Responsible behaviour as the world changes.

[nigelp]

I think we have to make sure we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater here. We always cooked on arid country treks but with a great deal of care.

The major risk of using a gas appliance in these conditions is that numpties see us doing it and think they can cook with their stove which may be liquid fuelled or a wood burner. Gas does not produce sparks, or spill on the ground, or fail to completely extinguish when we've finished. The very worse that could happen is that it falls over and lights the grass next to it - but you cleared the area your cooking in didn't you?

But, I agree, so that we don't look like we're saying 'do as I say, not as I do' it's better not to cook at all in these conditions.

The campsites that are owned by Forestry England but ran on a contract to a local organisation have banned all stoves including gas stoves. For campers and campervans. Until at least Friday. That’s how they roll here in the forest!

 

[nigelp]

I think we have to make sure we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater here. We always cooked on arid country treks but with a great deal of care.

Recently bike packing I’ve been using a trangia stove with a gas adapter and a plumbers mat underneath. Zero chance of knocking it over and on a track or path or bare soil (rather than forest floor) cannot see any issues with it.

When I sneak off to my local woods I take a flask because it’s tinder dry in there.

Or a gas stove with legs attached for stability and at one small campsite I cooked on the hard standing near the toilet block to assuage the concentration of the lady owner and her dry grass.

 

[Falstaff]

"I think we have to make sure we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater here."
Unfortunately it is the babies who are bringing the stoves, barbies and fires with them, in ever greater numbers. I have seen gas stoves turned over while alight many times. Usually due to unbalanced fry pans and pots, or uneven/unsuitable ground/heather etc.
They would of course strenuously deny being a risk, ( even after a fire!) and there is no way to sort the knowledgable safe from the risky.
A blanket ban therefore seems to be the only way, at least until winter. Even autumn may not be safe.

 

[Woody girl]

Another small fire along our path into town last week. That's 3 now. ! All in 900 yards over 3 weeks.

 

[Pattree]

Two questions I think:
Who lit it?
Who put it out?

I cut my front “lawn” once a year so I had a few square yards of half meter high standing hay on Friday.

I cut it down and raked it up finishing with the rotor lawnmower to lift as much of the remainder as possible.

However there is still a fine dust/shreds left.
I experimented in our front room fireplace. It very easily takes a ferro spark!!!!

I think it was worth doing but it’s not completely solved the problem.
(Not good for the grasshoppers either)

 

[Woody girl]

Two questions I think:
Who lit it?
Who put it out?

I cut my front “lawn” once a year so I had a few square yards of half meter high standing hay on Friday.

I cut it down and raked it up finishing with the rotor lawnmower to lift as much of the remainder as possible.

However there is still a fine dust/shreds left.
I experimented in our front room fireplace. It very easily takes a ferro spark!!!!

I think it was worth doing but it’s not completely solved the problem.
(Not good for the grasshoppers either)

Your first questions, no idea, but we are presuming it was discarded cigarettes.

I finaly cut the long grass on the south facing front lawn last week. It is now a brown easily ignited area.
My gardener used a leaf blower to get rid of as much dusty debris as we could. Mine also, very sadly, no longer heaves with grasshoppers but they do have next doors shrubbery garden to escape onto.
I keep a large watering can by the front door ..just in case it's needed, but I live at the end of a cul de sac, so only one or two neighbours ever pass. Should be fine.

 

[Pattree]

I’ve got a hose reel by the back door. It can reach the cars and some of the back. It can go through the house and reach the front. It leaks but I’ll manage a wet carpet if the thing is needed.

I’ve also got 50M of hose that can reach everywhere. I bought it during that severe drought in the seventies. It started raining as we came out of the garden centre.

Perhaps I should get it out.

 

[Woody girl]

I've asked all my neighbours...Well most of them, ro keep their longest garden hoses attached to their outside taps ready to go. Most agreed, it made sense. Better safe than sorry. At least we have a chance to help control anything before the brigade arrive.

 

[Woody girl]

I’ve got a hose reel by the back door. It can reach the cars and some of the back. It can go through the house and reach the front. It leaks but I’ll manage a wet carpet if the thing is needed.

I’ve also got 50M of hose that can reach everywhere. I bought it during that severe drought in the seventies. It started raining as we came out of the garden centre.

Perhaps I should get it out.

