Using a trail cam at -25C ?
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Try to ask Bushnell. Three things come to mind
1. The lubricant among moving parts (shutter, etc) may gel as it was not meant for cold WX.
2. The chemical reactions in batteries are cut in half for each 10C change in temp. From 0C to -20C should cut performance down to 25%.
3. When you bring the camera indoors, straight into a sealed plastic bag to warm up. Otherwise, every cold surface inside the camera will
suck up and condense moisture. We do the same with cold guns in winter hunting = they stay in the cases for a couple of hours.
Years ago, my Dad had an analog camera modified for -40C. (Two sandwiches short of a picnic, I know). Besides the low temp silicone lube,
they(?) rigged the battery pack with long leads so he had that inside his coat.
1. The lubricant among moving parts (shutter, etc) may gel as it was not meant for cold WX.
2. The chemical reactions in batteries are cut in half for each 10C change in temp. From 0C to -20C should cut performance down to 25%.
3. When you bring the camera indoors, straight into a sealed plastic bag to warm up. Otherwise, every cold surface inside the camera will
suck up and condense moisture. We do the same with cold guns in winter hunting = they stay in the cases for a couple of hours.
Years ago, my Dad had an analog camera modified for -40C. (Two sandwiches short of a picnic, I know). Besides the low temp silicone lube,
they(?) rigged the battery pack with long leads so he had that inside his coat.
Thats what I was thinking, chemical hand warmers is a good idea.
I dont want to do anything too complicated.
i've had mine down at -10 with no probe apart from short batt life. dare i ask where you are planning to use it?
but i reckon Robsons idea of asking Bushnell directly would be a good plan, failing that, try WildlifeKate, lady who does a lot of filming for autumn watch, i know she has very close ties with Bushnell.
but i reckon Robsons idea of asking Bushnell directly would be a good plan, failing that, try WildlifeKate, lady who does a lot of filming for autumn watch, i know she has very close ties with Bushnell.
Most batteries are pretty useless at very low temperatures, I'd be thinking in terms of some sort of a heated box or you'll get barely an hour out of your AAs.
For good insulation it will be a big box, but it probably doesn't need to be high-tech and insulation almost by definition is light.
A plastic crate from a pound shop for example, maybe using something like scraps of polystyrene sheet or polyester sleeping bag fill for the insulation.
The heat source could be things like those hand warmers with a little clicky thing inside that you boil up when they've solidified, but that would only give you a few hours at best.
You could try something like the Zippo hand warmers, they last well over half a day - but they'd need to be isolated somehow from the camera in its box, and the box would have to be vented, as burning the fuel both uses up oxygen and creates water.
That would probably be the lightest way of doing it, and cheap enough.
A hot water bottle is probably simplest, but heavy, bulky and again only good for a few hours at best. It depends how well you insulate the box.
For long term heating you'll need something like electrical power from the grid, or from a power source which either could cope with the temperatures or didn't have to. For example bury a car battery in (a box in) the ground under deep snow and the temperature could be quite a bit higher.
A decent lead-acid battery at around 0 degrees C could give you 10 Watts for a couple of days, plenty to keep a little camera warm if it's well insulated. You could run the camera from it too with a little effort, Maplin will probably have something on the shelf for that.
Of course this is getting more complex, and you'd have the issues of the weight and bulk of the battery, and recharging it. Not to mention destroying it by freezing the electrolyte if it gets too cold when it's partially discharged. When fully charged it won't freeze even at much lower temperatures than you're considering.
Hopefully you won't be lugging this stuff about on foot.
For good insulation it will be a big box, but it probably doesn't need to be high-tech and insulation almost by definition is light.
A plastic crate from a pound shop for example, maybe using something like scraps of polystyrene sheet or polyester sleeping bag fill for the insulation.
The heat source could be things like those hand warmers with a little clicky thing inside that you boil up when they've solidified, but that would only give you a few hours at best.
You could try something like the Zippo hand warmers, they last well over half a day - but they'd need to be isolated somehow from the camera in its box, and the box would have to be vented, as burning the fuel both uses up oxygen and creates water.
That would probably be the lightest way of doing it, and cheap enough.
A hot water bottle is probably simplest, but heavy, bulky and again only good for a few hours at best. It depends how well you insulate the box.
For long term heating you'll need something like electrical power from the grid, or from a power source which either could cope with the temperatures or didn't have to. For example bury a car battery in (a box in) the ground under deep snow and the temperature could be quite a bit higher.
