How much impact is acceptable?

[kawasemi]

I think Dogoak and TLM have hit on the broader topic here as well. All the gear we purchase, use, store.

Over the years, I have been as guilty as the next buying the latest kit and using it a bit before moving on, resulting in quite a hoard that needs clearing out.

But it is good to sell on and get re-use by someone else. Recycling in a way.

As I get older, greyer, wiser ( maybe). I have moved towards repair, rebuild and re-use. Traditional fabrics that are long lasting and hard wearing, old tools from the local secondhand market that just need a new handle because the metal is actually fine (and probably better than some new stuff), and kit that can be revisited rather than replaced.

I was horrified when I went looking for a replacement axe handle in a couple of major retailers. They don't sell them, not even wedges for repair. When questioned the reply was, throw out the old axe head and buy a new axe !

How we use our environment covers such a broad context.The fuel we use, the signs we leave, the consumables we 'suck' up. Have you ever looked at the stuff people throw out at your local tip, or the stack of scrapped cars at the local breakers that are in better nick than the one you drive (sorry, off topic irritation starting to show now - not because of my car, it is old and basic and I love it, but because of the shear WASTE!)

Interesting topic...and worth pricking the conscience every now and again.

K

 

[RonW]

Want to do a fun exercise?
Retrace just one trip to its very source. And I mean every step of the way from leaving your frontdoor to returning there.
Where does the car come from? What was needed to get it to your place?
Where does your gear come from? What was needed to get it to your place?
What was needed for you to get out there, doing what you did and getting home again?

Follow back the entire logistical chain, every step from the collecting of raw materials, the manufacturing, the commercial aspect and all the transports inbetween. I am sure it'll be an eyeopener. Burning that handful of twigs might not seem so much of an issue after that.

 

[Fadcode]

It's alright talking about waste etc, but if you look at it another way, if there was no waste, we wouldn't have a need for shops, car dealers, etc, etc, it's the same with the environment if we don't use it we will lose it, if we stopped going to Zoo's, safari parks, stately homes, they would all disappear. As long as waste is controlled then there is nothing wrong with it, and as long as we act in a responsible manner then we have nothing to answer for, the biggest waste is the motor car, but shamefully it is a necessary evil,

People moan about footfall on mountains, through woods etc, by people using them there is at least a modicum of maintenance carried out, come down to Cornwall and walk in the neglected forests here, you will see nothing but decay and disease in the trees, they are basically unsafe to travel through.The ones that are looked after are only looked after because they usually have a shop or some sort of museum in them, and people are charged to enter, and of course the car park fees, it's funny people complain about people walking through forests,and up hills, but never complained about the loss of natural habitat when trees were taken out to accommodate car parks, etc.
Get out and enjoy nature whilst you still can, love it like your Mother.
.

 

[kawasemi]

It's alright talking about waste etc, but if you look at it another way, if there was no waste, we wouldn't have a need for shops, car dealers, etc, etc, it's the same with the environment if we don't use it we will lose it, if we stopped going to Zoo's, safari parks, stately homes, they would all disappear. As long as waste is controlled then there is nothing wrong with it, and as long as we act in a responsible manner then we have nothing to answer for, the biggest waste is the motor car, but shamefully it is a necessary evil,

People moan about footfall on mountains, through woods etc, by people using them there is at least a modicum of maintenance carried out, come down to Cornwall and walk in the neglected forests here, you will see nothing but decay and disease in the trees, they are basically unsafe to travel through.The ones that are looked after are only looked after because they usually have a shop or some sort of museum in them, and people are charged to enter, and of course the car park fees, it's funny people complain about people walking through forests,and up hills, but never complained about the loss of natural habitat when trees were taken out to accommodate car parks, etc.
Get out and enjoy nature whilst you still can, love it like your Mother.
.

You are right, but there is the fine balance between use and abuse. It is okay to use resources and the infrastructure that supports them but with an understanding of the expense/long term impact? As a (long in the tooth) teacher of Geography I can tell you that to say we are using the world's resources at a rate of 3.5 planets worth is not social media hype or 'agency' spin.

If your TV doesn't have the latest 'all singing/all dancing do-dad to watch in glowing super colour' do you need to throw it out just to support the TV manufacturing industry and their ideas for more sales? Did we have to throw away 10 year old cars to support making more of them even if they are perfectly good but the powers that be say we should? Unfortunately, it will take a radical rethink on how we work and how we maintain society/jobs.

K

 

[Wayland]

There is the old story about a beach covered with washed up starfish and a little girl picking them up and putting them back in the sea, one by one.

An old man comes up to her and says "There is no point doing that, you can't possibly save them all."

So she picks up another and puts it in the water before saying "I saved that one though."

 

[Broch]

There is the old story about a beach covered with washed up starfish and a little girl picking them up and putting them back in the sea, one by one.

