Can of worms..

[HillBill]

Good point, and I'm sorry to say I didn't think of that. I didn't want to press my opinion on anyone, it just seems to me at times that people go for "I've seen RM do it, it's bushcraft" or treat an outing like a holiday, some seem to sit there in their deck chair in the woods watching the world go by - which must be nice, but to my mind isn't bushcraft, you're neither learning or using any skills. Perhaps such a person lit their fire with a firesteel, but apart from that he/she might as well join the camping and caravan club......


Of course this is only my opinion, and I don't intend to change anyone's ways / views at all, my point is mearly - it's not really bushcraft, in my opinion

When you think about it, Using a tarp and bivvi/hammock etc isn't bushcraft. It is substituting shelter building. Although in this country it is unavoidable 95% of the time due to lack of sustainable resources. IMO bushcraft is a skill set and broad range of knowledge, but not an activity in itself. Camping is an activity which benefits greatly from the skills and knowledge of bushcraft. Even spending a night in the woods is camping of sorts.

 

[novembeRain]

I take a folding chair with me as my knees are shot,I couldn't spend a weekend without it.
At the welsh meets in cowbridge we have to take in water as there is none there not even a puddle.
I can see that you don't want to come across as arrogant and that to you thats the way it should be,but we all see it the way we think it should be and we're all different.
As Hillbill says don't go out to see what others are using,go out to enjoy yourself.

Fair enough, if there weren't streams I'd take water. And if I really needed to, I'd grudgingly take a seat of some sort.

Wayland, As I said, it could be cut down even more. I could do without the axe and the saw but at the moment I'm learning how to use the axe properly and the saw gets me bits of wood to play with without being too noisy (unfortunately, no permission). And, above all, I don't claim to be the most skilled of bushcrafters.

I don't think I've put this across very well to be honest, without wanting to impose on anyone's prefferences or opinions, it seems strange to me to see the ammount of kit some take with them, especially seeing as having everything neglates the need to use most of the skills that I'd associate with bushcraft.

 

[Barney]

I had a few good chats with Mors about bushcraft last year (he was prepared to stay up very late and get up very early) and the differences in approaches between Britain and other countries, He laughed and told me that we(brits)were more interested in carving spoons than learning about the plants around us. He seemed to find it tricky to understand but he accepted it. A couple of weeks ago I was having some similar thoughts to yourself about bushcraft and some bushcraft people and where they appeared(to Me) to fit into the bushcraft triangle. Unkowingly, I was having the same effect on some other people and was taken to task over my Austrailian cowboy hat and my ventile smock. The hat is the best one I ever had its waterproof and keeps the rain off my glasses and the ventile smock is worn round the fire when felling trees and carrying wood etc is also wetherproof and extremely quiet when night time bimbling(which is important to me)Laughably I paid more for the goretex cycling jacket I turned up in than I did for the ventile.. I also used my new shing knife it was throwing sparks like mad, I battoned with it all day on the blade, the handle and the end of the handle. I feel sorry for the people who keep good knives like that in a draw covered in wax. I ended up saying I buy good kit where I can afford to and when i can see its advantages, but its still for using.

Do your own thing, try to learn from and find people who are into sharing the same type of experience that you are, its not worth the hassle and mental torment otherwise. There are some clued up kiddies on here and an expert in just about every field of craft you care to name.

 

[w00dsmoke]

Status, economics, gender, accent, social connections are all intermingled in a mileu of complicated social rules and values that dictate who you connect to or want to connect to for whatever personal reason. Most people are astute enough to realise that this operates in every avenue of life that you are in and can spot "fakes" for want of a better word for the show offs, the arrogant I got the gear but really no idea lot and can easily warm to the genuine people who do not let the superficial be a barrier to connect people from ALL backgrounds and find common ground.

I'll give you an example, when I was driving through glasgow in an old battered Golf which was legally held together with gaffa tape , it broke down in one of the buisiest town centre roads and only one guy puilled over to help and he drove a big fancy black jag, he wore a suit and looked every part a respectable businessman;he got out and helped me push the car to a side street in the pouring rain and I was taken aback at this guys kindness. So don't judge a book by it's cover, but by it's content and let a man (or woman ) be judged by not what he (she) owns but by their actions.

 

[Barney]

And before I forget -----------the pig roast. This was probably the single most thought provoking item that occurred on both occasions that I witnessed it.

How clever are some ancient peoples that they figured out how to dig a pit and cook on hot rocks and then walk away rather than stand there for twelve bleeding hours turning a handle and clodding half a tonne of wood and charcole at it.

 

[hammock monkey]

is the whole point of going out into the sticks to "bushcraft"?.... thats just missing the point.

do not concentrate on the finger and miss all that heaven-wee gwor-wee.

 

[novembeRain]

Status, economics, gender, accent, social connections are all intermingled in a mileu of complicated social rules and values that dictate who you connect to or want to connect to for whatever personal reason. Most people are astute enough to realise that this operates in every avenue of life that you are in and can spot "fakes" for want of a better word for the show offs, the arrogant I got the gear but really no idea lot and can easily warm to the genuine people who do not let the superficial be a barrier to connect people from ALL backgrounds and find common ground.

I'll give you an example, when I was driving through glasgow in an old battered Golf which was legally held together with gaffa tape , it broke down in one of the buisiest town centre roads and only one guy puilled over to help and he drove a big fancy black jag, he wore a suit and looked every part a respectable businessman;he got out and helped me push the car to a side street in the pouring rain and I was taken aback at this guys kindness. So don't judge a book by it's cover, but by it's content and let a man (or woman ) be judged by not what he (she) owns but by their actions.

