Suffolk Bushcraft Group

[KIMBOKO]

I don’t like the idea of a load of kit bought or donated for the use and ownership of the group. As pointed out there is the problem of storage, maintence, replacement and collecting money etc as well as what happens to these things when we leave or if the group no longer meets.
However there are few things that are good to have like a group shelter (parachute) and things that we need to have as part of our use of the woods like a toilet (composting).
It seems sensible that the costs of purchase are covered by an additional charge.
I would prefer that all things brought to the meet for group use are owned by someone so the responsibility is identifiable. Though I don’t mind helping towards the cost of purchase and repair.
I would prefer to pay on an item by item basis, as most things are not expensive when shared around. So if someone buys a parachute for £50 then as a group we would agree to subsidise the purchase and give say £25 towards the cost sharing the cost over a couple meets.
I wouldn’t want a regular charge just being collected and not used.
If we buy archery targets does everyone pay towards them, even the non archer?

As regards a chain saw. Do we need a chain saw? Do we have permission to use a chain saw? Will the operator have the correct training, ppe and 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] party insurance?

 

[Big Stu 12]

All valid points nick...will respond when on a pc... Its easier...

 

[SJStuart]

I don’t like the idea of a load of kit bought or donated for the use and ownership of the group. As pointed out there is the problem of storage, maintence, replacement and collecting money etc as well as what happens to these things when we leave or if the group no longer meets.

"... and the moral of this story, children, is never to get married... because divorce is complicated and expensive."
"let's not bother trying to create flight... because we might crash" - The Wright Brothers
"We would go to the moon, but we're afraid of what might happen if we try" - President John F. Kennedy

 

[ozzy1977]

I have to admit that I have the same reservations as Nick regarding as to what happens to the gear and money should the group fold and I think should be sorted out before we go ahead with the price rise.

Is the group all Ok with group funds being spent on replacing things that not everyone is able to make use of either because of not having their own equipment or interest in the activity.

 

[Big Stu 12]

"... and the moral of this story, children, is never to get married... because divorce is complicated and expensive."
"let's not bother trying to create flight... because we might crash" - The Wright Brothers
"We would go to the moon, but we're afraid of what might happen if we try" - President John F. Kennedy

Sorry but not really helpfull in this discussion.......

 

[Big Stu 12]

I have to admit that I have the same reservations as Nick regarding as to what happens to the gear and money should the group fold and I think should be sorted out before we go ahead with the price rise.

Is the group all Ok with group funds being spent on replacing things that not everyone is able to make use of either because of not having their own equipment or interest in the activity.

I know the problem of the Items and what happens when the thing folds, my suggestion is that we find a group and donate it to them.....or items sold and any moneys left get given to a chairty....

From a personal point of view for the last number of months/year or so, I have used my Tarp, griddle,tripod,lantern ect... it does not worry me about using them, but what I will say is no one has offered to buy soem fuel for the lantern, or offered to help with replacing the tarp.. yes I keep hearing that I may look at buying a paracute... but as of yet it's happened..

My feeling is that we are a group that has the requirrment for group items, and we should not be reliing on the same people every time to just roll up and supply things for our use. or expect the few to do the work for every one else.

If the group contribute 50% to say a parachte fr exmaple... that has been brought by a person, then they want to go away with it on their holiday... who has ownership... and who should have frist dibs at the use....???,

Then you have the thing of if certain thngs are then looked after by people and taken home to be looked after the cituation then can arrive that the person can not make it , and if happens to be the group shelter... there is no shelter... ok some one could run about collecting things, up....when this happens... I know I dont have time to do this... so this leads to me thinking that it has to be stored on site. then the problem comes when that person jsut dont come any more... 50% of our parachute leaves with them...

As far as non archers paying for archers equipment, yes I can see this and why people would not want to do it, but then again this happens with all things, some times there will be a time that the archers may pay towards soemthing they dont do... I stuck to teh archery thnig for an example.

Chain saw... OK not a nessaity, but it was donated to the group as it was being skiped.. there has been times when its easier to use a chainsaw and we have done, The landowner has no problem with us using one, we could use bow saws, but how many bring a bow saw with them, get the folding saw out take 15mins to cut through a large log, then give up... I see it as an asset that will only be used every now and then.. yes I agree only comperdent people to use.

Storage.. we do need it, anything that is needed for teh group is there ready for use, and we dont reley on peopel turning up jsut so we have a shelter ect..