A decent lead-acid battery at around 0 degrees C could give you 10 Watts for a couple of days, plenty to keep a little camera warm if it's well insulated. You could run the camera from it too with a little effort, Maplin will probably have something on the shelf for that.
Of course this is getting more complex, and you'd have the issues of the weight and bulk of the battery, and recharging it. Not to mention destroying it by freezing the electrolyte if it gets too cold when it's partially discharged. When fully charged it won't freeze even at much lower temperatures than you're considering.
Hopefully you won't be lugging this stuff about on foot.
Dave, if it's your intention to pull this stunt on you upcoming Canadian 2016 trip, you have to make a detatchable battery pack.
-25C is really chilly. That can freeze your cojones, OK? While the camera will have to sleep outside, you can keep the battery pack warm with no problems.
Anybody who can help you with low temp camera actions is a blessing.
I used to shoot decor landscape analog B&W in 4" x 5", OK? The dang camera (bellows on a rail, no less) had to stay out for 12-16hrs at a time in -15C.
Any warmth at all and the fog and ice in the camera would kill the rest of the trip.
Maybe that makes little sense where I live at 53N in the Rocky Mountains. Just wait until there's a day with snow, -15C and a 30mph wind.
We can go outside and talk about it.
-25C is really chilly. That can freeze your cojones, OK? While the camera will have to sleep outside, you can keep the battery pack warm with no problems.
Anybody who can help you with low temp camera actions is a blessing.
I used to shoot decor landscape analog B&W in 4" x 5", OK? The dang camera (bellows on a rail, no less) had to stay out for 12-16hrs at a time in -15C.
Any warmth at all and the fog and ice in the camera would kill the rest of the trip.
Maybe that makes little sense where I live at 53N in the Rocky Mountains. Just wait until there's a day with snow, -15C and a 30mph wind.
We can go outside and talk about it.
Yeh, I realise that make sense, just wondered if there was a short cut, if you google it, people have made good reports, about filming with just normal batteries at-15 etc. We'll see. I might look into making a batter pack of some sort, but I aint taking a 12v car battery or anything!
Thanks though.
Thanks though.
Your Eneloops are right out of the game at that sort of temperature.
Energizer Ultimate Lithiums are probably they way to go, to be honest I run my Bushnell cameras on them all the time just for the extended run time they deliver. You can take a look at their low temp performance here:
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/l91.pdf
To be honest I don't know what sort of current your camera will suck when the flash fires etc. but you should probably see similar performance out of the Lithiums at -25 as you get from the Eneloops at room temp.
Energizer Ultimate Lithiums are probably they way to go, to be honest I run my Bushnell cameras on them all the time just for the extended run time they deliver. You can take a look at their low temp performance here:
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/l91.pdf
To be honest I don't know what sort of current your camera will suck when the flash fires etc. but you should probably see similar performance out of the Lithiums at -25 as you get from the Eneloops at room temp.
Thanks for the link, caorach. Had no idea of the broad-band temp performance of those lithiums.
The flash has to store the volts in the discharge capacitor. Modern circuits have got to be better than the
crud I used 20-40 years ago.
The flash has to store the volts in the discharge capacitor. Modern circuits have got to be better than the
crud I used 20-40 years ago.
Agree that any kind of heat source and all you will be looking at is condensation on the internals, lens and very thing else.
Your best option is probably to alter the batteries you use. You should also let the camera acclimatise as suggested above by taking it out in a bag then setting it up. Leave to in the bag for a few hours when you bring it back indoors otherwise the sudden change in temps will cause it to fog up.
Since there are clearly other film makers who work in such conditions I would probably approach some of the larger photographic stores to ask about what others are using in cold weather!
Your best option is probably to alter the batteries you use. You should also let the camera acclimatise as suggested above by taking it out in a bag then setting it up. Leave to in the bag for a few hours when you bring it back indoors otherwise the sudden change in temps will cause it to fog up.
Since there are clearly other film makers who work in such conditions I would probably approach some of the larger photographic stores to ask about what others are using in cold weather!
Well your handwarmers operate at those sorts of temperatures? It may be that at that sort of temp they will simply do nothing. Also you may be underestimating how quickly even an insulated box will get down below the operating temps of something like an eneloop. Your run time is probably going to be measured in minutes rather than hours. You really need to change your battery technology to make a success of this, especially if you are going half way across the world to do it.
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