Mors Kochanski bow drill techniques

[Leon]

Having learnt to use the bow drill with a 'standard' hearth ie drill in single depression with notch cut out of side I have started dabbling with some of the alternative methods shown in Mors' book.
I've managed to get an ember using the two intersecting holes technique but not with the two sticks hearth or the deep single hole
Just wondered whether anyone else has played or is playing about with any of these alternatives?

 

[BOD]

Not yet Leon. Always thought they were good ideas.

I have been content with just being able to manage a standard bow drill and the Oz Aboriginal style bow drill.

Will try later today

 

[Biddlesby]

Can't remember what this one is called, but I tried one of his methods - binding two sticks together, and drilling from both sides. Didn't have much luck, although there was lots of smoke.

 

[rich59]

I will have a go at some of these. I was interested in the science behind his fast single hole. He reckons it works by the radiant heat lighting the middle point of the hole. If that is so then it should also work by placing a tiny bit of char cloth held on the tip of a tiny twig in the centre of the hole (like you might with a reflector fire lighter).

 

[g4ghb]

Just a quick line to say thet Leon is not ignoreing his thread - he is having come computer probs that are preventing him from posting!

 

[Leon]

Heh....I'm back! Thanks Timon :You_Rock_
Thanks also to everyone else who helped get me back able to post again
In the meantime I did manage to get a couple of embers using the two sticks bound together method (without having to turn them over and drill back through).
I took some pics which I'll attempt to sort out over the next couple of days.
I'm particularly intrigued by the single hole technique. I haven't really had a suitably deep hearth to try this 'properly' as yet. I did have a couple of quick attempts on a hearth just an inch thick. I drilled almost through then pushed in the dust. Unfortunately my dust didn't form a convenient heap as in Mors' drawing, it kinda just half filled the hole each time leaving a flat top and no doubt smothering any reflected heat More practise required!
Cheers,
Dave

 

[Chris-N]

I've tried the two stick hearthboard a few times with a hand drill and IMO it's not worth it. I only got one ember out of five tries and was bloody knackered! I find it easier to use one stick about the same diameter (slightly larger is ideal) as the drill with a very small notch in the side. To me, I find hearth stick a more appropriate term than hearthboard. Easier to make and find than a ticker piece.

 

[BobFromHolland]

I've given both techniques a few attempts, also the split branch method.
All with only limited success.

I also had no ember yet from the single hole method, because of an unlucky finger rubbing the dust in the hole. It does spread out a lot when you have no notch.
Also with the two twig hearth I had no ember yet.

The opposing hole technique also failed me due to lack of luck in getting the dust in the right places.

I must do more practice with this, since these types of hearths are more readilly available (or easy to create with an inadequate knife) in a forrest compared to a commercial pine hearth I normally use at home...

Great thread!

Bob

 

[Chris-N]

I must do more practice with this, since these types of hearths are more readilly available (or easy to create with an inadequate knife) in a forrest compared to a commercial pine hearth I normally use at home...

See my post above.I got the Idea from a pic in "Ray Mear's World of Survival" that I found in a library. It's of the bushmen of Namibia's technique. If you have access to this book it's on page 93. Anyway, the bushman is using a 'hearth stick' the same diameter as the drill with only a very small notch in the side so there is a place for the dust to accumulate. Hope this helps,

Chris

PS: There might be some problems with stability using this method with a bow drill (I've never used a bow drill and so can't be sure).

 

[Leon]

As promised, here’s a pic of the two embers that formed during my latest attempt at the two stick hearth method.
The two sticks are lime and were picked up from a pile of coppiced branches and left for about a week in my workshop to dry out. They are just over thumb thickness.
I used a hazel spindle about an inch in diameter.
After lashing the sticks tightly together I carved a small depression at the point the sticks fitted closest together just to get the spindle spinning more easily. It didn’t take long for the embers to form but they were quite small compared to one formed using the v notch technique; only about the size of a modest hand drill ember, really.
I tried drilling again into the same depression but this was far less successful. Given the relatively shallow channel formed by the two sticks, it doesn’t take long before the drill sinks below the bottom of it. The part of the drill that is generating all the heat is then no longer in contact with the collected dust.
So, although it worked quickly and without having the laborious job of carving a notch, the embers were relatively small. Larger diameter sticks and a broader drill however will probably improve on this.
More fun to be had with further experiments
I’m determined to have a proper crack at that elusive single hole technique, too!

 

[rich59]

Nice picture Leon and well done.

I have seen it reported that this is a good technique for windy conditions as the draft of air along the groove coaxes the ember into life.

