Advice for 16 year old buying a lock knife?

[Telemarkmike]

Hello,

I'm looking for a bit of advice. My son is 16 and looking for a new folding knife. He wants a quality knife and is sold on Spyderco, partly the name and look but he has also done a lot of research and appreciates the quality of their build and action of the compression lock. He is fairly set on the Para 3. My concern is this, being non uk legal, he will feel constrained with the amount that he can carry/use the knife and it will sit at home more often than not.
He is concerned with the safety of a slip joint knife and therefore not so keen on the ukpk.

At the minute he has various (quality and brand) knifes ranging from his first knife which is a tiny, beautifully hand made Scandinavian tool, a gerber, mora all three fixed. Plus he regularly carries an opinel 8 (I know this is also not uk legal but it is avery different beast to a para 3).

How many of you regularly carry/use a non uk legal knife? What have been your experiences good or bad?

Thanks in advance

 

[Herman30]

This I will follow with interest.

 

[Wildgoose]

This is always a popular subject on here.

the term non legal isn’t strictly correct. A flick knife, butterfly knife or disguised knife is not legal in public full stop.
A lock knife is legal to carry in certain circumstances such as work or camping.

I choose not to carry locking knives as it’s not worth the grief. I’ve used plenty for work and the outdoors but having to have a good excuse isn’t worth the hassle for me.
Others will disagree

 

[The puffin squire]

Doesn't matter what your carrying tbh if you haven't a decent reason for having it, any 16 Yr old with a pocket knife in an urban area if stopped will have it confiscated. In the woods completely different scenerio. Simply if your in town don't carry

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

 

[Nice65]

Carrying a lock knife doesn’t really bother me generally as I live rurally. I’m sure your son is a responsible person, but a 55yr old ex-tree surgeon living in the countryside is different from a 16yr old lad. Many times I’ve been into shops in my work clothes, forgetting I have a locker in my pocket, it’s easily done. That said, the knife in my pocket is a UKPK, the red handled one from Heinnie Haynes. There’s no way with the strength of the spring and the finger choil this knife is ever going to close on me. Don’t forget this knife was designed not so much by Spyderco, but knife enthusiasts on British Blades amongst others. Sal basically built exactly what we wanted, keeping the blade a teasing 1/16” under 3”.

I‘ve had this in my pocket daily for months despite owning a Para2, a couple of Benchmade Griptilians, and a whole load of other locking knives. I think he ought to give it his consideration.

 

[C_Claycomb]

Telemarkmike,

I have not had any recent legal experiences, good or bad, I had a scar when I was in university, but that was 22 years ago. I have tried very hard not to have any experiences with the law and sharp tools. I have had friends who have had conversations with police and their descriptions have made me think it is something to avoid. So much can depend upon where you are in the country, when it is, the officer involved, how you present yourself...so many variables. The experience of a 40 year old in rural Wales may have very little in common with that of a 20 year old just outside Birmingham.

I may have a different take on matters than your son. I got my first knife, a pocket knife, when I was 6 years old, and got the Swiss Army knife that I still carry when I was eight (I am now in my 40s). I think that the first knives that one should have are the ones that one can use most of the time. I would strongly recommend a good slip joint. I am very impressed with the Boker Plus Tech Tool1.

The UK law is that a 16 year old can carry a sub 3 inch non-locking knife. I can't say what would happen with police, but if you were out camping, walking, whatever, then stopped for pizza on the way home, there would be no legal problem with someone disagreeing with your "good reason" as there could be with a locking knife. If you go to an area of countryside that you do not have permission to shoot, camp or perform bushcraft on, it is debatable whether you have a "good reason" for having a locking/fixed knife. I like having a knife, I feel naked without one, but I like not having to think about my legal status all the time too.

The Para3 is sized as a legal carry knife in places where locks are fine, but blade length is limited to 3 inches. This makes it rather a pointless choice in the UK where the presence of the lock makes blade length irrelevant. A 3.25 or 3.375" is a much more useful length for hunting, camping and such things...it really makes a difference.

Spyderco knives are in general have flat handles sized for easy carry all the time. Blade shapes are often made for "utility" or self defence, which may or may not happen to be good for the outdoor tasks that tend to legitimise the carry of a locking knife in the UK. By contrast, Benchmade have more models that have blades that are shaped well for food prep and game prep, along with handles that work in a full fist carving grip. Spyderco certainly make very good quality knives, but care needs to be taken in what and why and whether the features will work.

For instance, I once had a 4" Cold Steel Voyager folder. The AUS8 was easy to get very sharp with my sharpening gear, but the angle of the tip was poor for field dressing small game, the hollow/sabre grind wasn't good for food prep or carving, the length was a bit much, and the flat handle was great for carrying but was uncomfortable for heavy carving.

Another thing, right now US made knives are more expensive than similar quality European made knives. I have been very impressed by Lion Steel and Viper.

I have had two UKPKs, and my 70+ year old mother has one too. For utility and camping they are good and holding with the choil makes them save. Sure, locking is better/safer, but I find fewer and fewer situations where I am confident in carrying my lock knives. I am now carrying a Lion Steel Thrill most of the time.

 

[gra_farmer]

Carrying a lock knife doesn’t really bother me generally as I live rurally. I’m sure your son is a responsible person, but a 55yr old ex-tree surgeon living in the countryside is different from a 16yr old lad. Many times I’ve been into shops in my work clothes, forgetting I have a locker in my pocket, it’s easily done. That said, the knife in my pocket is a UKPK, the red handled one from Heinnie Haynes. There’s no way with the strength of the spring and the finger choil this knife is ever going to close on me. Don’t forget this knife was designed not so much by Spyderco, but knife enthusiasts on British Blades amongst others. Sal basically built exactly what we wanted, keeping the cutting edge a teasing 1/16” under 3”.

