whats the fascination with weight?

[Christy]

Middle aged, overweight female with backproblems. Very sure weight matters.
In the time when fitness came naturally, carrying a heavy load didn't matter.
Now every gram counts.
And I wish I'd known this 20 year ago so my back wouldn't have gotten the blows it did get.

 

[BlueTrain]

Forgive me but of all the outdoor writers I can think of, Ray Jardine is the only one who irritates me. He is a dogmatic know-it-all who makes anyone who not a disciple of his to be a fool. The Ray Way is not The Way. At least it's not my way.

I've got old stuff and I've got new stuff. Neither is necessarily better. My most comfortable pack up to a point was made in 1942. It's a US Army mountain rucksack. It would be difficult to overload. With anything larger, the temptation is there. I still use it for "training," meaning weekend hikes with it loaded. I'm 67 and my hips and knees are still fine. Depending on what boots I'm wearing, my feet and ankles are okay but some result in "hot feet," like the soles of my feet are on fire. They used to feel like that in folk dancing (RSCDS style). Ironically, I think my heaviest boots are the most comfortable but I suppose the trail you might take has a bearing on the subject. I nearly always do a little wading on my outings. But as the saying goes, it isn't the weight, it's the way you carry it.

I obsess with lists. That is mostly because it is inexplicably easy to forget something essential. On the other hand, that allows you to discover how unessential any given piece of equipment really is. Remember when you were little and you ran around as far as you were allowed with nothing more than the clothes on your back? Now it seems people walk around the office carrying a water bottle and never leave home without a survival kit for when the North Koreans invade. I have to admit falling for that mindset, too. I've got a half-dozen good knives (none are "too" good, however) but I manage to go to the woods and return alive without needing them.

 

[Jonbodthethird]

Surely this is the awesome thing about bushcraft?! There is no correct or proper way (other than the obvious) to go out and enjoy the wilderness?!


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[ozzy1977]

Easiest way to loose weight, isn't with titanium and cuban fibre but slimming down the belly,

 

[andybysea]

I always used tough basic gear all year round, but in the last year started buying the ultra light kit as ive been doing some 30 and 50 milers and the differance the light weight gear gives you is amazing, im sticking to it(well expanding it) for my long walks, and keeping the standard gear for beach and woods camping.I also agree with with what rg598 say's if you use the gear how your meant to and look after it the ultra light stuff works and last really well.

 

[copper_head]

I always used tough basic gear all year round, but in the last year started buying the ultra light kit as ive been doing some 30 and 50 milers and the differance the light weight gear gives you is amazing, im sticking to it(well expanding it) for my long walks, and keeping the standard gear for beach and woods camping.I also agree with with what rg598 say's if you use the gear how your meant to and look after it the ultra light stuff works and last really well.

I agree Andy.
Another thing people seem to automatically assume is that taking the light weight approach also means spending loads of cash. But really its about considering what you genuinely need rather than the creature comforts and multiple fail-safes.
While you certainly can spend a fortune on getting the lightest kit possible you certainly don't have too. I've got my hiking gear down to around 10kg now, which is generally considered lightweight, and other than a titanium mug (£14) there is nothing particularly specialised or ott expensive.

 

[ozzy1977]

A little while ago I was looking on an ultralight backpacking forum, the sort of loons that live on polo's and sleep in plastic bags, one bloke who was considered an authority on such things recomended taking sleeping pills if an uncomfortable night was predicted mainly due to useing totally unsuitable gear.

 

[Andy BB]

Fascinating thread!

Only time I worry about weight is if I'm carrying a load of cold-weather stuff on a flight! However, having said that, one of my most prized possessions is a Seekoutside 8-man tipi and titanium stove including 10 ft of stovepipe - total weight 11lbs (5kg), so I guess I'm as guilty as the next man!

Unless I'm on an extended trip, I'll take as much stuff as I need to keep me comfy and give me some toys to play with - and if that means several trips from car to camp with a wheelbarrow - so what? And if one of the toys I'm playing with is a fan-driven or gasifier stove, I might well - indeed have - taken cat-litter pellets to try out. (In fact I seem to remember one camp comparing the relative efficiencies of different types of cat litter/wood pellets in various stoves - eh Paul!) Similarly, I'll also used compressed-wood logs I brought in for my stove.

But, as has been said - it's horses for courses. I can see the sense in keeping kit ultra-light if there is a serious hike involved, as long as safety aspects are factored in. To me, it doesn't appeal, primarily because I'm getting on and various sport injuries mitigate against an Everest climb! And, if truth be told, I like my comfort too much to put up with the sacrifices needed - I'll leave that to the kids

 

[RonW]

And I am sure it also has to do with showing off the bling. The mine's bigger, prettier, what ever than yours. Or trying to identify oneselve with a certain type of outdooractivities or -group. Might not be a conscience decision, though.

 

[ozzy1977]

11lb for that lot, my canvas tarp weighs 7lb and its only 7'x9'

 

[copper_head]

And I am sure it also has to do with showing off the bling. The mine's bigger, prettier, what ever than yours. Or trying to identify oneselve with a certain type of outdooractivities or -group. Might not be a conscience decision, though.

I'm not sure I agree with that. My lightweight gear is mostly cobbled together and the majority of it is modded cheap gear. I seriously doubt anyone would look at my gear and get envious of it.

 

[Clouston98]

And I am sure it also has to do with showing off the bling. The mine's bigger, prettier, what ever than yours. Or trying to identify oneselve with a certain type of outdooractivities or -group. Might not be a conscience decision, though.

