Granfors Froe

[launditch1]

Strange that forged would be more expensive..Surely a firewelded eye is less time to make than machining a tapered eye and then welding it on?

Sounds like a good sized froe though and a cool sheath.Happy rivin'!

 

[spamel]

Forged will be more expensive than simply welding an eye on, think of the possibilities of getting the forged piece wrong whereas a simple piece of tube cut off at the right length and welded to the blade isn't too crucial I suppose. The real issue with welded fabrication is the weakness either side of the weld. The forged version won't have this weakness. Not entirely sure how they forge their froes, but I'd imagine it is a long piece of steel folded in half, U shaped, and the eye formed around a mandrel. Then the two lengths are forge welded together, maybe with a hard piece of steel sandwiched between the two pieces of metal and the whole lot then heat treated as normal. I'd also imagine the Rockwell would be lower than the average knife, it doesn't need to be razor sharp and maintain that edge as it splits on the principle of levering the wood apart, or that's how I understand it to work. Of course, this could all be cobblers!

I'd be interested to have a go on one though, they look like a fantastic tool and would be great for splitting staves down.

 

[Dave Budd]

all correct description of the way froes are made

most modern froes are a flat bar with a single bevel (ie a straight woodlore blade) and have a tube welded to the end. They are relatively heavy and the welds either sheer off or the blade twists unless it is a better made one that has a heat treated steel blade.

Old froes were a wedge shape blade (full flat grind with convex secondary bevel), the eye being wrapped around and fire welded together. These are lighter, stronger blades that slide alongthe split more easily. the eye is more secure partly due to the forge weld but mostly due to teh fact that one side of it is a solid strip formed from the blade.

Modern/Old home made or types are often made from leaf spring wrapped around to form an eye but have a bevel ground on, so is a hybrid of the above methods. Stronger eye (especially if welded) but heavy less efficient and elegant blade.

I've not seen the GB froe up close so I don't know whether it is fire or electric welded together. My froes are the old fashioned V shaped blades with a wrapped around and electric welded eye. I do my yes that way because it is less difficult and in this instance no less strong than a forge weld. Mine are also heat treated and spring tempered (including the eye and thus the connection with the blade) so that bending and twisting won't happen even if used in silly situations

an average froe will be 10-12" blade, 2" high, 1/4" thick with a 1 1/2" diam eye. As mentioned earlier, sizes and specifics vary according to the intended use and the manufactureer

 

[dwardo]

I use my axe as a kind of froe, once the bit is driven to the end in i pull the handle down so its parallel with the log being split, then lever away.
Disclaimer, i only use this method lightly on 4 inch or so logs for splitting staves.

 

[Dave Budd]

I use my axe as a kind of froe, once the bit is driven to the end in i pull the handle down so its parallel with the log being split, then lever away.
Disclaimer, i only use this method lightly on 4 inch or so logs for splitting staves.

don't worry about it mate. When I'm preparing bowstaves for my annual bowmaking courses I start of felling a 14" diam tree (chainsaw obviously) and then reduce it to staves with a hatchet, wedges and sledge hammer I sometimes reduce further with a froe, but it's hardwork

 

[dwardo]

I tried the same on a piece of hawthorn recently, 2 axes, 2 wedges, hammer and a mallet.
2 hours later i had 2 perfectly useless staves.

 

[Dave Budd]

I tried the same on a piece of hawthorn recently, 2 axes, 2 wedges, hammer and a mallet.
2 hours later i had 2 perfectly useless staves.

been there!

hawthorn takes a lovely spiral twist sometimes there is no substitute for a bandsaw

 

[Mikey P]

Dave,

Has your mate Alex seen a bar of soap this year?

Assume charcoal burning or chimney sweeping?

 

[Dave Budd]

yes, he ran the charcoal making course for me at the weekend. I got him to do some modelling for me straight after the two of us had emptied a kiln full

 

[numbersix]

Nah - they are all friction fit (like a tomahawkk). When you think about it, each time you whale on it with a wooden maul you drive the head tighter on.