I‘ve had this in my pocket daily for months despite owning a Para2, a couple of Benchmade Griptilians, and a whole load of other locking knives. I think he ought to give it his consideration.

View attachment 59158

Agree, very good option, I will throw in the Manly Wasp to the mix too, strong slip joint with 4 stops, very unlikely to close on you in use

 

[HorsetoWater]

There are a good number of UK friendly knives and compared to even 5 years ago you have a great choice of steels, mechanisms and styles. From friction folders, slipjoints, integral detent mechanisms, to integral backsprings... Steels from CPM30v, M390, CPM 20v, D2, K390, Niolox, s110v, n690co... Full flat, drop point, spear point, warncliffe...

It's a buyers market now. Whilst a non-locking blade is never going to provide you the absolute (relative) security a locking mechanism will it will provide much of the day-to-day cutting performance needed in general situations. Personally (and this isn't legal advice lol) I've always taken the law to excuse camping cutlery but in these cases I tend to take a field fixed blade instead (which is kept on a lockbox in the car when not in use). Although I have some pretty aggressive lockers such as the ZT0562 and some of Benchmade's axis assist mechanisms these will never see the light of public company and are reserved for use on my private land which fortunately does include a small wooded area. I would never take the risk for myself or others in taking out one of the non-legal folders (or fixed blades outside of camping).

Attached are most of my UK legal collection, most of these are still available to purchase. A couple are customs. If any catch your eye and you are unsure what they are just let me know and I'll tell you!

Best of luck with the search - and enjoy the journey - this is one of the best aspects of tool purchasing - the choosing!

edited for spelling, photo link bbcode

 

[Herman30]

@HorsetoWater What is the second from left? I like the blade form.

 

[HorsetoWater]

@HorsetoWater What is the second from left? I like the blade form.

@Herman30 That is a Jan Dox custom friction folder. D2 steel, 2.99" cutting, blade shape is based on "Higonokami" style. G10 scales. Nice hard use piece. I got that in c.2015 and I believe he has improved his fit & finish since as well. Solid heat treat. Nice guy to deal with in Belgium. He mailed it to Scotland. Doxblades.com

 

[santaman2000]

@HorsetoWater What is the second from left? I like the blade form.

It looks like a tanto blade doesn’t it?

 

[Herman30]

It looks like a tanto blade doesn’t it?

No, sheepsfoot if I´m not mistaken. Or perhaps wharncliffe.

 

[SaraR]

DH has a little (2.5-2.75" I think) non-locking spyderco and it's stood up to daily use for years without any problems, so I wouldn't worry about it folding up while in us.

For a 16 year old, in the UK, today, I wouldn't even think about pushing his luck by carrying anything but the most law-abiding you can get. And even then I'd be selective about when it's carried. Not "right" but sensible.

 

[Toddy]

I like my spydercos but there's no getting away from the fact that they look somewhat aggressive. It's the only knife that I have worked with in public and a teenage boy asked me if it was, 'scuse the Scots, "A guid chib". It's the vaguely terradactyle kind of beak and eye to it I think.
That alone makes folks look twice or thrice.

A chib in that sense is a handweapon.

 

[Broch]

Excuse my ignorance on this, at one time I though I understood it all, but aren't those Spyderco's one-hand opening as well - isn't there a restriction on that classification?

There are plenty of very good knives out there that are not locking; I wouldn't dream of letting a teenager carry one in this day and age. Apart from the attitude of the law I would worry about the reaction of his peers.

The right tool for the right job and there's limited risk; in over fifty years of carrying and using knives I have had one close on me once and that was because I was lazy and didn't go get the right tool.

However, good luck trying to persuade him

 

[SaraR]

I like my spydercos but there's no getting away from the fact that they look somewhat aggressive. It's the only knife that I have worked with in public and a teenage boy asked me if it was, 'scuse the Scots, "A guid chib". It's the vaguely terradactyle kind of beak and eye to it I think.
That alone makes folks look twice or thrice.

A chib in that sense is a handweapon.

That's my one reservation about them too. I've got an EDC that looks more like an old school pocket knife and nobody ever comments on that whereas the spyderco do get raised eyebrows despite being smaller.

 

[Fadcode]

Just a comment on the title of the thread, if a knife is "non UK legal", then the definitive answer is Do not carry it.
Also because a knife is tagged as EDC, does not mean it is legal to carry it in the UK, the Laws on carrying knives is quite explicit and should be studied.
One other point the OP should take into consideration, is that it is illegal to buy a knife for someone under 18, even as a gift , and it is a criminal offence if you do, unless the particular knife is allowed under the Law.

 

[C_Claycomb]

Excuse my ignorance on this, at one time I though I understood it all, but aren't those Spyderco's one-hand opening as well - isn't there a restriction on that classification?

....

It seems that one handed openers have not been targeted by the newer legislation. Flippers very possibly so, and spring assisted, most certainly.

 

[Corso]

Excuse my ignorance on this, at one time I though I understood it all, but aren't those Spyderco's one-hand opening as well - isn't there a restriction on that classification?

Nope otherwise nail nicks and thumbstuds would be illegal too, it would have to open it automatically to make it illegal.

moving a blade with your thumb to open the blade is not illegal whether you use one hand or two

 

[Corso]

it is illegal to buy a knife for someone under 18, even as a gift

citation please? As far as I can find its only illegal to sell a knife (unless it has a folding blade 3 inches long (7.62 cm) or less) to someone under 18?