuff, he was a member here but stopped making. I had one of his in brown waxed cotton and while it was a pain to get on and off, it never leaked. Twodogs Stormdog I think it was called. You could look him up for ideas?

Ha! Yes indeed it looks cool but so expensive I’d have to frame it.
Remarkable the amount of gear that doesn’t seem to deal with rain like currently fashionable carharrt - can be cool, hard wearing, good in cold, crap in rain.
Will dig around for mr two dogs thanks.

 

[slaine_23]

Well, this answer is slightly semantic but not totally. Wet wool coat is quite windproof, have tested it enough times. It is "water proof" in the sense that once it is totally wet it does not let much water trough. Weights a ton though.

"Breathing water proof" wet fabric does not exist because once it is wet that water blocks any out going moisture from going out.

The physics of water (as gas) transfer in clothes seems to be a recurring subject a few times a year. Nothing odd or bad in that but it has been explained by various persons here many times, maybe we should have a sticky on the subject with some pointers to the better articles on the net.

A short: almost all of the various "breathable" films work when the outer fabric is dry but as that is not really the weather they are made for that is a moot point.

Another rabbit hole to journey down, “The physics of water (as gas) transfer in clothes“.
Am not sure I want to after just a brief foray .
Those links might be of use of you’d happen to have them handy? Either to web or the forums.

 

[demographic]

I have a single layer Ventile anorak (Tilak Odin) a d have to say that in the chucking down rain I have been significantly underwhelmed by it's performance.
It's a nice garment, great in the wind and relatively well vented, but when its wet its pretty gash.

 

[Herman30]

Fabric made of 65% polyester 35% cotton is fairly rain resistable (and breathable) if it is coated with DWR (durable water repellent). I know this by experience having smock of that fabric with DWR. So you could say it is poor man´s ventile as garments made of this fabric is lower in price than ventile.

 

[Laurentius]

Wool can be windproof if it is a felted fabric like loden. When I was little I was sent to school in all weathers in a trusty duffle coat, with the hood up that saw me through the winter of 1963.

 

[slaine_23]

Am considering to use a felted blanket as material for bushcraft shirt/anorak type of thing, couple with outer layer of something more waterproof, to mix old and new.

 

[TLM]

having smock of that fabric with DWR

That kind works on a pristine treatment but DWR tends to wear off and some of them are kind of toxic (fluorocarbon ones), various waxes and greases are much better in that respect but not as effective.

(Sigh) so I guess we just have to go on covering ourselves with lotus or carnauba palm leaves ...

 

[Falstaff]

When I started on sites in the Severnties we got the wollen Donkey Jackets with padded lining given to us. They were great, wore mine everywhere. I don't remember getting wet when wearing it, the water sort of ran off of it, lanolin oils perhaps.

 

[slaine_23]

Like a swimmer one could lather one’s self in goose fat thereby being both warm and waterproof.

 

[slaine_23]

When I started on sites in the Severnties we got the wollen Donkey Jackets with padded lining given to us. They were great, wore mine everywhere. I don't remember getting wet when wearing it, the water sort of ran off of it, lanolin oils perhaps.

There was fashion for donkey jackets in the 80s, some of them with a shiny waterproof layer on the shoulders, DoE (Dept of Env) jackets we called them as all the lads on the roads wore them.

They’re still out there though god knows what part of the donkey this coat was made from -

WOOL DONKEY JACKET

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