Hoard of Iron Age gold coins found in East Anglia

[mr dazzler]

well theres a lot of metal detectorist's operate in East Anglia, I see a few nearly every day. They quite often have flashy cars (volvo's, BM's etc) not the grubby white transit you might of expected. I think they are more likely to find nuts and bolts that fell off tractors and combine's, than gold coins, but good luck to them

 

[launditch1]

I am a keen metal detectorist and as usual the same old dull arguments are being wheeled out on here..would you prefer these objects to rot in the ground?There is alot we can learn from our past and its a sad world if you would prefer to see it bulldozed over and built on!Its also a bit of a sweeping generalization that detectorists have flashy cars,most are probably retired or have worked hard for them.Its doubtful they have been bought by the profits of their ill gotten gains of selling finds.Back to the topic,it was a fantastic,once in a lifetime find and i bet the landowner and the finder are very happy.Iceni gold staters are magical things to hold, im well jealous!!As for some of the comments on here?Im reminded of Tony robinson....

 

[mr dazzler]

I am a keen metal detectorist and as usual the same old dull arguments are being wheeled out on here..would you prefer these objects to rot in the ground?There is alot we can learn from our past and its a sad world if you would prefer to see it bulldozed over and built on!Its also a bit of a sweeping generalization that detectorists have flashy cars,most are probably retired or have worked hard for them.Its doubtful they have been bought by the profits of their ill gotten gains of selling finds.Back to the topic,it was a fantastic,once in a lifetime find and i bet the landowner and the finder are very happy.Iceni gold staters are magical things to hold, im well jealous!!As for some of the comments on here?Im reminded of Tony robinson....

In Britain they have been "bulldozing over and building on" for thousands of years, its not a new phenomenon
And I said they "quite often" have flashy cars, not that they were all using them . I go out a lot drawing and taking photos and I see them all around here parked up while they walk the fields. And why not theres nothing wrong with a nice car, I own 2 myself! I never said (or implied) that they were the result of illicit trading of stuff they dug up one dark night Thats your sudgestion, not mine
I am honestly not bothered one way or another if the "artifacts" rot in the ground, plenty already did, many more will. Maybe we can learn things from our past, but I have to ask what use or relevance does it have today

 

[launditch1]

..Youre right.History is pointless and irrelavent.Get rid of the British museum and sell off the collections,its only full of junk that tells us nothing..build a nice shopping mall instead.

 

[mr dazzler]

well apart from that rather pointless outburst of hyperbole what relevance does history have today? What does it tell us that is useful? I was asking a sincere question because I do not know any more.
As for the British museum, I went in there once or twice many years ago, a lot of the stuff was greek or egyptian and extremely boring, maybe they should give it all back and apologise, I dont know what would be left after that?

 

[gregorach]

Maybe we can learn things from our past, but I have to ask what use or relevance does it have today

Start taking that line of argument and you end up burning all the libraries. I mean, fiction? What use or relevance does that have? Heck, can someone please explain to me the use or relevance of bushcraft? Yet here we all are... (And lets not forget that without history, archaeology and anthropology, there would be no bushcraft, in the UK at least.)

Things can be cool and interesting in their own right. Just because you personally don't find them so doesn't mean that nobody else does. I, for one, would be perfectly happy to see all team sports expunged from reality - but I don't expect other people to agree with me.

If you're not interested in the subject, why are you even posting in this thread? What use or relevance does it have?

 

[launditch1]

To wind me up!!
Anyway IM interested in this story and i await the overinflated valuation report in the newspapers!Lucky,lucky so and so!
Ive also learnt a new word today..Hyperbole!

 

[gregorach]

Hang on a minute mr dazzler - you've previously asked about an Anglo Saxon calendar on this very site, and received an answer - so even you clearly have an interest in the results of historical research.

 

[mr dazzler]

Hang on a minute greg I said I dont know any more. I have seriously asked myself (and on this thread) what relevance does history have, and you havent given an answer that is convincing. So what if I asked about the saxon calndar, I only wanted to know its whearabouts or see a picture of it. It doesnt imply I am bothered about "historical research" (written and published theories about it-which is a seperate industry)

 

[launditch1]

OT i know,but is this what you was after?
http://www.trin.cam.ac.uk/sdk13/ASCalendar/ASCalendar.html

 

[gregorach]

I have seriously asked myself (and on this thread) what relevance does history have, and you havent given an answer that is convincing.

It's fascinating. What more do you need?

If you really need something else, it's worth considering that it's impossible to fully understand the present without understanding how we got here, and that "Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."

Please don't tell me that you're one of those strict utilitarians, for whom everything must have a clearly defined economic pay-off to have any value. Knowledge and learning are valuable in their own right.

 

[w00dsmoke]

I have seriously asked myself (and on this thread) what relevance does history have, and you havent given an answer that is convincing.

North Korea rings a bell here...

Even though you are not aware of it and don't know it, history gave us our cultural and social values, beliefs, identity and practices that we have today.

 

[mr dazzler]

Knowledge and learning are valuable in their own right.

Valuable to who (or what) though? Fair enough comment, its your opinion. But its still a fact that there is only a minority as think like that. And what if I was a "utilitarian", is that repulsive or something ? How would you feel if for instance the footballers got paid from public money? Greg, please dont tell me your one of those who believes in the supremacy of the endless open state chequebook, and the legitimacy of imposing punative taxes to cover it Surely there has to be a sensible balnace of the 2 extremes somehow?