I'd also have to disagree to an extent. I buy nice gear because I like it and enjoy using it, not to impress others . However that doesn't mean some people aren't show offs though.

Edit: I forgot to say my gear is not lightweight, it's old school canvas and leather .

 

[Andy BB]

11lb for that lot, my canvas tarp weighs 7lb and its only 7'x9'

...which is why its my pride and joy Carbon-fibre centre-pole helps too - if its good enough for the F-22, its good enough for me! THe Ti stove and pipe have a drawback over the cast-iron stuff, inasmuch it won't retain heat for too long. The plus side is that - within 5 minutes of lighting, the tent is 70degrees warmer than the outside (that's Fahrenheit!).

 

[Big Stu 12]

Easiest way to loose weight, isn't with titanium and cuban fibre but slimming down the belly,

Funny you should say that, a few guys I know are always trying to cut weight of kit, as they say their knees are knackered, and the backs are knackered... but they are over weight and unfit..getting fitter and losing weight would help more then a few grams on kit

I know I am a large guy but hey I was massively over weight and have lost about 6 stone so think I can say something...

 

[ex-member BareThrills]

Kit is like condoms, featherlight works, extrasafe works, they all do the job in hand

The only time kit weighs too much is when you need to carry it and you cant heft it. Other than that, enjoy your camping and use what makes you happy.

Look not on a mans kit but on the warmth of their company

 

[andybysea]

RonW I must say i dont consciously or otherwise buy lightweight gear to show off, yes ive got some thats expensive but ive got some heavy weight kit thats expensive also, i buy it because having walked long distances in a day (30+miles) with both i can state i feel alot better having worn the lightwieght kit,especially in my traps area, and to be honest some of the kit performs better than the heavy weight kit,so why carry what weighs more for less or the same performance?? thats not showing off thats common sense.

 

[Drain Bamaged]

Each to their own, I go out to enjoy myself and try to stay safe (and not just my own safety) when doing so, if I want to cause myself pain and discomfort I can achieve that without even leaving the house. What I do find annoying though is those that lighten everything off for their own comfort but always remember to carry a mobile phone just in case they do happen to get to cold, wet, hungry or lost so they can call for someone with the correct gear for the job to come and get them.

 

[rg598]

I find that both safety and fashion have little to do with the weight issue. You can be just as safe regardless of the weight of your pack. There are right ways to do it, and there are wrong ways to do it. For every person who has to call for help because they didn't bring enough gear, there is another that never got further than the parking lot because he couldn't lift his gear.

Similarly, with fashion, the factors cancel themselves out. For every person who goes ultralight to impress his friends, there is another decked out in wool and canvas to impress his friends.

All of those things cancel each other out. There are people who do stupid tings, who are unprepared, who lack the knowledge, or who are buying gear to look the part, regardless of whether we are talking about someone going ultralight, or super heavy. Ultimately it comes down to the practical considerations: if you have to carry your gear over long distances, then weight matters a lot; if you don't then it doesn't matter.

 

[Paul_B]

Wow! Weight polarises people i think.

How modern is this lightweight lark anyway? Is he called Oetzl? The iceman with an uber light kit. Or the guy posing on the front cover of the great outdoors magazine with a Karrimor tent weighing sub-1kg having used it on an interesting trip in winter i think. That cover was one of the earliest issues too! The trouble is we have fashions in outdoors kit as much as anything. 80s thro 90s kit got heavy as more features got added. Such as extraneous straps, buckles or over specced fabrics. They went from 1 to 2kg for expedition sack to 4kg in some cases with no real benefit. Extra padding adds confort right? Well take the 500g weight penalty for that, add the odd extra 200g here and there. Do the same with all your gear youll be better off right?
I get kit i need, leave what i dont behind. I have a safe, secure and comfortable night out that i enjoy every moment of. Including lifting my 5kg, tiny pack up in the morning. I feel as fresh at the end of the day as the beginning. All safe.
It does wind me up when people view small, light packs as inherently less safe than the heavy loads some carry. Take Everest kit, i read somewhere that Irvine & Mallory used kit lighter than some modern Everest summitters wear. That was used on many Himalayan expeds before the last one which was not gear related failure.
I just think ppl should look to their own gear. You know what youre happy with. It takes experience gained by being out there to get your own gear sorted. Why impose your gear on others? Why should i get disapproving looks or comments for my kit that works very well for me? Ive earnt my spurs, know my stuff and been through enough suffering with heavy packs. Now i enjoy my trips. I also walk the Lakes in fell shoes in harshest of winters and go solo too! Ive only once been in a party who called mrt out once. That time it was with a heavy packed traditionalist whod done knees in needing help. I walked off, after a few dressings of wounds but thats a different story.
I carry a mobile to take photos, call friends, text and generally keep in touch with family/friends. Just like at home. Its a 115g weight penalty, hardly much extra to carry compared to the 2500g penalty with my old rucksack over my newest one. I never use it for mrt and if i did it would have to be serious reason. That reason is as likely to affect heavy pack guy as uber light backpack whippet. Accidents dont know what weight your gear is. To equate gear weight with safety and mrt call outs is ridiculous. Its knowledge and experience, lack of that has bigger effect. Or just bad luck.

 

[Paul_B]

Ive had one hill accident in 30 + years being out there and i walked off. Gear never had any relation to that and one of our team was a retired mrt member with over 15 years service. Didnt stop the accident affecting more than just me.