Pain in the neck

[jackcbr]

well more the shoulders really. I'm off on a mountain navigation course in Scotland this November and have tried out carrying my pack last weekend. We are camping out on the mountain, so I've got tent, sleeping bag, cooking set and food, but the pack is coming in at just under 20kgs (that includes 3ltrs of water). I've got a webtex PLCE 120ltr Bergen, but am finding it is my shoulders that are letting me down. Do any of you guys have some tips to reduce the amount of rubbing/soreness. Reducing weight isn't really possible or replacing the pack as funds and time are short.

Would building up shoulder muscles help, or any tips on creating extra padding? I know some of you are ex-mob and will no doubt carried heavier weights in the same packs, so how did you deal with it?

Did 13 miles on Sunday and was quite surprised that the legs lasted, just the shoulders let me down.

 

[Shewie]

Are you getting around 65% of the weight onto your hip belt rather than loading it all on your shoulders ?

 

[Miyagi]

Perhaps it's just a case of needing acclimatisation? The trapezius muscles need to be accustomed to carrying weight.

It's the same for beginner bodybuilders who find it difficult when doing squats; in that the area has never been subjected to any weight bearing like that before.

HtH

Liam

 

[spiritwalker]

ditch the water? take filter/purifier or melt snow and if the straps on your pack are poorly padded try putting socks in a small dry sack and gaffer taping them to your straps if the straps can slacken off a little. In all honesty finding the right pack for comfort requires a lot of trying them on in shops some packs just aren't right for some people. I imagine the bulk of your weight is from your sleeping bag which cant really be compromised since it will be cold and since funds dont allow i guess a down bag is out of the question. Also try packing the backpack in a proper order so the weight is more balanced which can make a massive difference also make sure the pack is balanced and doesnt swing about most of the good books/magazines and possibly the tinter web will have some info on where to pack what. Another possible option if your going with someone you know split the load half the tent etc..

 

[andybysea]

I got the same problem in my traps(and i have decent ones muscle wise) stooboy and i went on a thurs morning to fri evening walk i was carrying 65lbs in weight in my pack and it was my traps that took the brunt, i just walked through it although it was damn uncomfortable,every now and then i lifted my pack with my hands from the bottom whilst walking and it gave instant though very short relief,i just took the view that i had to put up with it and looked forward to stops when i could take the pack off(bliss)we covered 30 odd miles,its probably a case of longish walking,heavyish pack,and not often done that did it for me,was achey for a day or so after but a hot bath so sorted it.

As for taking the weight on my hips, i dont really find that comfy i do have the waist belt nice and tight for support but like wise shoulder strap very tight, if i loosened them it felt awkward and uncomfortable on my back,much prefer muscle cramp in my traps than damage to my back.

 

[Miyagi]

It's a common problem Andy, as you say; long distance, big pack and being unused to it (a bit like being out of practice).

Any pics of the Thurs to Fri walk mate?

Liam

 

[andybysea]

Stoo has all the pics Liam,so be patient, very, very, patient and one day hopefully in the not tooooooo distant future we may see them.

 

[Acorn62]

With Shewie on this one.
Make sure the distribution goes heavy to core and transfer the weight onto your hips. If the hip belt is not comfortable, either replace it or use another decently padded belt (a hippo or make your own - as I did) and get used to carrying with the weight on your hips. Remember that there is a knack to bearing weight on the hips. It also helps to have a bit of articulation between hip belt and pack if at all possible. I spent many years carrying big loads badly. Now I've learned the trick it's really quite a breeze.....

 

[MSkiba]

How does one transfer the weight to the hip belt?

I would love some more information on the correct way to carry heavy loads, any links or illustrations would be a bonus for me.

For me it seems the hip belt is too high

 

[Acorn62]

Not perfect but you should get the idea.... most important, the shoulders do not carry the weight, the hips do and not the top of the thighs either, the hip bones act as a fulcrum for your body and the legs carry the weight. By having the hip belt properly placed the majority of the weight of the pack is carried on the hips.
If you look at the construction of your pack you'll see that the shoulder straps are fairly flimsy for carrying the amount of weight which you can get into it.
The hip belt, being attached to the bag at the bottom can bear all of the weight. You have to look at it a bit like one of those skeletal radio masts. The stay lines (guys) keep it from falling over but bear no weight. The base of the mast (bearing) carried all of the weight plus some of the additional force passed to it when the wind tries to blow the thing over and the guy lines transfer the force down to the bearing. Your pack is pretty much the same type of mechanical system. Your shoulders are not built for load carrying and so will hurt (a lot) if forced to do so. As I have found over the years, carrying unbelievable loads of ordinance various and stuff never used... the hips are the best place to put it.
Hope this helps

http://www.ehow.com/video_2354076_how-wear-backpack.html

 

[Shewie]

It's probably worth mentioning too that some military packs are designed to be worn above webbing so that lifts the hip belt quite a bit. Not sure if that might be affecting Jack to, do the PLCEs have a high hip belt ?

 

[_mark_]

from Gc

70-80% on the hips, 20-30% on the shoulders

The waist belt should be tight (and still comfortable), bearing in mind the positioning of the belt in reference to the crest of the hip.

You should then fit the shoulder straps and tighten them.

Following this, the waist belt stabilizers should be adjusted for maximum comfort on your hips and until firm.