Works well

Red

I bought it because unlike most froes available the Gransfors one should in theory make the above statement correct as the handle and eye has a taper that looks like it should not shift once whacked. The handle does however slip like previous froes i have owned (Iles). Its a shame as it really annoys me! I might make my own handle as Dave Budd suggests as i have pinched my skin too and have a tendancy to swear!
Its a beautiful tool to use though. I need a sheath now having seen that one!

 

[Scoffham]

Well I got back from a days greenwood working. My first task was to make a mallet for the froe. I split both Ash and Maple with ease using the froe- Crafting a nice ash shafted maple mallet. I have found the handle binds adequately with the froe, using friction alone- the only problem I had was when I was moving the froe along a pole to propagate the split further, the handle here did come loose, I may attach the handle permanently as time goes on, but for the time being, I quite like the froe being 'collapsable' as its easier to carry in a rucksack.

Having never used a froe before I found it extremely easy to use, by the end of the day I could split foot diameter rounds of popular 4 foot long into planks. I also found directing the split to be very satisfying.

I can echo the opinion above, the granfors froe is a beautiful tool to use. Numbersix, if you'd like any advice on the sheath making just drop me a message.

R

 

[Dave Budd]

what you could do to keep it collapsable, is to drill a hole in the side of the eye. That way you can screw/pin it in place if you want it to not hurt your hand during riving, but still rtake it apart for carrying

 

[Scoffham]

Cheers Dave, Nice idea.. I was thinking about drilling a hole in the handle just above the eye, but through the eye would make for a stronger placement. When i build up enough courage (or hurt my hand when riving) i'll borrow a piller drill and do a decent job.

 

[Dave Budd]

make sure that the hole is larger than you pin though. if it's a tight fitting screw you may find it shearing

 

[jungle_re]

Dave could you pm me a price for a fixed handle froe on similar dimensions to to the GB.

Cheers Will

 

[Dave Budd]

to be honest Will, I try not to make them anymore

They do my head in

getting the blade straight, the eye in the correct orientation, the welding tidy, that combined with the fact that I'm not set up for easily heat treating a 14" bar. The last one I made before christmas almost caused a serious sense of humour failure with me, so I said never again. :sad6:

I know people who make them for sale, but to be honest they always compromise and I wouldn't want to reccomend a substandard product. All I can say is look out for a good old one or bite the GB bullet.

 

[jungle_re]

cheers for the heads up; have to see what i can find on the car boot trawl. Got lots of plans for projects got to revert the 2 hectares back to copice first though

 

[Colin.W]

Mine's a 1 piece. I was giving my home made forge a try out and being fed up of making do with a modified kitchen knife, made a small froe from a length of 2" x 3/8" flat bar. nearly all the fencing in our garden is split hazel. I've found steering the split is a mix of pulling and pushing the froe as well as putting pressure on the work into or away from the way it's splitting. not sure If that makes sense, I know what i mean

 

[Quickthorn]

Hi all.

Interesting topic..I'm looking for a second froe myself, something a lot more heavy duty than the ray Iles I have. The gransfors one looks ok, but I think I'd prefer one I've seen by Muller of Germany (I've only seen it at the woodsmiths site). The bevel on the Muller froe is convex, I believe, which I think would be better. Has anyone got/used one?

One thing that surprised me..the price of these things!! I don't mind paying for good quality tools, as I don't see this as money wasted..but I didn't expect a froe to cost over £75. Is the high cost due to the price of the steel, or are they particularly time consuming to make?

 

[Dave Budd]

they are a pain in hte whatsit to make well and as far as factories go, they are a small production run and so unit costs are higher

I had Mike Abott try a few designs out a while back. one was a flat bar with a bevel (ie easy to make and akin to most factory ones), one was a full flat taper (ie a single wedge cross section) and one was flat for the top third and then convex beveled to the edge. He concluded that once you got the hang of each one there was no difference between teh three profiles other than the full wedge was the easiest to get goin. that is one reason I have to make them that way, because I won't compramise (I'd rather not make something than make a half arsed version )

Like knives, to each their own