Paramo - checked them out and can't decide if good or not.

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Paul_B

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jul 14, 2008
4,241
538
Lancashire
I've got a more normal fit membrane jacket. No excess fabric but plenty of space for layers. Room to breathe? It has pockets with mesh inner pockets. They are very effective vents. These aren't actually pockets but put zips. The pockets are internal and access is through the vents or from inside if the main zip is open.

I've seen vents on more conventional designs including paramo. They do offer decent breathing room. A lot of excessive fabric isn't needed with good design. Imho it's a sign of lazy or poor design.
 

Billy-o

Native
Apr 19, 2018
1,129
435
Canada
Got a Halcon jacket sent to me a few days ago. It's a 'where have you been all my life' kind of thing. I haven't ever been happier in the cold and pouring rain.
 
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SCOMAN

Full Member
Dec 31, 2005
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Perthshire
I occasionally look them over and try them on, the fit is a bit weird. The one time I tried it in warm wet conditions I sweated like a squaddie in a spelling test. Goretex just seems to work better, for me anyway. I think they're a marmite type thing.
 

lostplanet

Full Member
Aug 18, 2005
1,586
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Kent
Paramo and the short answer for me is not robust enough and way to expensive for scrafting. Like you say dogwalking, walking and hiking etc they perform ok.
I sold the majority of my paramo gear as i couldnt justify the price versus possible damage and replacement. some of the zip design were painful to mess with.

I didnt find it particularly waterproof or breathable even after a reproof from the factory. I have the fuera jacket and taiga fleece combo which was ok but the fuera just osmosised and got soaked next to skin.
I have found the most waterproof trousers by Berghaus the "deluge" pant works for me. I might try the jacket if it pops up in a sale.

Top layer for me is a most VFM polycotton jacket/smock (easily replaced with identical as i like the continuity) with nikwax cotton proof and with goretex layer underneath when its buckets and light merino under that for warmth when static before shelter is sussed.

The newer issue PCS Dayglo crisp packet MVP is working ok but i would like to try a decent Event product.

The other thing is the Keela Munro that seems to get very good press but again a bit expensive should I end up in the brambles and thorns at night.
I will get one one day for a try out but sizing is very generous apparently.
 

Tiley

Full Member
Oct 19, 2006
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Gloucestershire
I have tried Paramo stuff and, while I want to like it and say it works, I'm not sure that I can. In use, I have found it hot and, because of that, just as sweaty and uncomfortable as any other 'hard shell' I've experienced. The outer fabric does appear flimsy but is easily reparable.

For fit, the jackets/smocks are quite good in terms of cut but seem to vary enormously from model to model; I would avoid their trousers like the plague and would always go for a Gore/Event/Neoshell option as they work fine for legs, are lighter in weight and are 'tailored' to accommodate movement much better than the Paramo equivalents.

I suppose the thing that I don't really like about the Paramo stuff is that, on a big day out or multi-day trip, you just end up feeling permanently clammy; that said, the same is true of just about every waterproof-but-breathable clothing set up when you're working hard! Therein lies the challenge for the manufacturers.
 

Billy-o

Native
Apr 19, 2018
1,129
435
Canada
I think by now, after like 900 'what's the perfect jacket' threads on BCUK over fifteen years, we've cottoned to the fact that there isn't a perfect jacket. Rather, if you're expecting to be rolling around in the bracken ... heavy military cotton or gabardine works OK. For keeping comfy, keeping the wind off and being able to fend off the rain if it comes to it, Ventile might be an answer. I have about twenty GoreTex jackets deposited in different places, ranging from great big heavy things for keeping out tons of wet snow to super light things for running in. Paramo has a place in this firmament. The Halcon keeps you good when picking around and not trying to get somewhere specific in the quickest possible time. On a different hand some of their other jackets work well for cycling and running and, I have to say, having spent some time with it now, that Bentu fleece/windproof combo is a flipping coup.

Anyone got an Enduro? :) Trying to figure out its expense. My guess is, from experience, is that it is likely worth it, but for what exactly? Mind you it does cost a lot.
 