 

[Pang]

history and artifacts have alot to offer us, other then just for our amusement. Wefind alot of modern day politics are centered on historical events or artifacts. i.e. Tibet, taiwan, northern ireland etc... are all highly dispute political hot pots, becasue of the history of who owns what and for how long etc... We even find countries bickering over historical artifacts, such as the Greek, with the countless statues the british took back home and with the Eygptians over their gold.

just my two cents, by no means am i a qualified historian

 

[Pict]

Unfortunately part of the reason hoards do go unreported is that the finders fee is significantly less than the market value of the object, despite what is claimed.

That was my thinking on this as well. You have to do something to remove the temptation to just shut up about it and live like a king. I understand the right of the state to claim such things for all but they should pony up the cash to make it reasonable. I have a house I'm paying off, a kid going to college next year and bills to pay. If I suddenly came into a literal pot of gold I'd be sorely tempted. I'd probably end up turning it in but only after the initial euphoria turned into a month of bad sleep.

I do think it is intensely cool that you all live in an area with such a long history. Here on the east coast the oldest homes still standing are about 300 years old, amazing in itself but you guys have hill forts and Roman ruins. That's cool. Mac

 

[mr dazzler]

history and artifacts have alot to offer us, other then just for our amusement. Wefind alot of modern day politics are centered on historical events or artifacts. i.e. Tibet, taiwan, northern ireland etc... are all highly dispute political hot pots, becasue of the history of who owns what and for how long etc... We even find countries bickering over historical artifacts, such as the Greek, with the countless statues the british took back home and with the Eygptians over their gold.

just my two cents, by no means am i a qualified historian

Neither am I (a qualified historian), and I didnt think you had to be to hold an opinion . And besides I get the feeling that in some instances there are conflicting versions of events, or when there is revisionism for instance, to alter an accepted version so it can be perceived differently, to suit various religious or political motives and agenda's. Historians are human, and they each have their various personal convictions and preferences and it must be hard if not actually impossible to be truly impartial. As you said a while back Greg-we are all biased.....

 

[Toddy]

Finding gold is not the value.
I excavated a broken saddle quern. Used daily to grind grain for their bread. Worn to shape by the work of someone working at it, day in day out. The context put that quern at around 2,500 bce. That means that someone made and used it four and a half thousand years ago.
It tells us other things too though; it means they were farming grain suitable for grinding for flour. It tells us that they were tilling the land, and they were trading, or otherwise in contact with a farming network that stretched from the Fertile Crescent all the way to rural Lanarkshire, for the grains are not native to the British Isles.
To have grain, they had health and resources enough to support a population capable of opening up the land for farming, a knowledge of the seasons the skills to make the tools that allowed them to plough, plant, cut and harvest their crops.

We found the evidences of their houses and their hearths, the pollen record showed the effects that their farming and lifestyles had on the surrounding woodlands. The few bones found in their site told us a little more about their husbandry, and their hunting. The flint scatters and the tiny flint cores told us about another trading network, flint is not native here either............so what did they have that was valuable enough to trade over distance to exchange ?

And the story goes on, and on.
Supposing this had been a hoard site, ripped apart for the few scraps of metal, for truthfully that's all gold is, and it's relatively common in the Earth's crust. We would have had none of the context that allows the details to be recorded, properly analysed. None of the undamaged stratigraphy.

As I said, good metal detectorists are excellent. The few selfish ones are a destructive force that blights the historical record, and the past belongs to us all, not just a few thieving blighters.

cheers,
Toddy

 

[firecrest]

well I dont metal detect....but you're going to hate me for this Toddy

If I found that site with its lovely quern and stories from Bce, and it had a pot of gold in it, I would have ripped the whole damn place up and made off with it. And the end of the day learning about what we did thousands of years ago is nice, fascinating and awe inspiring, but not as much fun and awe-inspiring as the experience those bits of metal can buy me!
Indeed it is selfish, but like I said, if the reward for handing it was as great as the blackmarket value, people would hand these things in. Instead it is taken from them, they are investigated every which way to see if the money has to be paid, and then you get about 10%.
I read a case in australia where some people found an ancient ostrich egg used by aborigine people thousands of years ago. The state said it belonged to them and they were not entitled to a reward. SO they reburied it, and good on them. Told the museum to go find it themselves.

 

[firecrest]

well I dont metal detect....but you're going to hate me for this Toddy

If I found that site with its lovely quern and stories from Bce, and it had a pot of gold in it, I would have ripped the whole damn place up and made off with it. And the end of the day learning about what we did thousands of years ago is nice, fascinating and awe inspiring, but not as much fun and awe-inspiring as the experience those bits of metal can buy me!
Indeed it is selfish, but like I said, if the reward for handing it was as great as the blackmarket value, people would hand these things in. Instead it is taken from them, they are investigated every which way to see if the money has to be paid, and then you get about 10%.
I read a case in australia where some people found an ancient ostrich egg used by aborigine people thousands of years ago. The state said it belonged to them and they were not entitled to a reward. SO they reburied it, and good on them. Told the museum to go find it themselves.

As I said, good metal detectorists are excellent. The few selfish ones are a destructive force that blights the historical record, and the past belongs to us all, not just a few thieving blighters.
It is true the past belongs to all of us, but so does the present. The individual has been stolen from enough by the real theives out there. so long as the banks can lose my money and landowners own vast swathes of the country for their own pleasure then any gold I find Im taking.

 

[Toddy]

I can't agree Firecrest, no hate you understand, just a kind of sadness that you would do such a thing.

Why should someone take the gold ? It's theft, theft from all of us.
I agree that the full market value is not given, but I also know that many play on this to claim a kind of twisted justification for what they do. In actual fact the 'value' they claim from their sales is a pittance......otherwise they would have to pay taxes just as they would on the treasure trove funds they say are insufficient return for their efforts.

Toddy