After the waist, the shoulder strap stabilizers should be adjusted. This will bring the whole pack into balance. Do not over tighten the shoulder stabilizers as this may create a gap between the shoulder and the shoulder strap which will cause rubbing and overbalancing of the rucksack once you start walking.

The final process to undertake is to clip and adjust chest strap. This can be uncomfortable if placed in the wrong place, especially for women. The strap should fit level with the front of the shoulder joint and tightened until it takes the pull off the front of the shoulder.

 

[Culloch]

The PLCE Bergan is a great bit off kit, it literally is bombproof! (got pics to prove it..) the problem is as mentioned earlier its designed to be carried above belt order which for its intended user means the belt is actually redundant and most actually reverse the belt to fasten around the back of the sack out of the way. This also helps to ditch it in a hurry!
If you intend to use a PLCE pattern Bergan without belt order I'd check which length back it is to make sure that the belt sits at the right height for you!
Other than that its long painful hours of digging in to get used to it but bear in mind squaddies carry huge loads over huge distances with these because they're prepared for it and more to the point ....they have no choice!
If it doesn't suit you I'd try something else, you only get one back!

 

[johnboy]

I also agree with Shewie and others getting effective weight transfer of the load onto your hips is key.

20kg is a reasonable load to carry especially in mountainous terrain and if you're not overly conditioned to carrying a 'bergen' .

It may be worth pointing out the pack you have is a Webtex PLCE Bergen copy not an Issue PLCE bergen. Personally I dont have a lot of faith in webtex kit it's fine upto a point anyhow..

I guess the first question is does it fit you?

Where does the waist belt actually sit when the loaded pack is on?

The belt needs to sit above your hips and fasten below your stomach if it's up around your waist below your ribcage then it's no good for weight transfer to your hips you'll be stuck with the weight on your shoulders.

To crib an image:

I'd suss that out first have you got a pack that actually fits you?

Yes then adjust to get the best fit

No then you'll have to make the best out of it.....

I've seen blokes adding all sorts to bergen straps in the past from bits of Foam stuck on with black nasty to kip mats cut to fit the straps. I think all they do is delay the inevitable which is you're going to be getting 20kg on your shoulders.

Let us know how your pack fits...

HTH

 

[andybysea]

I was using a adjustable back system rucksack,with it definately sat on my hips, belt nice and snug and i still got cramped trap's,granted i had the shoulder straps pulled tight,but any loosening of them caused the pack to drop further down and that felt very awkward and unnatural on my back, like i said earlier i think because i had'nt done much distance with a heavy-ish pack for a while that added to problem, but even in my younger fitter days long distance stuff always got my traps more than anywhere else,could possibly be a genetic/body shape type thing?

 

[iamasmith]

That's a big pack to have 20kg of kit in it. Is it properly distributed and compressed so that the weight is driving downward rather than pulling your shoulders back?

 

[gregorach]

ditch the water?

Aye. There's no need to be carrying 3L of water in Scotland in November.

 

[ged]

... pack is coming in at just under 20kgs ... webtex PLCE 120ltr Bergen ... Would building up shoulder muscles help, or any tips on creating extra padding?

The advice you've had so far has been spot on. In particular (although I've never personally used any Webtex kit) that does sound like a big pack for 20kg so packing it carefully might make a huge difference. Building up shoulder muscles will be happening anyway, that's why you're aching.

Padding is only really any use to stop chafe. It can prevent high-pressure spots and friction burns, but it won't do anything for an incorrectly loaded or incorrectly worn or ill-fitting pack. It took me years to find a pack that I'm really comfortable with, and in the end it turned out to be one that my wife bought for herself! She didn't get on with it but it fits me like a dream. As you've already said I think you've left it a bit late for this trip apart from adjusting the load bearing points. I like to have at least 80 percent of the load on my hips. If I'm loaded badly, I tire very quickly with even a light load. If I'm loaded right, I can carry half my body weight more or less indefinitely. I like the shoulder straps pretty loose. It isn't everybody's cup of tea but I like to lean forward a little into the load, and having a space between my back and the pack helps with ventilation -- I sweat like a pig when I'm working.

 

[jackcbr]

It's probably worth mentioning too that some military packs are designed to be worn above webbing so that lifts the hip belt quite a bit. Not sure if that might be affecting Jack to, do the PLCEs have a high hip belt ?

Well that answers that one, yes it does, and I had wondered if I was an odd shape. Slackened off the shoulder straps to drop the hip strap down and found the webbing strap (for want of a better word) started chafing on my armpits. Will look into redistribution of weight. and see if that helps. Maybe I should just man up and push through.

 

[jackcbr]

Cool guys, lots to take on board there. I think just getting use to the pack weight really. I haven't done any serious walking with a pack since my teens (so long ago). And I'll look at weight distribution. It does sound a large pack, but my sleeping bag takes up most of the room. Also I'm not using it to its full capacity. I've opted for not taking my sleeping bag in a compression sack as that leaves a lot of hard to fill spaces. I think I'm carrying the tent in the wrong place, so will look at that. I've got the pack at the moment in an "as I need it" order, so sleeping bag at the bottom, food on the sides, cooking equip on top.

I think I suffer more from chafing and pressure points than anything else, I'm such a delicate flower. I will look at the setup of the bag and maybe take a few shots and post them. If nothing else you can have a laugh at all the gear I'm taking.