£250 survival knife...

[Mugen]

Hello,

Greeting to everyone it's my first post here. I'm looking for advice for a survival knife up to £250. Would like something strong for wood chopping, fire starting, carving and maybe occasional food prep.

Puukko 200, BM Bushcrafter, Fallkniven F1x Elmax is something I have my eye on.

Not sure how rust will affect Puukko 200 in the long run, and if Elmax or S30V will stand up to buttoning and not chip.

I understand there's cheaper options, but I would like to get a "nice" knife for myself and possibly stainless steel would be more favourable option to keep it look better in the long run, but have no experience with the above steels. Up to date I only used cheap knifes 440 etc. and they do rust and not as tuff. Trying to find a golden middle and not to spend fortune in pursuit of the perfect one (which don't exist).
Ideally I would like something made from Magnacut, but haven't found something that I like.

 

[C_Claycomb]

None of the knives you list are chopping knives.

If you like the Puukko, and the F1x, have you looked at Lionsteel? The M4 even comes in Magnacut…although not many handle options left by now.

Lionsteel M4 Green Micarta MagnaCut M4-MC-CVG, Knivesandtools Exclusive, fixed knife

Lionsteel M4 Green Micarta MagnaCut M4-MC-CVG, Knivesandtools Exclusive, fixed knife: null

www.knivesandtools.co.uk

Stay away from S30V for bushcraft. It doesn’t take and hold a good fine wood cutting edge. M390 is better in that regard. The Benchmade was just jumping on the wagon, and the ergonomics are not all that good either.
M4 also available in M390

Lion Steel M4 Micarta

The Lionsteel M4 Green Micarta is the epitome of a quality fixed blade knife. It is beautifully balanced, feels awesome in the hand and exudes quality.

heinnie.com

The T5 or M5 might work better for your chopping criteria.

 

[Moondog55]

I don't think that there is any one knife solution really. But a survival knife is the knife you have with you when you fall into a survival situation, otherwise it's just rough camping.
My chopper is a 15" khukri or more usually a 2.1kilo Tasmanian pattern axe from Plum USA
But recently I bought the new Victorinox Venture and I really like it despite the small size it works for most things I seem to do with a camp knife and chopping isn't one of those usual tasks. Given how paranoid about blades the UK seems to be at the moment perhaps looking at a knife you can't ever use may be pointless

 

[C_Claycomb]

I should mention, I own both a BM Puukko 200 and a Magnacut M4, and both required the edge to be ground back to a lower angle (I convexed them) in order to cut wood. So, in addition to the knife you should budget for some suitable sharpening gear. Black, blue and red DMT hones or equivalent.

My review of the Puukko 200

Calling C_Claycomb Benchmade 200 Puukko review?

Chris, i remember some time back you mentioned you were going to do a review on the Benchmade Puukko 200, i'd be very interested in your observations as i'm hovering over the buy button ( and have been for a while now )

bushcraftuk.com

 

[Mugen]

@C_Claycomb If chopping would be my only purpose maybe I would get Skrama instead or in addition smaller knife, but I would like to get something that is rather good in all areas instead of brilliant in one and in smaller package.
M4 magnacut is a very nice knife, but am I right in saying that f1x elmax, for example, due to its thickness and shape would be better in wood processing and overall stronger? I did look at few reviews and m4 is better in food processing, but I have someone who’s dealing with that and she doesn’t mind to use ikea knifes.

I have a work field sharpener and some Chinese stones, but if I will have to do reshape the blade I will get some.


@Moondog55 as always government instead of investing in a programs to keep young people busy and create opportunities to help them enter adult life just banning everything. Again Southend in the news has been yesterday…
I don’t think I go will go rough camping and hopefully won’t need to survive in the woods, but in my head Im less than Bear Grylls. Reminds me of Cedric and Ada hilarious video Guide to internet bushcraft

 

[Mugen]

I should mention, I own both a BM Puukko 200 and a Magnacut M4, and both required the edge to be ground back to a lower angle (I convexed them) in order to cut wood. So, in addition to the knife you should budget for some suitable sharpening gear. Black, blue and red DMT hones or equivalent.

My review of the Puukko 200

Calling C_Claycomb Benchmade 200 Puukko review?

Chris, i remember some time back you mentioned you were going to do a review on the Benchmade Puukko 200, i'd be very interested in your observations as i'm hovering over the buy button ( and have been for a while now )

bushcraftuk.com

I did read read it. I was strongly considering this knife and was thinking if 3v are not as rust proof and handle let moisture get under so why do i need to replace handle later on if I could get a better knife out of the box. Im guessing 3v is not times stronger than Elmax or Magnacut.

 

[gra_farmer]

I agree with @C_Claycomb the edges need sorting out, but can highly recommend the BM pukko it is really really good.....so good that I bought another as backup. the only additional recommendation is that you need to buy an aftermarket sheath, as the provided one is rubbish.

I also have the BM Bushcrafter I like it, but I don't reach for it....

As for lionsteel, pretty much recommend anything they make, really good blades, again I have the M4....I still go for the BM pukko

The Enzo trapper 95 is brilliant if you want a Scandinavian grind....if you can find it the M2 and S30v blades were amazing, I have them both and hold insane edges

 

[Herman30]

Skrama 200 for chopping.

And someting smaller for the rest, like Peltonen Sissipuukko M23.