Gaining more equipment... this will only introduce others that can not afford to buy a bit of kit to try... lets take the archery thing... for example some one may not see it worth while buying a bow.. just to shoot a couple of arrows, but would be happy in having a go every now and the.. ok the bow may only cost £30 and teh arrows £20 for a set of 20.. if I let some one use my arrows and they break/lose one its £70 for a set of 12... who pays for that.. so Group kit does help others.


Over the last Months, I have had a fair few things said to me by attendee's about the funding of things like the chemical loo blue, then it came up about the maintaince/running of the Saw, the winter is comming and what about closing the shelter in... and also about the storage of the kit, be it a loo, loo tent, friing pan.. ect ect.

I have also had someone ask if the group will get a light bow and some cheap arrows, as they would like to have a go at archery.. but thought it not worth buying a bow in case they dont like it...

I have problery opend a bigger can of worms here, and may be by bring up the subject of funding....I am sorry to sound like a rant , its not meant to...

Please dont shoot me ... jsut spent my whole lunch hours trying to get this reply right...

 

[Cromm]

Good for you Stu for thinking before writing. When I stop chainsawing in the rain and wind I will try and add some help.

 

[mikesmith777]

I believe that we all would like to keep things as simple as possible, in an utopian society, the items we want would be available for us to use as and when, unfortunately this does not exisit and we have to fund what we want to do.
When I first joined the group I thought I would be happy just to sit about around the fire and just chew the cud but as the group has progressed I find I want to be more involved.
Take the field archery, I would like to have a go, its not something that I have thought about before but as I watch others I want to be able to participate. Is it fair that someone who has spent a lot of money on his own equipment should let a complete novice have a go, I for one would welcome the group purchase of a cheap bow so that I could try the sport out and I am sure there are others in the group that would like to have a go.
I dont want to single out archery, I only use that as an example as I am sure there are other items that would be just as useful.
We do require a better method of disposing of our personal waste and maybe if we show that we mean business then the landowner may chip in, but this requires money on our part and it would not be fair for one person to fund this and we pay him back piecemeal.
This whole scenario does open up a can of worms but it is one we must overcome if the group is going to progress in a way that I am sure we all want it to.


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[ozzy1977]

Did the farmer say he would consider putting in a composting bog for us, or is that all in my head?

 

[amjake]

Hi Stu,

I've been watching the progression of the thread and, having been a visitor (awaiting definition of member ;0) ) I would be happy to pay the fee for the weekend plus extra for consumables etc. as you should not be out of pocket for the benefit of the group.

You're justified to make the points you have, however, you're right a whole new can of worms regarding responsibilities and liabilities beckons!

Plus I am in agreement with what Mike has just said.

Kevin

 

[ozzy1977]

Kevin have you got your new tent sorted out yet?

 

[ozzy1977]

What defines a member? that is another can of wriggly things in its own right.

 

[SJStuart]

Sorry but not really helpfull in this discussion.......

Duly noted... I was merely trying to make a point about "giving up before you begin".

 

[Big Stu 12]

Did the farmer say he would consider putting in a composting bog for us, or is that all in my head?

During the talks about the sanitary needs of the group it was spoken about what we would need for the group, we talked about scratch and bury, and felt this would leave too many land mines, and a latrine would be better, then it went on to the subject of growth of the group, this lead to the Chemical Toilet usage, and comments that if the group was to grow to the size, the a Composting Toilet would be the way to go.

The finite details were not discussed, who would do it and when were not decided on, but if the group was big enough and had been running for a reasonable amount of time, then there would be a reason to site one in the woodland.

I think at the moment we have only been there say 6 Months, and on average each month had 10 people per month use the site, be it at the monthly meets with 10 people, or the month has been made up of two meets with 5 people at each, I cant see him going for putting one in himself at this stage.

I think it could be a fair few months off at the moment for him to install one himself.

at the moment

 

[amjake]

Chris,

Awaiting decision from Vaude, gather supplier has returned and had to chase up today and see what comes.

By the way did look at Tatonka and you're right very Hilleberg looking and a little cheaper. However, keen to try out a tree dwellers swing to see if it's for me!

 

[Big Stu 12]

Hi Stu,

I've been watching the progression of the thread and, having been a visitor (awaiting definition of member ;0) ) I would be happy to pay the fee for the weekend plus extra for consumables etc. as you should not be out of pocket for the benefit of the group.

You're justified to make the points you have, however, you're right a whole new can of worms regarding responsibilities and liabilities beckons!