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Tiley

Full Member
Oct 19, 2006
1,999
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Gloucestershire
I, too, was excited about the Bentu fleece and windproof combo. I bought it as my 'weatherproof' when I did the Cape Wrath Trail, having been assured that it would keep out the wind, rain and any other nasties. The fleece was good - about the right weight, windproof(-ish) and faintly water resistant - despite the grippy sleeves; the windproof did not seem to add anything much to the weather repelling equation. Given that I experienced the best that the Highlands could throw at me in terms of weather and given the trust - and cash - I had invested in the efficiency of the fleece and windproof, I ended up feeling pretty let down. When it rained, I ended up drenched and often cold, too frequently for comfort. Thankfully, Paramo customer service is exemplary: I returned the fleece and windproof with my detailed observations about their performance - or lack of it - over the two weeks I was on the trail; Paramo listened and gave me a replacement top, whose name I can't remember, without a quibble. The replacement hangs as a sort of trophy in the cupboard, reminding me of my folly.

Despite all this, I know that, for some people, the Paramo system works brilliantly; sadly, I am not one of them. That combination of feeling clammy and the inconsistencies of the cut of their clothing means I am dubious of their efficacy. However, I still want them to work for me. Maybe I'll try out the replacement they gave me... Fourth time lucky? I hope so.
 
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lostplanet

Full Member
Aug 18, 2005
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The other thing that is highly irritating wearing paramo, is the static. I really do hate static in clothing and thats one of the reasons I stopped using my taiga fleece.

Quality has dwindled obver the years as well but unfortunately the price has either stayed the same or increased.
 

Billy-o

Native
Apr 19, 2018
1,129
435
Canada
I, too, was excited about the Bentu fleece and windproof combo. I bought it as my 'weatherproof' when I did the Cape Wrath Trail
Thanks. It is good to hear this, Tiley, and, of course, if they say it should stand up to the weather it should stand up to the weather. Though, if I am imagining the meteorology you encountered correctly, I think that, intuitively, I wouldn't have risked the Bentu combo. Just nervous, you understand. :) Though, that said, I have been snowshoeing in it in wettish kind of snow rain, medium weight, but persistent for a few hours ... not a hooley. However, that was uphill work and shoving out the calories. I was dry when I got back to the car.

Like Ventile, Paramo is very comfortable, beathable ... also, it is light and flexible. The point is to find the conditions when it works best so as you can enjoy those qualities, and when it is that you have to retreat to the 3-ply, pro-shell Gore-Tex fortresses.
 

Paul_B

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jul 14, 2008
4,241
538
Lancashire
Someone posted that the paramo was a perfect fit? Never thought I'd hear that. I guess you like excess material in your jacket. They are a very baggy jacket in most models. There are a few more normal shaped ones but they're not as good a design or they're the really expensive mountaineering version costing an eye watering amount.

By normal shaped I mean when you get the right length body and right length arms your jacket girth isn't too baggy even with the levels of insulation needed for arctic conditions underneath. They're baggy or short. Most hardshell waterproofs have a better fit, even the cheaper, longer length, dogwalker berghaus jackets favoured by older ramblers who no longer go into the mountains. Even those hardshells aren't paramo baggy.

Btw I once emailed paramo for fit advice. Response was an little bit telling. They practically admitted fit isn't right. Can't find the email now but I got the distinct impression that their own people giving technical sales advise didn't rate the fit.
 

Billy-o

Native
Apr 19, 2018
1,129
435
Canada
Someone posted that the paramo was a perfect fit?
It could be better. But there is short round people, wide triangular people and seven foot tall, beanpole kinds of people, and every other variation. All mfrs have a body outline in mind, and produce their patterns accordingly. Someone is bound to fit Paramo :) I do like the roominess and ease of movement afforded by the Paramo cut, though. They have pockets for stuff too, which requires a bit of give. Rab, Norrona, Arcteryx even OR, sometimes it feels like a challenge just to find somewhere for your ski pass. :lol:

I tried on Enduro trousers, though. Long enough and fit at the waist but too narrow in the thigh. How you get that wrong, I don't know :lol: I don't think the trousers will work for resort skiing as you get a wet bum sometimes, depending on the weather. Also the lifts can be a bit rough and tumble, so maybe they aren't right for that environment. Backcountry/shoeing might be a different story
 
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Paul_B

Bushcrafter (boy, I've got a lot to say!)
Jul 14, 2008
4,241
538
Lancashire
Yes, variety of sizes and shapes. Some brands have a certain fit but still cover a wider range of fits than paramo. For a brand with such a wide range of "waterproof" products there really should be something for everyone. I actually want to go back to paramo but can't due to fit options meaning the jacket options don't work for me.