 

[Mugen]

Is scrama still legal in UK? I did look up the recent updates and looks like it still meets what allowed. It’s just looks big…

 

[Chris]

Honestly I’ve never had any problem processing wood with a standard 4”ish bushcraft style knife of 3.5mm+, when used in combination with an axe. Wouldn’t bother with two knives just for wood chopping.

 

[Herman30]

Weight for one reason. Skrama 200 - Fiskars X7. Weight difference about 300g in favour for Skrama.

 

[hughtrimble]

Is scrama still legal in UK? I did look up the recent updates and looks like it still meets what allowed. It’s just looks big…

The 200 is fine to own, it's not impacted by the new zombie knife legislation, if that's what you're thinking of.

 

[Mugen]

Another question - by how much 3v is better in toughness compared to Elmax and if Elmax will destroy 3v in edge retention? I’ve seen one rope cutting test where 3v did 180 cut before loosing edge sharpness and Elmax did 475.(magnacut does around 600 for reference)

 

[Astrochicken]

I can't comment on the other knives that have been mentioned as I don't own them, however I do have a Lionsteel T5B in Niolox with the Micarta handle and a leather sheath (my upgrade present to myself from my basic Hultafors OK4). It's a deeper blade than other knives so I've found myself without the same degree of dexterity for fine work (although the drop-point end is surprisingly nimble), however it's very sharp and holds its edge very well. The slightly thicker blade gives me confidence for bigger woodwork and I've done batoning, some wood carving and a little food prep and it's still sharp enough to shave with. The sheath is really well made and is warming up nicely from the initially tight fit, but as online reviews have stated, it's the comfort-in-hand that's the total winner for me - it just fits really well in the hand and is a joy to use. Knife steel / shape, sheath, edge / sharpening etc are all important, but I think that comfort (and subsequently knife control) is really key to having a good experience with the knife, and a good time during the task.

 

[C_Claycomb]

Another question - by how much 3v is better in toughness compared to Elmax and if Elmax will destroy 3v in edge retention? I’ve seen one rope cutting test where 3v did 180 cut before loosing edge sharpness and Elmax did 475.(magnacut does around 600 for reference)

Sorry, I have no experience with Elmax, but...

Have you been on https://knifesteelnerds.com/? Good place for steel comparisons.

Lots of comparison videos are a long way from scientific or even consistent, and I have seen the guy on Cedric and Aider do some incredibly dumb things under the cover of imagining that they are things you do with a bushcraft knife. That comparison you quote is meaningless for steel comparison unless all three blades were identical edge and grind geometry, and heat treated to their optimum hardness.

Rope cutting has very little to do with how good a knife will be for wood working. High abrasion resistant steels tend to have high volume of carbides, which tends to lead to poor edge stability at lower angles (S30V, in my experience in 4 blades by 4 manufacturers). Magnacut is good because it has high edge stability while maintaining corrosion resistance and abrasion resistance. AEBL is not abrasion resistant in rope cutting, but has high toughness and edge stability, which allows for low angle edges and thin geometry. No chips on 12dps edges, for instance.

A thin edge will cut rope better than a thick one, but a 40 degree total edge angle on a thin blade won't carve wood worth a darn and a there is a minimum thickness behind the edge below which you won't get curls when you try to make feather sticks.

3V performance is very related to heat treat. Nathan Carothers' Delta3V is pretty incredible by all accounts, and there is a video of him hammering it through a link of chain.

 

[Mugen]

I did see this previously, but it's a bit confusing. Corrosion resistance on my newish Surge 420hc should be 8 according to graph, but after light use around house and trip to Spain where salty water wasn't involved I see already rust specs. It's always stored in a pouch and kept dry. Strange...

Corrosion resistance of 3V is 5.5 and Elmax scored 8 out of 10, so again according to the Larrin's graph 3V is a better than Elmax (same as S45VN on the graph) by quite a bit, only loosing on edge retention slightly and obviously corrosion resistance being non stainless.

I have Puukko 200 on the way and F1x Elmax was dispatched today, but I won't be keeping both unfortunately. The more I read the more I'm going down the rabbit hole.

 

[gra_farmer]

The pukko 200 is brilliant, I use mine for food preparation least once a week, a wash in the sink and wipe dry, done.

I have not noticed any rust, and I have not glued the handle, so still a little gap....I would rather water drain when put back in the sheath, have had it since 2021. Edge holding is really good, and I have elmax on two blades (that I don't use)....I have eight in 3v (all in rotation).

Chris has seen mine, I brought the V edge up a little, and cuts sooo much better than the factory edge

 

[Mugen]

The pukko 200 is brilliant, I use mine for food preparation least once a week, a wash in the sink and wipe dry, done.

I have not noticed any rust, and I have not glued the handle, so still a little gap....I would rather water drain when put back in the sheath, have had it since 2021. Edge holding is really good, and I have elmax on two blades (that I don't use)....I have eight in 3v (all in rotation).

Chris has seen mine, I brought the V edge up a little, and cuts sooo much better than the factory edge

I may leave Puukko 200 then, as it's discontinued now and play with handle scales/grind later if needed...

 

[August Landmesser]

JOE X likes the Dozyn, made in Poland by KW Knives. costs 1500 Polish zloties (about £295)

 

[C_Claycomb]

Darn, didn't know the Puukko was discontinued....buuuutttt....

Benchmade 202 Leuku Fixed Blade

The Benchmade 2020 Leuku is much anticipated, and very much worth the wait. The drop point 3V blade is full-tang, and feels surprisingly thin in the santoprene handle.

heinnie.com

still available...bigger...choppier