Plus I am in agreement with what Mike has just said.

Kevin

Hi Kevin,

I am glad that you are still watching... I am hoping that the group can sort something out, we got a good set of lad's and a good group growing, and hope it carries on growing, not just in size but what it can offer to the people that use it, I am so aware that as it grows so does its responsibility's and liability's, and being the person that people sometimes share their thoughts with, I thought it about time that the next step was found and taken...

 

[Big Stu 12]

I believe that we all would like to keep things as simple as possible, in an utopian society, the items we want would be available for us to use as and when, unfortunately this does not exisit and we have to fund what we want to do.
When I first joined the group I thought I would be happy just to sit about around the fire and just chew the cud but as the group has progressed I find I want to be more involved.
Take the field archery, I would like to have a go, its not something that I have thought about before but as I watch others I want to be able to participate. Is it fair that someone who has spent a lot of money on his own equipment should let a complete novice have a go, I for one would welcome the group purchase of a cheap bow so that I could try the sport out and I am sure there are others in the group that would like to have a go.
I dont want to single out archery, I only use that as an example as I am sure there are other items that would be just as useful.
We do require a better method of disposing of our personal waste and maybe if we show that we mean business then the landowner may chip in, but this requires money on our part and it would not be fair for one person to fund this and we pay him back piecemeal.
This whole scenario does open up a can of worms but it is one we must overcome if the group is going to progress in a way that I am sure we all want it to.

Nicely put Mike, its great to know that not only do you enjoy the group, and want to get involved more, that's the way I think it should be, its a great way to try new things, share experience's and learn new skills.... between the group we have shed loads..and have a lot to offer...

 

[roman-soldier]

I'm not sure how you build a composting loo but I've got a mini digger available and I'm willing to bring it to site and dig the hole if required. As for archery and such my personal opinion is that if a few people want to chip in for a specific product that they want to try then they do so between themselves and not involve anyone else, most of us have things that we would share with the group under supervision, like my air rifle, chainsaw etc. The main things like parachute, hut, griddle and loo then obviously that's everyone making a small contribution and I also think those items that are used every meet should be purchased by the group. As a basic we should buy a griddle and group Tarp rather than rely on anyone's donation that way there's no expectations put on any one member. I'm sure someone will offer for free but I would prefer if a payment was made to confirm group ownership.
For me the weekends are about relaxing in good company away from the stress of work and I'd like to keep things very very simple, once it starts getting complicated I'm afraid that's going to put me off.
Great thread and very informative keep it up.

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[Big Stu 12]

One thing that keeps getting meantioned is archery, think we should be looking futher then that, meantioned that as an example......

It personaly does not worry me if the group decides not to buy any archery kit, and there are many other things/activites that the group can aid people in gaining a taste of, the one of reasons for the group and one of things I like about bushcraft is the way people pass on skills and crafts that they can do, I know we have a lot of kit between some of us, and do pass on skills/knowlage.

I am one that will share kit and knowlege that I have, to get people going, but if I take the air gus for example, the targets that have been used belong to Carl and Chris, is it fair to expect them to maintain them keep bring them.. The answer to me is no...nor do I think it right to hang cans in the tree... Yes its a tartget... The same for catapults... Cans every where.. Not really what I like to see in a woods then they get left because the cost nowt, and people forget about them, as they rush off home.

Other kit could be a cheap tarp and hammock, how many times do I hear I would like to try hammockimg, or I would like to try a tarp... Yes I know people offer, I know people will lend kit for other to try.. I regualy offer my kit to others.. To try things.. Be it carving... Ect ect... But should it always be down to lending personal kit althe time... Also handy if you have a mate that would love to try... Ok I know some of us have two or more sets... But some dont...

Myself yes a parachute looks nice, but are they waterproof... Not untill you treat it, or a few months over the fire..... But in heavy rain do they stop the spray/a fine mist as they are so thin... Or is it people like the look... Never really spent a whole weekend under one in a really wet winter

Other thing is a Frist Aid kit..... I have used mine on people that just dont have one that cuts the mustard... I replace the stuff no problem... But think we should have a group one... That will handle most sharps injurys..

I could go on.. Please dont take this as a dig... We are a group, for some of us to get more out of it we need to expand and grow, or we lose people because we stagnate..differnt people bring difernt ideas and skill sets, that what is making us atractive to others that want to learn...

 

[Big Stu 12]

Chris .. Did you have your course today .

How did it go.