Maybe you should. At least you would be ready to deploy should the need arise, instead of wasting time hunting for it in a shed and then connecting it up. Time wasted. Have it on the tap ready. It's a few moments preperation, hopefully not needed, but time can be of the essence in a situation.
If you can bring on the rain by getting it out, we'd be grateful!..the water hose that is!

 

[Falstaff]

No sorry, that's way too suspicious. Ciggie filters, being fibreglass, tend to survive little fires.
You either have a neighbour sneaking out of the house for a quickie roll up, or a kids/troublemaker problem.

 

[GreyCat]

I wonder if there is a social media "dare" going on?

Trailcam needed, catch the little scrotes.... unless someone is lighting and putting g out just to put the Willie's up everyone e, if so they need to stop.

I have hoses connected up to a manifold to water the different parts of the garden. Can run 3 at once, thankfully good water pressure..... wish I had a mobile bowser tho.....

GC

 

[Woody girl]

No sorry, that's way too suspicious. Ciggie filters, being fibreglass, tend to survive little fires.
You either have a neighbour sneaking out of the house for a quickie roll up, or a kids/troublemaker problem.

Ciggies filters are not made of fibre glass!
They are made of cellulose acetate a type of wood pulp. Smoking fibre glass is not a very good idea. Google it if you don't believe me. I've worked with fibre glass. Inhaling it is not a good idea. You can burn butt ends if the fire is hot enough.
Most of the kids round here vape anyway. I don't think it's someone getting a kick or following social media either. The path is too well used to be able to hang around long enough to not be seen, and I know two of the people who discovered and put them out. Always there was a man walking ahead of them, who didn't see the fire, but it was burning by the time they got to the spot. Unfortunately they were not able to identify him due to dealing with the fire, luckily, in its early stages. That goes for the last two fires. The first is still a mystery, and did more damage before it was discoverd and dealt with.

 

[slaine_23]

You can burn butt ends if the fire is hot enough

Yes indeed, as most smokers or ex-smokers can recount, as who hasn’t lit the wrong end of a cigarette after a few too many fizzy drinks?

 

[Falstaff]

Ciggies filters are not made of fibre glass!
They are made of cellulose acetate a type of wood pulp.

I stand corrected, I think at one time in the past it used to be fibreglass. The dust and fibres of which are indeed, as dangerous as asbestos. (per my chemist mates working in asbestos removal/analysis.)
As you say, the filter itself, not the sleeve, only burns at relatively high temperatures, circa 300-400 C, mainly about 370+C. In comparison, most wood stoves burn below 300, usually about 250-270 C.
My ex-arson investigator (another chemist) tells me that the butts frequently survive, and can tell them how but not who, it was started and timescales. I don't know why that is, maybe the heat rises above them as a guess.
Grass/weeds fires of the sort in your picture would never get to those temperatures, there isn't enough fuel load.

A trouble maker then,
If someone saw a person walking and not obviously stopping to start a fire, then it suggests they were dropping some form of lit & sustaining accelerant, not a ciggie. ( lots of these are possible, an unlikely (high-visibility) example would be the treated cotton wool pads we sometimes carry).

 

[Woody girl]

I don't think these fires are deliberate. As I say, the path is well used, and each fire has quickly been sorted. Talking with the two ladies that discovered and dealt with the last two fires, I have an idea that it is n old chap who chain smokes as he walks along the path. He's very doddery, and has been known to just chuck his butt ends down. Both saw a man ahead of them. The fires started soon after a "man" passedby, . we think we know who it is, but no proof as, both were more concerned with dealing with the fire, than running after someone many yards past the fire to confront them.
It's not kids.. non were around. But a man was. Apart from a wiggle around the pond, the path is quite straight, so visability is good for quite a way ahead. Which is why someone was noticed ahead, but nobody realy pays much attention to walkers way in front of them.
Anyhow, we have a damp period coming, so hopefully it won't happen again.

 

[slaine_23]

Not sure if it’s a blessing in disguise, am after coming home from a trad session in the pub with weather so filthy you’d be lucky to spark up never mind be careless enough to start a fire. Am hearing that Bordeaux direction they’re worried about the fires continuing to burn underground so still take a lot of rain for things to be really deemed safe. These were not problems 20-30 yrs ago, the carelessness of dropping a butt didn’t carry the same consequence.