Fox hunting, banned.
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No worries ... it was just a friendly reminder!mr dazzler said:
MPs, well, they are paid to be interested. At the very least you can nowadays easily drop them an email saying that if they vote one way or another they can count of your support ot count on losing it.
That's how the system works here in the UK ... we might think that voting on online polls and on Sky News or whatever makes a difference but the only vote that really makes a difference is the one you do in the ballot box.
may be so-but my mp is Mr Blair
He's shown plenty of times he's unwilling to listen (unless it'll make good pr)
Why did he go to war in Iraq if he listens to people, even in his own party, never mind ones who didnt vote for him?
Didn't the CA get militant because "mp's" were ignoring their interests?
Just a thought not aimed at anyone personally.
He's shown plenty of times he's unwilling to listen (unless it'll make good pr)
Why did he go to war in Iraq if he listens to people, even in his own party, never mind ones who didnt vote for him?
Didn't the CA get militant because "mp's" were ignoring their interests?
Just a thought not aimed at anyone personally.
it isn't the Pms job to do what the poeple want but to do what he or she thinks is best for the poeple. the two aren't always the same
1. I was under the impression that fox hunting only contolled a relitively small number compared to farmers shooting. So i wouldnt think there would be an explosion in numbers.
2. Couldnt answer the second question
3. Well, should stay the same, unless i'm wrong and fox numbers do increase. If they would increase then it would be damaging on certain creatures, but nature has its way of sorting that problem out.
Jake
2. Couldnt answer the second question
3. Well, should stay the same, unless i'm wrong and fox numbers do increase. If they would increase then it would be damaging on certain creatures, but nature has its way of sorting that problem out.
Jake
I would say that the fox population is already on the increase and has been for the past 10 - 20 years in these parts, with foxes also coming out of the countryside and into towns and villages where the pickings are easier. I can now walk in towns here in Wales and see and smell fox sign. Just as we press against their habitat, they are pressing in on ours.
I can't help but feel that it won't be long before the public turn against them (especially once they start preying on pets) and we'll see culls (look at how we are still culling badgers over vague TB connections).
I think that the lack of a natural predator could well be a problem, maybe not now but in years to come.
I can't help but feel that it won't be long before the public turn against them (especially once they start preying on pets) and we'll see culls (look at how we are still culling badgers over vague TB connections).
I think that the lack of a natural predator could well be a problem, maybe not now but in years to come.
(I may be incorrect here) If there was no predator then the foxes numbers would increase, making prey numbers decrease, eventuall the numbers of prey would be insufficient for the numbers of foxes. Numbers of foxes would then decrease? But then i suppose that doesnt help, cos if their moving into cities.....
But the fox hunting ban wouldnt have effected anything in a big way IMO, just for the numbers of foxes being hunted down.
But the fox hunting ban wouldnt have effected anything in a big way IMO, just for the numbers of foxes being hunted down.
It's hard to answer those, Jack. I'm not sure exactly how the hunt worked as vermin control up til now...
I'd be interested to know the relationship between the landowner and the local hunt. Does he say to the hunt 'I've got a fox problem can you come sort it out?' or does the hunt just make a "sweep" of the area every now and then??? :?:
I'd be interested to know the relationship between the landowner and the local hunt. Does he say to the hunt 'I've got a fox problem can you come sort it out?' or does the hunt just make a "sweep" of the area every now and then??? :?:
Although hunting and shooting do kill quite a few foxes, this is nothing compared to the numbers killed on british roads. So it really depends on the foxes adapting as the threat gets bigger with the increase in roads and traffic. I've seen quite a few urban foxes with good road sense though.... even looking both ways before crossing.
Ed
I dunno if this is going to muddy the waters or not but i will post anyway just to broaden the subject here
Seems to me firstly that it is in a dogs nature to hunt things
Indeed they have been bred and encouraged as hunting aids for generations
From deerhounds and wolfhounds, lurchers, daschund (dax badger, hund dog) and even jack russels and terriers for ratting
Quite how legislation is intended to curb a dogs natural inclinations I'm not exactly sure, might as well make piddling on lamp posts a fineable offence IMHO
If your dog chases a rabbit does this make you guilty of a crime?