I have tried this a number of times (in still conditions) with hand drill. I got success with difficulty if I set the hearth at about 45 degrees. Then most of the char collected on the downwards side and I suspect that the potential for an updraft of air helped it to catch.

But, I agree that the notch method seems much easier.

You can always combine your coals along with the spare char dust I suppose to make a bigger ember if you need to.

You might try setting your bow drill hearth at an angle and see it it is any different.

 

[BOD]

I tries the two stick hearth method with the best wood I know off - the Australian blackboy Xanthorrhoea - which is a never fail in almost any conditions, like 3 days in the humid jungle next to a waterfall, but with no luck at all

Lots of smoke and dust but no ember. After repeated failure, I tried the single stick and had an ember in no time.

Makes me wonder why Mors mentions it other than an exercise to improve your skills. I can't see its use in a survival situation except possibly where you have no knife and no rocks to shape your spindle.

See here for blackboy if you don't know the tree http://www.pawlan.com/Monica/xanthor/

 

[Leon]

Thanks to everyone that has cotributed thus far. In a 'misery-loves-company' kinda way I'm glad to see it's not just me that finds Mors' techniques tricky to get the hang of compared to the 'notch out of the side' method
As mentioned by a few people there is an obvious advantage to these techniques if you do not happen to have a knife with you. Even when you do, cutting a notch across the grain of a dead, hard hearthboard can take its toll especially with the acute edges associated with bushcraft knives. Plus there is the point that this technique requires extra knife work to achieve three flat sides to the hearth.
Additionally, most of Mors' methods do keep the ember well away from any damp in the floor as well as the wind advantage mentioned by Richard.
What fun all this is

 

[Chris-N]

I tries the two stick hearth method with the best wood I know off - the Australian blackboy Xanthorrhoea - which is a never fail in almost any conditions, like 3 days in the humid jungle next to a waterfall, but with no luck at all

Lots of smoke and dust but no ember. After repeated failure, I tried the single stick and had an ember in no time.

Makes me wonder why Mors mentions it other than an exercise to improve your skills. I can't see its use in a survival situation except possibly where you have no knife and no rocks to shape your spindle.

See here for blackboy if you don't know the tree http://www.pawlan.com/Monica/xanthor/

That's the wood I use. The only ember I got wiht the two stick method with that wood actually formed underneath the hearth. I drilled til I thought I was gonna cark it and when I looked the hearth was still smoking with an ember on the underside.

Have you used any of the other "famous" woods for friction such as yucca? How does blackboy compare to them?

Chris

 

[BOD]

That's the wood I use. The only ember I got wiht the two stick method with that wood actually formed underneath the hearth. I drilled til I thought I was gonna cark it and when I looked the hearth was still smoking with an ember on the underside.

Have you used any of the other "famous" woods for friction such as yucca? How does blackboy compare to them?

Chris

Never tried yucca. What are the famous woods?

My project now is to identify the tropical woods that are good for fire by friction.

I've found a couple that are good. At least other people who I've introduced to them say they are good woods. Can't beat blackboy though.

However mountain hibiscus is almost as good and doesn't wear out as quickly as blackboy.

You a WA boy? Whereabouts in the SW are you? I'm from Perth

 

[Chris-N]

My family is in Bunbury but I go to uni in Perth, so I basically have two homes.
Are you currently living in Perth?
By "famous" woods I mean the American and British woods that I basically had only heard of when I tried to work out fire by friction from net resources. I think some of the more common ones are yucca, elder and ivy? I'm not that sure as this info is pretty irrelevant to me.
Also, what's mountain hibiscus? Do you have a pic or scientific name (I probably know the plant but not the name).

Chris

PS sorry about hijacking the thread.

 

[BOD]

I've never used those woods except once and not sure which northern wood it was.

I think that arid zone woods and tropical woods are probably easier to use. In the case of arid zone woods cos they dry as a bone and in the case of tropicals simply due to the enormous range to choose from so the best stuff is the best of some 700 tree species and lots of shrubs.

The hibiscus I am refering to is H. rosa-sinensis a.k.a Chinese Hibiscus. I find that it grows straighter and the wood has a better quality if it is grown at around 1500m or more. The stems are 2-4 metres long and arrow straight and a delight to use. Great fibre for cordage as well

I just meant mountain-grown hibiscus.

Not in Perth at the moment but in Malaysia.

Where do you get your blackboy from - up north or around the SW? Different species.

Good luck at Uni.

 

[Chris-N]

I get mine from the SW.

Thanks

Chris