Blimey that's all a bit thoughtful

 

[Hammock_man]

I have read this thread so far with great interest and think its going to end up with pages of comments. None of the comments below are intended to be a dig at anyone but are merely my 2 penny worth, if even worth that much.

For me, I'm too old to be uncomfortable any more. I got my first hammock for a bit of a laugh, but now, just can not go back to a tent. I like to use a hobo wood stove as I am too lazy to collect a ton of wood for a cup of tea. I think a hobo stove is more efficient but I really use it because I’m lazy. 2 logs don’t make an evening fire, 2 branches will give a lovely big fire in a hobo.

Notwithstanding the hammock, I would try a hand made shelter in the woods. I would love to set to with my daughter and make 2 of them, sleep comfortable and add it to life’s experience. BUT, if 20 people in a month came down the woods and built their shelters, the “wood” would feel the pain. Yes the branches could be recycled but I think more than a few would be cut fresh. If 20 hammocks where hung with tree huggers who would know? I think we have to bring some kit in with us so we can take it out and leave no trace. Use a log as a seat is fine, but I need to know I will have a seat in advance.

I enjoy eating rat packs in the woods. I don’t think they taste too bad at all but I know I can cook better. But I put a cardboard box into to my pack and I am sorted for a day.

Am I camping, is it bushcraft, is it playing at being someone else? I know I like it, I know its good for the soul and I know I will keep coming back to this web site for a little daily “fix”

 

[spamel]

I may have taken a lot of kit to the last Midlands meet, but I stayed dry and was able to see the whole weekend out. You are running other people down, yet you yourself suffered for a night and jacked it in. Why didn't you dry your kit by the fire and make a bed from moss and twigs? Sometimes, we learn that taking more kit to ensure our comfort enables us to have a more fulfilling time during our hobby time, a time which is precious to many of us. If you wish to struggle and not fully enjoy your free time, then that is fine. Not sure what the point in this thread is though.

 

[Peter_t]

imo there are way too many sheep in bushcraft, for example gransfors axes. having the best kit does not make you good at bushcraft. 'all the gear, no idea' i would like to see more variety instead of nothing but gransfors. i cant for the life of me understand spending hundreds of pounds on expensive kit then there are cheeper alternatives that are just as good.

pete

 

[decorum]

How clever are some ancient peoples that they figured out how to dig a pit and cook on hot rocks and then walk away rather than stand there for twelve bleeding hours turning a handle and clodding half a tonne of wood and charcole at it.

Be fair Barney, if we'd tried to pit roast the pig at the Midlands Meet it'd have drowned and washed away.

 

[British Red]

For me, judgementalism and competition (be it "harder or "better equipped" or "more minimal" or whatever) is the reason I don't do Moots etc.

Simply can't be bothered with all that snideness and critique.

I'd rather be out on my own or with a few friends just enjoying the woods than entering any form of competition

Red

 

[sandbender]

For me, judgementalism and competition.............out on my own or with a few friends just enjoying the woods than entering any form of competition

Spot on :You_Rock_

 

[Barney]

Be fair Barney, if we'd tried to pit roast the pig at the Midlands Meet it'd have drowned and washed away.

LOL, it most certainly would

 

[Nyayo]

A can of worms indeed! Unless I'm taking my boy into the woods to teach or practice, I would never even consider 'doing bushcraft' as an activity in itself! I see it as a skill set that enables me to follow a track for an extended period of time, to travel in the mountains more comfortably and to reduce my reliance on other people when out in the countryside; it's another tool (like a hat, or knowing how to find a snack) that allows me to get on withplaying and working outside. Moots are for meeting people and learning stuff - having tarped and cooked over a fire for the last few times, this year I'll probably bring a tent, a kelly, 'camping food' and some chairs...

Ede

 

[Broch]

With Nyayo there (except don't do moots); bushcraft is a toolbox you get out when you need it, it's not a way of life. I am not a 'bushcrafter' (as has been discussed in another thread) I am someone that enjoys being at one with the outdoors and nature and uses bushcraft to help me do that - sometimes with a bedroll and a knife in a wood and sometimes in a 4x4, with a campbed, and a stove in the desert. I'm not 'doing' bushcraft when I have all the gear but I'll use my bushcraft skills most days.

40 plus years and still learning; just keep learning every day

 

[Treemonk]

Interesting thread.....

has anyone noticed?

only one person has mentioned botany so far

this I think partly underlines what rain is trying to get at

 

[helixpteron]

Tarzan only needed a loincloth and a knife {fixed blade, so he'd get nicked in the UK!}.

And that Scottish guy, Rob Roy, Robbie Williams {or someone else!} only had a cave, with a little spider in it.

There you go, two fine examples of minimalist bushcrafters! (o:

 

[HillBill]

Interesting thread.....

has anyone noticed?

only one person has mentioned botany so far

this I think partly underlines what rain is trying to get at

Botany is not one of my strong points, i must admit. Tree id/uses and edibles are within my spectrum of knowledge. My partner knows the medicinal side of the subject.

 

[Broch]

Interesting thread.....

has anyone noticed?

only one person has mentioned botany so far

this I think partly underlines what rain is trying to get at

That's just one spanner in the toolbox (OK maybe an adjustable )