Amazing double standards come into play here too in an age where parents are not responsible for their children (and children are not responsible for themselves either hence the youth courts) but it seems dog owners are responsible for their dogs
Curiously cat owners are not responsible for their cats (unless you are talking big cats but again that is different)
On the issue of foxhunting, where it is a deliberately organised attempt to massacre one or more foxes on a given day i have to say that considering the costs of keeping hounds and horses it is neither an economic or effective method of control
In this day and age however where it is very difficult indeed to obtain a firearms license (shotgun license is marginally easier but only by a whisker) what options are available?
Poison is indescriminate, trapping doesnt work too well are we to ignore these predators?
On a little sideline i would love to see wolves re introduced but i dont think they would catch foxes out of preference either and that is a whole new can of worms anyway
But back to dogs, it seems the current government thinks that they should all be cuddly walt disney type characters that eat spaghetti and sing love songs
Meanwhile back in the real world...............
I dont think fox populations will explode, maybe in cities but landowners and farmers will continue to shoot them with much more effect than hunting ever had
If city dwellers (and MP's) choose to believe that Mr Fox is also a disney type character then they may be in for a shock. I can hear the outraged cries already when pet bunny / kitty / puppy or whatever gets viciously attacked in suburban gardens. Wheelie bins it seems are already taking away free meals from foxes. Watch this space ........... What are they supposed to eat when they are hungry?
So back to the hunting with dogs issue
I am sorry to see tradition threatened, but i guess foxhunting along with bull fighting and other similar "sports" have reached the end of their respectability
My main fear is that having banned hunting with dogs we are in danger of losing another skill. OK i cant see too many bushcrafters on foxhunts, but putting lurchers in the same bracket starts raising my hackles
Personally i feel there are other animals more worthy of all the attention, introduced mink are vicious and indescriminate killers too and a very real threat to our native wildlife, as are domestic cats. Sadly nobody makes money out of song thrushes and blackbirds so the ravages continue unabated
Yeah i rambled on enough now, time to let others have their say
Tant
p.s I dont really have a russian pit bull, it was just a bit of my unusual humour again. I dont even know if they exist
Seems to me firstly that it is in a dogs nature to hunt things
Indeed they have been bred and encouraged as hunting aids for generations
From deerhounds and wolfhounds, lurchers, daschund (dax badger, hund dog) and even jack russels and terriers for ratting
Quite how legislation is intended to curb a dogs natural inclinations I'm not exactly sure, might as well make piddling on lamp posts a fineable offence IMHO
If your dog chases a rabbit does this make you guilty of a crime?
Amazing double standards come into play here too in an age where parents are not responsible for their children (and children are not responsible for themselves either hence the youth courts) but it seems dog owners are responsible for their dogs
Curiously cat owners are not responsible for their cats (unless you are talking big cats but again that is different)
On the issue of foxhunting, where it is a deliberately organised attempt to massacre one or more foxes on a given day i have to say that considering the costs of keeping hounds and horses it is neither an economic or effective method of control
In this day and age however where it is very difficult indeed to obtain a firearms license (shotgun license is marginally easier but only by a whisker) what options are available?
Poison is indescriminate, trapping doesnt work too well are we to ignore these predators?
On a little sideline i would love to see wolves re introduced but i dont think they would catch foxes out of preference either and that is a whole new can of worms anyway
But back to dogs, it seems the current government thinks that they should all be cuddly walt disney type characters that eat spaghetti and sing love songs
Meanwhile back in the real world...............
I dont think fox populations will explode, maybe in cities but landowners and farmers will continue to shoot them with much more effect than hunting ever had
If city dwellers (and MP's) choose to believe that Mr Fox is also a disney type character then they may be in for a shock. I can hear the outraged cries already when pet bunny / kitty / puppy or whatever gets viciously attacked in suburban gardens. Wheelie bins it seems are already taking away free meals from foxes. Watch this space ........... What are they supposed to eat when they are hungry?
