Ray being nice about Bear.....

tom.moran

Settler
Nov 16, 2013
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Swindon, Wiltshire
i agree with mears. i watched something the other night that was ok, some bloke dropped in a big forest in europe with nothing to survive for 10 days. seemed real enough, though i could be wrong........
 

GGTBod

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Mar 28, 2014
3,209
26
1
awww i can feel the love beginning. Ray and Bear sitting in a tree.......Well till Bear jumps out of it :D

totally naked after abandoning all his gear straight into a sub zero river whilst eating a live snake
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
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Uncle Ray in his latest interview for the Radio Times, comments about Bear being the best of the dodgy survival shows out there. Not exactly high praise, but definitely an acknowledgement...

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2014...ortable-with-where-survival-shows-are-heading

He had me for a minute. But then he spoiled it. First he mentioned how his experience let him connect more realistically; then he said how he hears the history and imagines the sound of "the traces being tied up round the girth of a horse."

Obviously he doesn't have any experience with horses or he'd know what the traces are and where they go (straight back from the haines to the single-tree)
 
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JonathanD

Ophiological Genius
Sep 3, 2004
12,815
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Stourton,UK
He had me for a minute. But then he spoiled it. First he mentioned how his experience let him connect more realistically; then he said how he hears the history and imagines the sound of "the traces being tied up round the girth of a horse."

Obviously he doesn't have any experience with horses or he'd know what the traces are and where they go.

To be fair, he is a very accomplished horse rider and has trekked around Yosemite on horseback twice. It may be a culture difference in terms of reference. English tack is very different from American, and the terms used.
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
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To be fair, he is a very accomplished horse rider and has trekked around Yosemite on horseback twice. It may be a culture difference in terms of reference. English tack is very different from American, and the terms used.

There's a difference I'm sure. But not between English and American. The difference is between saddle horses and draft horses (riders on the one hand and ploughmen/teamsters/etc. on the other) "Traces" are the lines or chains that pull the load on a draft animal; not relevant on a saddle horse.

There are many accomplished riders on this side of the pond as well who have no idea about draft tack -------- NOW-A-DAYS. But in the era he's documenting, every settler or explorer would have known. And every farmer or logger up until about the 1940s.
 
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santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
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Actually there is. To quote someone else on here....

'On an English pulling bridle the traces are passed back from the harness through straps on the girth.'

Exactly. Passed through straps on the girth; not wrapped round the girth. That said. The traces aren't really part of the bridle; they're part of the harness. And no, we wouldn't normally pass the reins (which are part of the bridle) through any part of the girth (as they did in this photo) except in a formal rig for show such as Budweiser's Clydesdale team. Nor would we use (again, except for said formal show teams) any of the harness pictured over the horse's haunches. Nor the double set of reins.

There would also be a difference in the traces themselves on a settlers plough. They would more normally be chains (referred to as trace chains) and rather than passing through a strap on the girth, they would be hooked loosely to a hook on sais girth. As a kid, and later as a teenager, I harnessed horses for a plough or to pull logs many, many, many times.
 
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santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
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Settlers here rarely ever used a team to [plough. They would have used mules or a multi purpose breed horse that was also their saddle horse. And they would have been hitched singly. Teams were used for heavier work such as logging or pulling canal boats. Sometimes oxen were used in teams; my grandfather logged with oxen.

Teams such as that ploughing would have only been on commercial farms (the big plantations) in the East; not on homesteads out West.
 

cranmere

Settler
Mar 7, 2014
992
2
Somerset, England
In the Little House on the Prairie Laura Ingalls Wilder refers to her Pa using a pair of oxen for ploughing which he subsequently traded for a pair of horses. Almanzo Wilder describes training a pair of calves to pull a plough too.
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,909
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Yeah, oxen were common for a while as many had been used to pull the wagons themselves on the wagon trains getting there. As were mules. Teams of horses would have also been used to pull those same wagons in the wagon trains, but they were normally multi purpose breeds that could double as saddle horses later rather than true draft horses.

Some (and I emphasize "some") of the settlers to the Great Plains area eventually grew into large commercial farms that would have used teams of horses. But the majority were homesteaders claiming only a single section (1 square mile) of land. After the wagon trek they would have traded their excess horses ( and in some dire cases, eaten them) and retained only the number needed for farming at a subsistence level.

I might add that although many different types of animals were used to pull the wagons in the wagon trains, the trains themselves were usually segregated according to those animals:
Horses and mule only trains with no oxen drawn wagons allowed, and oxen only drawn wagons with no other animal type allowed. Its taught that this was necessary so that all participating wagons could maintain a compatible pace without slowing the others. I have no idea just how true this is though.
 

santaman2000

M.A.B (Mad About Bushcraft)
Jan 15, 2011
16,909
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Florida
My apologies for sidetracking the thread. And also if my original post gave the impression that I'm skeptical of RM or this series. Far from it; I look forward to when it becomes available here.
 

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