An old man comes up to her and says "There is no point doing that, you can't possibly save them all."

So she picks up another and puts it in the water before saying "I saved that one though."

Mmm.. except it comes from Buddhist teachings and is a master and tutee on a storm swept beach (I wouldn't want the Buddhist history in the story to be lost).

I agree though, every little bit helps.

 

[Wayland]

I didn't know it was a koan. Thank you for that.

 

[Broch]

People moan about footfall on mountains, through woods etc, by people using them there is at least a modicum of maintenance carried out, come down to Cornwall and walk in the neglected forests here, you will see nothing but decay and disease in the trees, they are basically unsafe to travel through.

I have a tickle in the back of my brain that tells me you and I have had this conversation before - but I may be wrong.

That's exactly how forests should be; they should be dangerous, they should contain all the little dark wild beasts that are not 'popular' and only lurk in dank damp places. We should not be manicuring our country to make it easy for people who don't care to go in and say 'look at all those lovely wild flowers' when all that's there are primroses and bluebells.

 

[Wayland]

That is exactly the biodiversity that is being lost.

 

[Fadcode]

I have a tickle in the back of my brain that tells me you and I have had this conversation before - but I may be wrong.

That's exactly how forests should be; they should be dangerous, they should contain all the little dark wild beasts that are not 'popular' and only lurk in dank damp places. We should not be manicuring our country to make it easy for people who don't care to go in and say 'look at all those lovely wild flowers' when all that's there are primroses and bluebells.

I can only assume that you are against Blind and disabled people enjoying the countryside, because without a little manicuring these people have no access to it at all, and if a forest is a dangerous place, then people wont be allowed to go in, so they will never learn to care.

 

[Wayland]

 

[Tengu]

https://www.biodiversitylibrary.org/item/257213#page/7/mode/1up

This is life Before plastic.

The author is very interesting and scholarly (And pious)

He constantly tells us;

WASTE IS A SIN

 

[kawasemi]

I can only assume that you are against Blind and disabled people enjoying the countryside, because without a little manicuring these people have no access to it at all, and if a forest is a dangerous place, then people wont be allowed to go in, so they will never learn to care.

 

[Broch]

I can only assume that you are against Blind and disabled people enjoying the countryside, because without a little manicuring these people have no access to it at all, and if a forest is a dangerous place, then people wont be allowed to go in, so they will never learn to care.

, no not at all; but there are plenty of manicured areas that people can go. I have never campaigned for step ladders to be installed at Echo Wall or Overshadow but they are, as are most others, well beyond my rock-climbing capability. I have never complained that they are only accessible to an elite group of people - nor would I. I don't see a campaign for a railway line up Ben Nevis getting very far either. And I won't be complaining that places I have been able to go in the past are no longer accessible because of my age and physical ability either.

I was not suggesting that everywhere should be left to 'wild over' - just that what we have left, that is anything like wild, should be left or at least managed for its sake and not mankind's. As I said earlier, if 66 million people decided or were persuaded to go into the countryside it would be an environmental disaster.

 

[TLM]

One thought on recycling, cotton is bad that we know but there is a kind of alternative. Regenerated cellulose fibers if made fine enough are a very good substitute for cotton. Can be manufactured by a closed process with no too dangerous chemicals. In theory once your T-shirt is just too old and tattered it could be resolved and made into reasonable grade fibre again. The virgin cellulose could be produced from many plants all requiring a lot less natural resources than cotton. This idea is not without some repercussions, a lot of cotton farmers would be out of work. Maybe Lake Aral would get to full size again.

 

[Tengu]

But, do we need to consume so much fibre anyway?

My clothed are used until they get past it. Then they are sent to the local garage to use as rag.

How much clothing in this country is hardly used?

 

[TLM]

Recycling should be done to as high grade material as possible, the worst option is to burn all organic. No we don't need to consume all that much textile fiber but we do.

 

[Broch]

I'm not sure I like where this is going

 

[TLM]

Well, one can always postpone the buying of something. Maybe.

 

[Fadcode]

Its a matter of balance, and we always have to look at the big picture, Do we need so many clothes, is it better to have, lets say 2 complete outfits and wash one every day, or have 6 or 7 and wash them once a week.
Ask any woman why she needs 12 pairs of shoes.......LOL
Governments need to step up too, How much waste was there when we changed from analogue to digital TV's.and the proposed ban on petrol and diesel cars by 2030, if not sooner.
Large swathes of the Highlands are going to be fenced off, to protect trees, which will have a detrimental effect on the deer population, as well as other wildlife, they are also pushing to give mountain hares legal status for protection, despite their large numbers and the damage to crops they cause, as well as the diseases they carry.
these proposals are in the Animal and Wildlife Bill , which is due for debate in Holyrood tomorrow.
Very soon we wont have any countryside left to wander about in.