So back to the hunting with dogs issue
I am sorry to see tradition threatened, but i guess foxhunting along with bull fighting and other similar "sports" have reached the end of their respectability
My main fear is that having banned hunting with dogs we are in danger of losing another skill. OK i cant see too many bushcrafters on foxhunts, but putting lurchers in the same bracket starts raising my hackles
Personally i feel there are other animals more worthy of all the attention, introduced mink are vicious and indescriminate killers too and a very real threat to our native wildlife, as are domestic cats. Sadly nobody makes money out of song thrushes and blackbirds so the ravages continue unabated
Yeah i rambled on enough now, time to let others have their say
Tant
p.s I dont really have a russian pit bull, it was just a bit of my unusual humour again. I dont even know if they exist
I don't know anything about fox hunting in Britain but why should I let that stop me from putting in my tuppence (is that a word :?: )? :wave:
I guess I'm just wondering why they didn't try to regulate fox hunting to reduce some of the apparently more disagreeable aspects of the sport, instead of an outright ban?
To be honest, as an otsider, this sport appears to me to be a remnant of the monarchy, and is mainly class based. Eh? Here in the colonies, we hunt and trap fox, but it's mainly a blue collar activity, not one for the rich folks. Lots of folks do it mainly just to add to their income. Also, like many other societies, hunting and trapping are also part of our heritage. I appreciate the fact that some things continue on in society simply because they are traditional, a reminder of the past. And sometimes, that ain't a bad thing.
I guess I'm just wondering why they didn't try to regulate fox hunting to reduce some of the apparently more disagreeable aspects of the sport, instead of an outright ban?
To be honest, as an otsider, this sport appears to me to be a remnant of the monarchy, and is mainly class based. Eh? Here in the colonies, we hunt and trap fox, but it's mainly a blue collar activity, not one for the rich folks. Lots of folks do it mainly just to add to their income. Also, like many other societies, hunting and trapping are also part of our heritage. I appreciate the fact that some things continue on in society simply because they are traditional, a reminder of the past. And sometimes, that ain't a bad thing.
Hi...
I voted 'Undecided' cause we can't know if the animal suffers or not. I have been growing up in a horse environment (unfortunately) and not in a hunting, but as I live on the country, we have many hunters out here, mostly the farmers.
Love to hunt, but perhaps it stresses the animal if 20 dogs are running close to it's tail, and finally decides to kill it. But have only seen it on telly, so I really can't say. :roll:
My "way of killing animals" sounds like this: I only kill it if it's necessary. I don't take more than I need/can eat and will always do my best to kill it quick, so it won't feel a thing!
Cheers,
ack:
I voted 'Undecided' cause we can't know if the animal suffers or not. I have been growing up in a horse environment (unfortunately) and not in a hunting, but as I live on the country, we have many hunters out here, mostly the farmers.
Love to hunt, but perhaps it stresses the animal if 20 dogs are running close to it's tail, and finally decides to kill it. But have only seen it on telly, so I really can't say. :roll:
My "way of killing animals" sounds like this: I only kill it if it's necessary. I don't take more than I need/can eat and will always do my best to kill it quick, so it won't feel a thing!
Cheers,
ack:
i guess the argument is that foxes do need to be killed
just not like they do at foxhunts
quite agree with you about trying to keep suffering to a minimum andy
Tant
just not like they do at foxhunts
quite agree with you about trying to keep suffering to a minimum andy
Tant
So? .. we reintroduce bearsAdi007 said:
Actually we can make a very good guess ... we would suffer if it was us and the foxes psychological and biological make up is pretty much no different to ours .. so therefore it's instinctive and impulsive responses will be similar to ours ... and i don't fancy being hunted by dogsTheViking said:
Nothing *NEEDS* to be killed ... it's all down to perception .. our own survival instincts driving us to destroy the competition ....... if we are to be brutally honest and ask who is the biggest threat and pest on this planet .. it is us ..... society is driven by the basic motive of our own fears ..... our insecurities built and maintain our civilisation ... the root motive is fear as a genetic inheritance ... an existential fear which we all share and communicate ..... Jung called it the collective unconscious... our unconscious fears talk to each other and we on the whole are blissfully ignorant and in denial ..... we fear all competition .. it's in our genes .. a part of the animal in us ... that causes us to killTantalus said:
I believe the number of each animal must be kept down. By this I don't mean low, but down to the standard of how many there is.Simon said:
If hunters didn't exist, the woods would be crowded with foxes. But, as said: the pain must be kept to a minimum!
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